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England v Fiji (RLWC warm up game) - Match thread


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2 hours ago, Mr Frisky said:

 

Just because you don't like an opinion, sometimes you have to go with the expert (Bennett) or the facts (the list of Golden Boot winners)

If Bennett rates him so highly - then great. Dolphins have plenty cash, I assume they will be happy to take him across? Nobody else in the NRL has shown any real interest in him.  Hopefully we'll see him in a Dolphins jersey, as he must be keen to test himself against tougher opposition than Huddersfield or Leigh. 

The Golden Boot, as I said, was nothing to do with being the best player in the world. It means he played well against a touring Kiwis team 4 years ago. There were hardly any international games played that year. Once he got the award, how many clubs came in for him? I think that tells us all we need to know. 

 

5 caps. 

A couple against scratch teams of foreign journeymen playing in England.

30 years old

2 WCC games (both lost)

No GB appearances.

Never played Australia

Never played Origin

Not even played 1 NRL game

Lots of games behind a StHelens pack who dominate the ball against vastly inferior opposition. 

These are facts.

Face it, the guy is a good player in the super league, and that's about it!

Edited by Madrileño
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9 minutes ago, Madrileño said:

If Bennett rates him so highly - then great. Dolphins have plenty cash, I assume they will be happy to take him across? Nobody else in the NRL has shown any real interest in him.  Hopefully we'll see him in a Dolphins jersey, as he must be keen to test himself against tougher opposition than Huddersfield or Leigh. 

The Golden Boot, as I said, was nothing to do with being the best player in the world. It means he played well against a touring Kiwis team 4 years ago. There were hardly any international games played that year. Once he got the award, how many clubs came in for him? I think that tells us all we need to know. 

 

5 caps. 

A couple against scratch teams of foreign journeymen playing in England.

30 years old

2 WCC games (both lost)

No GB appearances.

Never played Australia

Never played Origin

Not even played 1 NRL game

Lots of games behind a StHelens pack who dominate the ball against vastly inferior opposition. 

These are facts.

Face it, the guy is a good player in the super league, and that's about it!

For me I would like to know is he rating Makinson the best winger right now or career wise?

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13 minutes ago, Madrileño said:

If Bennett rates him so highly - then great. Dolphins have plenty cash, I assume they will be happy to take him across? Nobody else in the NRL has shown any real interest in him.  Hopefully we'll see him in a Dolphins jersey, as he must be keen to test himself against tougher opposition than Huddersfield or Leigh. 

The Golden Boot, as I said, was nothing to do with being the best player in the world. It means he played well against a touring Kiwis team 4 years ago. There were hardly any international games played that year. Once he got the award, how many clubs came in for him? I think that tells us all we need to know. 

 

5 caps. 

A couple against scratch teams of foreign journeymen playing in England.

30 years old

2 WCC games (both lost)

No GB appearances.

Never played Australia

Never played Origin

Not even played 1 NRL game

Lots of games behind a StHelens pack who dominate the ball against vastly inferior opposition. 

These are facts.

Face it, the guy is a good player in the super league, and that's about it!

I’m not defending or denigrating Makinson but how can you use Origin selection as one of your criteria when he’s not even eligible? How many Origins did Graham or Burgess play?

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3 minutes ago, Gomersall said:

I’m not defending or denigrating Makinson but how can you use Origin selection as one of your criteria when he’s not even eligible? How many Origins did Graham or Burgess play?

Fair enough. It was just meant as an indicator of how a player could be termed "the best in the world". 

It wasn't meant to infer that Makinson had somehow 'failed' by not playing Origin. 

I can remove that line. 

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Just now, SydneyRoosters said:

Right now. He said it like a month ago in an interview with James Graham.

I'm sorry but he ain't the best right now. No way. Bennett is the goat but he's also a proud and stubborn old man who still thinks Adam Reynolds is the best halves in the world and even you don't believe that.

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24 minutes ago, Madrileño said:

If Bennett rates him so highly - then great. Dolphins have plenty cash, I assume they will be happy to take him across? Nobody else in the NRL has shown any real interest in him.  Hopefully we'll see him in a Dolphins jersey, as he must be keen to test himself against tougher opposition than Huddersfield or Leigh. 

The Golden Boot, as I said, was nothing to do with being the best player in the world. It means he played well against a touring Kiwis team 4 years ago. There were hardly any international games played that year. Once he got the award, how many clubs came in for him? I think that tells us all we need to know. 

 

5 caps. 

A couple against scratch teams of foreign journeymen playing in England.

30 years old

2 WCC games (both lost)

No GB appearances.

Never played Australia

Never played Origin

Not even played 1 NRL game

Lots of games behind a StHelens pack who dominate the ball against vastly inferior opposition. 

These are facts.

Face it, the guy is a good player in the super league, and that's about it!

Sorry but please stop talking. I recommend you leave this website as you have little to no knowledge of the sport, that is not your fault it’s just that you need more studying. Me and other people do not have time to argue with you as you really aren’t gifted with knowledge when it comes to rugby league.

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1 minute ago, Mojo said:

I'm sorry but he ain't the best right now. No way. Bennett is the goat but he's also a proud and stubborn old man who still thinks Adam Reynolds is the best halves in the world and even you don't believe that.

I agree I don’t think Makinson is this best winger in the world but he is certainly top 5. I would lean more towards Mulitalo or Tupou though.

Edited by SydneyRoosters
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14 minutes ago, SydneyRoosters said:

I agree I don’t think Makinson is this best winger in the world but he is certainly top 5. I would lean more towards Mulitalo or Tupou though.

Add To'o to that list above Makinson. To'o joined late into the season basically was the best winger in origin. Ran a ridiculous 200m average every game in the Nrl 2nd in Post Contact meters. Did the most hit ups at 19 average 2nd was Tylan May at 16. And one of the best defensive wingers in the nrl. And than in the finals he stepped it up by running a average of 228m per game against top 8 teams in the comp. And to finish it off he ran 300m in the final more than the eels forward pack combined. I'm sorry but To'o is the best winger in the nrl that is lol

Edited by Mojo
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49 minutes ago, Madrileño said:

If Bennett rates him so highly - then great. Dolphins have plenty cash, I assume they will be happy to take him across? Nobody else in the NRL has shown any real interest in him.  Hopefully we'll see him in a Dolphins jersey, as he must be keen to test himself against tougher opposition than Huddersfield or Leigh. 

The Golden Boot, as I said, was nothing to do with being the best player in the world. It means he played well against a touring Kiwis team 4 years ago. There were hardly any international games played that year. Once he got the award, how many clubs came in for him? I think that tells us all we need to know. 

 

5 caps. 

A couple against scratch teams of foreign journeymen playing in England.

30 years old

2 WCC games (both lost)

No GB appearances.

Never played Australia

Never played Origin

Not even played 1 NRL game

Lots of games behind a StHelens pack who dominate the ball against vastly inferior opposition. 

These are facts.

Face it, the guy is a good player in the super league, and that's about it!

I’ll debunk every thing you said just for my entertainment sake. 

1. Multiple clubs have taken interest in him however he does not have interest in them, he could go to the NRL if he wants but is good at saints and feels no reason to leave.

2. No the golden boot does not make you the best player in the world nor did anyone claim that. It is awarded to the best international player of the year. There were a lot of other internationals that year however he was simply the best out of all the Australian and Kiwi players. A lot of NRL clubs came in for him after this so once again your simply wrong.

3. 5 Caps because England have played only around 5 games since he joined the squad (For reference Tedesco has had 4 caps for australia) it is has nothing to do with skill level just the fact the games have not been played.

4. Super League have around 18% foreign born players. So around 80% of The players he play against are not foreign nor are they journeymen, the title Journeymen is often given to players who change clubs on the regular usually around every 2-4 years.

5. This one confuses me. Tedesco is 29 DCE Is 33. I didn’t know being young made you a better player

6. 2 WCC games. Ok Tedesco has played 2 WCC games what’s your point.

7. GB Have played 4 Games in the last 15 years. A tour in 2019 in which Makinson was injured during therefore unable to partake.

8. Quite simple He is not Australian.

9. Also quite simple he is not from either of the Australian states NSW or Queensland. He is in fact from the County of Lancashire in The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

10. He doesn’t play in the NRL nor does he want to play in the NRL of have any interest in the NRL. Unlike Basketball rugby league does not have one top league in fact they have 2. One is not known as a bigger competition to the players they are purely different competitions of respective regions across the globe.

11.

You don’t watch the super league so it’s quite funny that you would make an opinion on a club you have never watched. St Helens got beat by the club that finished this season they are not “Vastly Inferior” to there opposition.

12.

No these are opinions

A fact is: “a thing that is known or proven to be true”
 

13. Being a good player in the super league furtherly leads you to be a good rugby league player Worldwide.

Thankyou

 

Edited by SydneyRoosters
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6 minutes ago, Mojo said:

Add To'o to that list above Makinson. To'o joined late into the season basically was the best winger in origin. Ran a ridiculous 200m average every game in the Nrl 2nd in Post Contact meters. Did the most hit ups at 19 average 2nd was Tylan May at 16. And one of the best defensive wingers in the nrl. And than in the finals he stepped it up by running a average of 228m per game against top 8 teams in the comp. And to finish it off he ran 300m in the final more than the eels forward pack combined. I'm sorry but To'o is the best winger in the nrl that is lol

That is a fair opinion. I do rate to’o he is very good Rugby player and he’s crazy run metres demonstrate that. Personally I believe Makinson is a better Overall/Allround player. But they are both very good players in there own right and I respect both opinions.

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13 minutes ago, SydneyRoosters said:

That is a fair opinion. I do rate to’o he is very good Rugby player and he’s crazy run metres demonstrate that. Personally I believe Makinson is a better Overall/Allround player. But they are both very good players in there own right and I respect both opinions.

To show you how crazy To'o's stats are Tupou, Vatuvei and Mansour at there prime at their prime ran close to 190m average once in there career. To'o has been doing it 3 years in row! To'o and Dylan Edwards are definitely very fit players! I give Panthers coaching staff credit instead of trying to change how the samoan boys play in the backs they let them play to there strengths and that's running the ball every hit up which they love to do. Not one of those backs ran under 120m average this season, no wonder why the forward pack had so much energy to dominate in the other teams. Literally every set the Panther ran 3 or 4 of those hit ups were from the backs

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34 minutes ago, Mojo said:

To show you how crazy To'o's stats are Tupou, Vatuvei and Mansour at there prime at their prime ran close to 190m average once in there career. To'o has been doing it 3 years in row! To'o and Dylan Edwards are definitely very fit players! I give Panthers coaching staff credit instead of trying to change how the samoan boys play in the backs they let them play to there strengths and that's running the ball every hit up which they love to do. Not one of those backs ran under 120m average this season, no wonder why the forward pack had so much energy to dominate in the other teams. Literally every set the Panther ran 3 or 4 of those hit ups were from the backs

Yeah To’o is class. He’ll be Samoa’s main threat out of the back field in my opinion. If I was Sneyd I’d be looking to kick early when possible to counter To’o’s Running Game. England will need to put a big focus on field position, so will Samoa as England’s backfield is also great. Dominic young almost made a Break almost every run this morning.

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We’re I do think England have a big advantage over Samoa is at fullback. Some of the stuff fullbacks do often gets overlooked by the naked eye but are extremely important in game. Setting the Defence, Setting the backfield, spotting holes in attack and other verbal work they do. The fullback is interesting position as your the only person on the field who can see everything and has wide understanding of the game so you need to make the most of it. You must have great awareness skills and be able to lead the side. Sam Tomkins fits all of those categories. It’s going to be very interesting to see how Suaalii goes and the comparison of the two fullbacks at the end of the game. It is very interesting because both of those players couldn’t be more different, one is a tactical, Experienced, Leader who will do everything right however some argue he doesn’t have the running game and pace to be able to play the position anymore. And the other one is 19 year old incredibly talented ball running winger having his first gig at the back. He will very inexperienced and will likely offer nothing or very little in verbal work nor will get too involved in luai and Milford’s backline plays. like I said they couldn’t be more opposite.

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1 hour ago, SydneyRoosters said:

We’re I do think England have a big advantage over Samoa is at fullback. Some of the stuff fullbacks do often gets overlooked by the naked eye but are extremely important in game. Setting the Defence, Setting the backfield, spotting holes in attack and other verbal work they do. The fullback is interesting position as your the only person on the field who can see everything and has wide understanding of the game so you need to make the most of it. You must have great awareness skills and be able to lead the side. Sam Tomkins fits all of those categories. It’s going to be very interesting to see how Suaalii goes and the comparison of the two fullbacks at the end of the game. It is very interesting because both of those players couldn’t be more different, one is a tactical, Experienced, Leader who will do everything right however some argue he doesn’t have the running game and pace to be able to play the position anymore. And the other one is 19 year old incredibly talented ball running winger having his first gig at the back. He will very inexperienced and will likely offer nothing or very little in verbal work nor will get too involved in luai and Milford’s backline plays. like I said they couldn’t be more opposite.

Agree 💯. I think mostly everyone will be watching how Suaali'i goes at fullback. But it'll definitely be a good first test for him against England. It's gonna be a good match and I can't for kick off

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3 hours ago, Madrileño said:

If Bennett rates him so highly - then great. Dolphins have plenty cash, I assume they will be happy to take him across? Nobody else in the NRL has shown any real interest in him.  Hopefully we'll see him in a Dolphins jersey, as he must be keen to test himself against tougher opposition than Huddersfield or Leigh. 

The Golden Boot, as I said, was nothing to do with being the best player in the world. It means he played well against a touring Kiwis team 4 years ago. There were hardly any international games played that year. Once he got the award, how many clubs came in for him? I think that tells us all we need to know. 

 

5 caps. 

A couple against scratch teams of foreign journeymen playing in England.

30 years old

2 WCC games (both lost)

No GB appearances.

Never played Australia

Never played Origin

Not even played 1 NRL game

Lots of games behind a StHelens pack who dominate the ball against vastly inferior opposition. 

These are facts.

Face it, the guy is a good player in the super league, and that's about it!

Think its been said plenty if times Saints have turned down offeres from the NRL for him.

You do realise a club like Saints can pay more than peanuts dont you.

You really don't like the fact an English man won the golden boot do you.

Edit to say.....that 100 posts is getting very close now....

Edited by Mr Frisky
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42 minutes ago, Mojo said:

Thoughts on Ligi Sao as the replacement for Leilua? I haven't watched much of him in the SL lately but I highly doubt he'll get any game time against the top nations. Probably will against France and greece

Another out and out prop to add to the collection, that's 9 middle forwards now in a 24-man squad - absolutely dire team selection.

Leaves Jaydn Su'a and Kelma Tuilagi as the only actual edge backrowers in the squad, can't really fathom that decision at all. 

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1 minute ago, UTK said:

Another out and out prop to add to the collection, that's 9 middle forwards now in a 24-man squad - absolutely dire team selection.

Leaves Jaydn Su'a and Kelma Tuilagi as the only actual edge backrowers in the squad, can't really fathom that decision at all. 

Yup very questionable call. Tuilagi and Sua are 80mins second rows so they must be counting on that alone. But it's a very big risk

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1 minute ago, Mojo said:

Yup very questionable call. Tuilagi and Sua are 80mins second rows so they must be counting on that alone. But it's a very big risk

I'm going to assume RFM has rejected coming over to the WC as Tuilagi wouldn't have made the squad if he was available, to be fair to Samoa they've got very unlucky with their backrow stocks. 18 months ago you would've had Leilua, Su'a, Nanai, Luki, RFM and Schuster all on the depth chart - injury, opting out and bolting into the Kangaroos has really hurt them here. 

Still no reason to not pick Mata'utia as another legit backrower but they've had a tough time.

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So, reflecting back on the game yesterday, here are the things I would take as positives.

1. The zero against the opposition.  The English defense was well organised and effective.  No big hits, just very controlled with a number of players in every tackle.

2. Similarly, the kick chase was also very disciplined which will be a key factor in the games against Samoa and Tonga on our side of the draw.

3. The kicking game of Sneyd, Williams and Welsby was also good.

4. Welsby injecting himself into the plays proves the key in multiple tries.  He needs to play.  But where?

5. The middles were solid and will be better when we add Knowles and Oledzki. 

6. The backline could actually be very good.  Farnworth and Watkins are big centres and if we have Makinson and Young on the wings, their pace and carries will be very effective.

7. 50-0 is a hell of a lot better than England 14-15 Italy.

Edit to add.  And as DavidM reminded me, Ackers had a very good game at 9 - good distribution and some dangerous runs.

Edited by Dunbar
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"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

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This may have already been discussed in the thread, but anyone know why this wasn’t an official test and why caps weren’t awarded? 
 

Edit - and on the HYS on the bbc article about the match there’s someone called Vichy trapping off about how crud RL is and referencing the losers on this TRL forum 😂

Edited by Eddie
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11 minutes ago, Eddie said:

This may have already been discussed in the thread, but anyone know why this wasn’t an official test and why caps weren’t awarded? 
 

Edit - and on the HYS on the bbc article about the match there’s someone called Vichy trapping off about how crud RL is and referencing the losers on this TRL forum 😂

Similar to the other warm up matches and the PMXIIIs game both sides took extended benches/unlimited interchanges which is obviously outside of RL International rules.

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6 hours ago, Madrileño said:

If Bennett rates him so highly - then great. Dolphins have plenty cash, I assume they will be happy to take him across? Nobody else in the NRL has shown any real interest in him.  Hopefully we'll see him in a Dolphins jersey, as he must be keen to test himself against tougher opposition than Huddersfield or Leigh. 

The Golden Boot, as I said, was nothing to do with being the best player in the world. It means he played well against a touring Kiwis team 4 years ago. There were hardly any international games played that year. Once he got the award, how many clubs came in for him? I think that tells us all we need to know. 

 

5 caps. 

A couple against scratch teams of foreign journeymen playing in England.

30 years old

2 WCC games (both lost)

No GB appearances.

Never played Australia

Never played Origin

Not even played 1 NRL game

Lots of games behind a StHelens pack who dominate the ball against vastly inferior opposition. 

These are facts.

Face it, the guy is a good player in the super league, and that's about it!

So your justification as to why an England international is not a good player is because he hasn't played Origin.... FFS.

45 posts to go....

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