RLWC Attendance-O-Meter

[Anita Bath]

4 hours ago, The Masked Poster said:

A model that tinpot businesses like Ticketmaster seem to use. But not behemoths like the RLWC. 

Why not get real? If people aren't going to attend something, it's probably better to get "not arsed" people in to fill those spaces. Who knows, they might like what they see. 

I'm talking about desperate measures because we seem to be in desperate measures territory. 

That would allow you to ditch your advanced sales team and save more money because everyone will wait for the free ticket rush.

RLWC have had my ticket money banked for over 2 years. Why would I bother in future? Wait to see what the weather is like, what else is on, whether there is a train strike, what the cost of living is…….etc

Advance sales are about locking people (and their money) in. To divert any of that to later sales is a financial risk you dont want to take.

Afraid something like cook islands v samoa on a Tuesday in Doncaster (as an example) would not get me out of my chair even if it was free.

 

[Yakstorm]

3 hours ago, JohnM said:

Which ticketing engine is the RLWC 2021 site using? Any idea?

It's a solution provided by Ticketmaster, clearly one that can be branded and put behind your own Identity Management platform.  Arguably, considering they are using Ticketmaster for allocation / distribution / etc, they possibly should have also allowed people to buy directly through the TM UK site.

Sure they wouldn't have collected as much information and it wouldn't have been branded, but in the interest of selling seats, its better to give people as many options as possible.

[gingerjon]

10 hours ago, The Masked Poster said:

If people aren't attending does it ultimately matter if it was packed out with people on freebies?

Yup. It really would.

[Eddie]

5 hours ago, JohnM said:

Which ticketing engine is the RLWC 2021 site using? Any idea?

Whichever is the cheapest.

[JohnM]

1 hour ago, Yakstorm said:

It's a solution provided by Ticketmaster, clearly one that can be branded and put behind your own Identity Management platform.  Arguably, considering they are using Ticketmaster for allocation / distribution / etc, they possibly should have also allowed people to buy directly through the TM UK site.

Sure they wouldn't have collected as much information and it wouldn't have been branded, but in the interest of selling seats, its better to give people as many options as possible.

...so are the problems some have experienced down to Ticketmaster or have they been introduced at the request of the World Cup organisers?

[Spidey]

3 minutes ago, JohnM said:

...so are the problems some have experienced down to Ticketmaster or have they been introduced at the request of the World Cup organisers?

You’re buying off “World Cup 2021” so they take responsibility- if they’re using a sub standard contractor, That’s still on them

[The Masked Poster]

5 hours ago, Anita Bath said:

That would allow you to ditch your advanced sales team and save more money because everyone will wait for the free ticket rush.

RLWC have had my ticket money banked for over 2 years. Why would I bother in future? Wait to see what the weather is like, what else is on, whether there is a train strike, what the cost of living is…….etc

Advance sales are about locking people (and their money) in. To divert any of that to later sales is a financial risk you dont want to take.

Afraid something like cook islands v samoa on a Tuesday in Doncaster (as an example) would not get me out of my chair even if it was free.

 

You seem to think I'm suggesting we do it as an actual policy of informing people there will be free tickets, I'm not. I'm asking why if big concerts can give away freebies at the last minute rather than have empty seats, why is it verboten for RL to use it as a last minute desperate measure to get bodies on the ground? 

42 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

Yup. It really would.

And I disagree. Did *you* know that Ticketmaster occasionally give away free tickets? I certainly didn't but apparently it's a thing. And I wasn't advocating advertising it as "RLWC in 2025 - get your free tickets here". It would be more of a last minute word of mouth thing (via SM) if a game was clearly going to be poorly attended. 

You seem happy to know that the RLWC will continue with half empty stadia except for a few games. Which it will, and the next internationals ....and the next....

But yeah, half empty grounds are better than having then full of non commited people who were there out of curiosity on a freebie. 

[gingerjon]

8 minutes ago, The Masked Poster said:

It would be more of a last minute word of mouth thing (via SM) if a game was clearly going to be poorly attended. 

Would be all over the RL media within seconds and that would be the end of the World Cup as a credible tournament.

[Dave T]

11 hours ago, RigbyLuger said:

We haven't had a crowd at any game smaller than the lowest at the Women's Euros have we? That was with much more hype, more budget and lower prices 

This is a bizarre measure by any standards to try and convince ourselves we are doing well, but:

Their lowest was 3.8k, ours is 3.7k (so far). 

Their highest is higher than our highest. 

Their average is higher than our average. 

Their total is higher than our total. 

[Yakstorm]

1 hour ago, JohnM said:

...so are the problems some have experienced down to Ticketmaster or have they been introduced at the request of the World Cup organisers?

Some of the issues maybe related to the piece of Ticketmaster software that the organisers licensed, though from the issues I've seen people raise (ie. Login / Sign up issues and Page failure issues) they relate to the identity management solution the RLWC2021 have rolled out over the top and the hosting they are using. 

From a marketing side, I can understand why the organisers went down the route of a branded sales site, especially in the early days before sales started ramping. ( Better for data collection, re-targeting ads, brand recognition and you can do things like hide seat selectors / etc). However from a technical side it hasn't worked out and looks like the fact they went with cheap hosting & and a cheap Identity Access Management tool has contributed to that.

Ticketmaster, despite all their flaws, have built a highly scalable ticket selling website and app, which millions in the UK alone use regularly and are familiar with.  Why you would pay to get them to provide ticketing and then not leverage that experience and functionality, especially when they first started seeing issues, is surprising. 

[Just Browny]

1 hour ago, Dave T said:

This is a bizarre measure by any standards to try and convince ourselves we are doing well, but:

Their lowest was 3.8k, ours is 3.7k (so far). 

Their highest is higher than our highest. 

Their average is higher than our average. 

Their total is higher than our total. 

I wouldn't agree on the hype front either. The level of 'hype' on the BBC has been extremely comparable to date: obviously the further the women's team got in the competition the more it increased, so we will see what happens in the coming weeks.

I'm struggling to get too excited about this weekend's fixtures, beyond Samoa v France which I hope will be a good game if the French can avoid their usual trick of falling three scores behind and then waking up. A weekend to win back some credit with the family before the knockout stages.

[Dave T]

8 minutes ago, Just Browny said:

I wouldn't agree on the hype front either. The level of 'hype' on the BBC has been extremely comparable to date: obviously the further the women's team got in the competition the more it increased, so we will see what happens in the coming weeks.

I'm struggling to get too excited about this weekend's fixtures, beyond Samoa v France which I hope will be a good game if the French can avoid their usual trick of falling three scores behind and then waking up. A weekend to win back some credit with the family before the knockout stages.

I'm looking forward to the games, but in a similar way to all the other games I've looked forward to. The England game is one I'll watch but probably least interesting. 

I'm looking forward to PNG, Tonga, Samoa in particular to see whether/how they progress. 

[ehbandit]

Just tried to buy tickets for the final, the website won’t let me I also had trouble trying to buy for the group games. Never mind, I’ll watch on TV the ticketing procedure is a farce

[Cowardly Fan]

2 hours ago, The Masked Poster said:

And I wasn't advocating advertising it as "RLWC in 2025 - get your free tickets here". It would be more of a last minute word of mouth thing (via SM) if a game was clearly going to be poorly attended. 

You seem happy to know that the RLWC will continue with half empty stadia except for a few games. Which it will, and the next internationals ....and the next....

But yeah, half empty grounds are better than having then full of non commited people who were there out of curiosity on a freebie. 

There are benefits to pushing free or discounted tickets last minute, but social media is absolutely the worst way of doing this. Quickly widely known & does long-term damage to your early sales for future events. 

I don't think anyone is happy with having half empty grounds, but there are challenges in how to fill it. Not to mention price is only one component - many wouldn't go for free, we have a challenge to make enough curious or open to it. 

[Northern Eel]

1 hour ago, ehbandit said:

Just tried to buy tickets for the final, the website won’t let me I also had trouble trying to buy for the group games. Never mind, I’ll watch on TV the ticketing procedure is a farce

How many tickets were you trying to buy? Which category. You can't buy 4 seats together in any category below C, as they are already sold.

[ehbandit]

23 minutes ago, Northern Eel said:

How many tickets were you trying to buy? Which category. You can't buy 4 seats together in any category below C, as they are already sold.

1 adult 1 child, cat D

Edited October 27, 2022 by ehbandit

[Northern Eel]

2 minutes ago, ehbandit said:

1 adult 1 child, 

Which category? The lowest two categories have been (apparently) sold out for a while. A couple of days ago there were some £60 safe standing tickets too, but they have gone also, I think. 

[Tommygilf]

4 hours ago, Dave T said:

This is a bizarre measure by any standards to try and convince ourselves we are doing well, but:

Their lowest was 3.8k, ours is 3.7k (so far). 

Their highest is higher than our highest. 

Their average is higher than our average. 

Their total is higher than our total. 

I'm glad you found that out rather than me having to look! Was the point I was going to make

[Yakstorm]

Anyone have any idea how England v Greece is tracking at Sheffield?

[ehbandit]

5 minutes ago, Northern Eel said:

Which category? The lowest two categories have been (apparently) sold out for a while. A couple of days ago there were some £60 safe standing tickets too, but they have gone also, I think. 

Cat D. I was wanting the £60 ticket and the £30 child.

[The Masked Poster]

4 hours ago, gingerjon said:

Would be all over the RL media within seconds and that would be the end of the World Cup as a credible tournament.

No, it absolutely wouldn't. Just like most people don't know about these free gig tickets. All it would need would be a bit of discretion and planning...so yeah maybe not. 

[Northern Eel]

1 minute ago, ehbandit said:

Cat D. I was wanting the £60 ticket and the £30 child.

Ah, bad luck. Looks like there are only single tickets left in that category now.

[JonM]

On 25/10/2022 at 21:13, The Ghost of 99 said:

The first women's game will be interesting to keep an eye on as an example of how misleading and/or annoying the ticketing website is.

As of now there are no seats remaining on sale apart from singles. Will that translate into full seating areas on gameday? 

Just been on to buy my tickets for the Tonga vs Cooks game at Middlesbrough on Sunday. Was very pleased to find that I can now buy two seats for the women's double header at Headingley on Tuesday, which wasn't possible yesterday.

So, on the one hand, perhaps someone found a problem and it's been sorted out overnight, which is good. OTOH, it does mean that it's probably not the case that the stands are nearly sold out, which was another possible explanation.

 

[The Masked Poster]

1 hour ago, Cowardly Fan said:

There are benefits to pushing free or discounted tickets last minute, but social media is absolutely the worst way of doing this. Quickly widely known & does long-term damage to your early sales for future events. 

I don't think anyone is happy with having half empty grounds, but there are challenges in how to fill it. Not to mention price is only one component - many wouldn't go for free, we have a challenge to make enough curious or open to it. 

And how long do we go on just saying "there are challenges to filling the stadiums" without actually doing anything about it? Because we could be having this same conversation anytime in the last few decades and probably will be doing so at the 2033 WC. 

Maybe what I suggested is a load of bobbins, ok. But the alternative seems to be arguing about devaluing a tournament that is already being devalued by poor attendances. So something needs to change sometime. But it probably won't. 

[Dave T]

24 minutes ago, The Masked Poster said:

And how long do we go on just saying "there are challenges to filling the stadiums" without actually doing anything about it? Because we could be having this same conversation anytime in the last few decades and probably will be doing so at the 2033 WC. 

Maybe what I suggested is a load of bobbins, ok. But the alternative seems to be arguing about devaluing a tournament that is already being devalued by poor attendances. So something needs to change sometime. But it probably won't. 

There is no solution for this tournament. The strategy has been set and been implemented. They are not changing it. We'll get the results we get now. And that will be lower attendances than 2013. We just need to crack on.