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Sat 5th Nov: RLWC: England v Papua New Guinea KO 14:30


Who will win?  

62 members have voted

  1. 1. Who will win?

    • England by 13 points or more
      42
    • England by 7 to 12 points
      13
    • England by 1 to 6 points
      2
    • Papua New Guinea by 1 to 6 points
      3
    • Papua New Guinea by 7 to 12 points
      1
    • Papua New Guinea by 13 points or more
      1

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  • Poll closed on 05/11/22 at 15:00

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7 hours ago, Chrispmartha said:

Brian ‘for our viewers at home’ noble

 

(who else does he think he’s commentating to?)

Are we sure he hasn’t got Tourette’s?
Surely somebody has to say something to him. Does he think the rest of the time he’s just chatting to Dave sat next to him? As verbal ticks go, it’s weird as f***

Apparently this site says I "won the day" here on 23rd Jan, 19th Jan, 9th Jan also 13th December, whatever any of that means. Anyway, 4 times in a few weeks? The forum must be going to the dogs - you people need to seriously up your game. Where's Dutoni when you need him?

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2 hours ago, Hello said:

I watched the game about an hour late on iplayer without knowing the score.  After about 15 minutes I started fast-forwarding a bit as it became another very uncompetitive match.  I've got to say that I was very disappointed - I wanted England to win, but in a close and compeititive match with plenty of promise for PNG's future. Unfortunately, I feel a bit down about the lack of progress in countries outside the "big 3", also being very disappointed about France's efforts.  Personallly I would be much more excited seeing progress in PNG and France towards being potential tournament winners than in the small island nations, as PNG and France have decent populations sizes and proper domestic teams, not relying on nearly pure heritage teams.  It's been very good to see generally pleasing viewing figures for the tournament in comparison to past tournaments, but I cant help feeling a bit flat after another one-sided capitulation by what should be a nation working towards challenging the best.

We've seen a lot of totally uncompetitive games in this world cup with teams who don't really belong at this level getting absolutely whacked in little more than an opposed training session. This wasn't that. PNG aren't an elite international team but they are a competent one as they showed in the second half. England, for 30 minutes, played flawless rugby league. Everything they tried worked and PNG were hit by a whirlwind. Any team would have struggled to live with that. I know it maybe wasn't the best for the neutral but sometimes you've just got to take your hat off to a sublime performance. PNG showed progress in their group games imo. They could easily have beaten a heavily fancied Tonga. It was just 30 minutes of the highest quality from England.

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19 minutes ago, MZH said:

We've seen a lot of totally uncompetitive games in this world cup with teams who don't really belong at this level getting absolutely whacked in little more than an opposed training session. This wasn't that. PNG aren't an elite international team but they are a competent one as they showed in the second half. England, for 30 minutes, played flawless rugby league. Everything they tried worked and PNG were hit by a whirlwind. Any team would have struggled to live with that. I know it maybe wasn't the best for the neutral but sometimes you've just got to take your hat off to a sublime performance. PNG showed progress in their group games imo. They could easily have beaten a heavily fancied Tonga. It was just 30 minutes of the highest quality from England.

I get where you're coming from, it was indeed a very good performance from England and it's my bad that I didn't say so in my original post, fair play to them.  Nonetheless, I was very dissapointed by the total inability of PNG to compete, as I was last week with France, and am pretty underwhelmed by the development of the sport.  I think having a competitive PNG and/or France would be great for the sport and would have a knock on effect of attracting other nations around the world to the sport if they were to see an increase in the number of top level countries competing.  Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be any sign of that (I don't see island nations with tiny populations and heritage teams as a serious help to credibility of the game).  

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2 hours ago, Hull Kingston Bronco said:

Are we sure he hasn’t got Tourette’s?
Surely somebody has to say something to him. Does he think the rest of the time he’s just chatting to Dave sat next to him? As verbal ticks go, it’s weird as f***

I think he's doing it just to wind people up at this stage. He's adopted it as his trademark phrase. You could hear Woods half sighing, half laughing at one point today when Nobby used it.

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10 hours ago, graveyard johnny said:

not a convincing 2nd half at all - need to keep up the intensity much better against aus or nz 

Totally agree- second half score went to England 8-6 and they were very clunky in attack. Also Tonga could be added to your intensity comment.

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5 hours ago, Hello said:

I get where you're coming from, it was indeed a very good performance from England and it's my bad that I didn't say so in my original post, fair play to them.  Nonetheless, I was very dissapointed by the total inability of PNG to compete, as I was last week with France, and am pretty underwhelmed by the development of the sport.  I think having a competitive PNG and/or France would be great for the sport and would have a knock on effect of attracting other nations around the world to the sport if they were to see an increase in the number of top level countries competing.  Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be any sign of that (I don't see island nations with tiny populations and heritage teams as a serious help to credibility of the game).  

It was only 3 years ago that PNG carved up GB, winning by 18 points. Sure, PNG got hurt by a couple of injuries at the beginning of the tournament but the reality is that this is a very good England side, I don't think it's unfair to say that some of these young talents emerging during the tournament will be looked upon very favourably at the end of their careers.

The Hunters have brought PNG quite far in a short period of time, they've had a very tough run throughout the pandemic and the consequential relocation, paired with a coach who has done a very questionable job with the sides development in the last couple of years. That coach has now left after last season and the Hunters managed to return home for their final match of the year so from this point forward that pathway should begin returning to normal. There's reports that a few of this WC's Kumuls are set to earn trial contracts with NRL clubs off the back of this tournament and the Dolphins have now established a pathway with the Hunters that will see 4 players given a pre-season train and trial contract with 2 remaining for the entire season. Things are moving in the right direction for PNG, schoolboys pathways have begun to be established within the country and the next step will be introduction of a junior rep side into the QRL systems to expose younger players to NRL clubs.

Fiji are also primarily a domestic side, they've been the most depleted by injuries and other circumstances of any side within this tournament but they just managed to push the top ranked side in the world in the WC QF. Notwithstanding the current FNRL/Silktails issues that pathway is already looking as if it will be more successful than the Hunters have been in getting more domestic Fijians through to NRL squads. The rewards of this pathway will only really start to come into fruition by France 2025 with a significant difference a reasonable expectation by the time 2029 rolls around, genuine work to establish pathways to first-grade for developing nations takes time but we've got two well on their way to closing that gap.

 

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1 hour ago, UTK said:

It was only 3 years ago that PNG carved up GB, winning by 18 points. Sure, PNG got hurt by a couple of injuries at the beginning of the tournament but the reality is that this is a very good England side, I don't think it's unfair to say that some of these young talents emerging during the tournament will be looked upon very favourably at the end of their careers.

The Hunters have brought PNG quite far in a short period of time, they've had a very tough run throughout the pandemic and the consequential relocation, paired with a coach who has done a very questionable job with the sides development in the last couple of years. That coach has now left after last season and the Hunters managed to return home for their final match of the year so from this point forward that pathway should begin returning to normal. There's reports that a few of this WC's Kumuls are set to earn trial contracts with NRL clubs off the back of this tournament and the Dolphins have now established a pathway with the Hunters that will see 4 players given a pre-season train and trial contract with 2 remaining for the entire season. Things are moving in the right direction for PNG, schoolboys pathways have begun to be established within the country and the next step will be introduction of a junior rep side into the QRL systems to expose younger players to NRL clubs.

Fiji are also primarily a domestic side, they've been the most depleted by injuries and other circumstances of any side within this tournament but they just managed to push the top ranked side in the world in the WC QF. Notwithstanding the current FNRL/Silktails issues that pathway is already looking as if it will be more successful than the Hunters have been in getting more domestic Fijians through to NRL squads. The rewards of this pathway will only really start to come into fruition by France 2025 with a significant difference a reasonable expectation by the time 2029 rolls around, genuine work to establish pathways to first-grade for developing nations takes time but we've got two well on their way to closing that gap.

 

I tend to agree regarding this England side, they’ve been ruthless against Fiji, Samoa & PNG when in the past I’d expect all 3 to trouble them or at least keep it reasonably close. From an outsider’s point of view they seem to have that “something” that I haven’t seen an England team have in my time watching the International game. Whether they can convert that to a World Cup win is another thing but I’m more confident than I’ve ever been that they can do it.

PNG are improving albeit not as fast as I think could be possible but things are falling in to place. The link with Dolphins will hopefully see a few “Olam” stories over the next few years, Simbiken has a full time contract with them as well. I really think the golden ticket for PNG is a team in the QRL junior comps, do you have any info on that being in the pipeline or did you just mean you think it’s the logical next step?

Fiji could have been better this tournament if they didn’t have so many injuries & withdrawals which is a real shame. Imagine how different it could have been today with Ravalawa, Lovodua, Montoya, Milne, Blake, Saifiti brothers, Tariq Sims etc in the side. Either way there seems to be an ever increasing trickle of Fijian talent in to NSW Cup, QLD Cup & NRL sides, hopefully that trickle can become a flow in coming years.
 

France in particular and most other nations need a lot of work and help in the next few World Cup cycles but PNG & Fiji are definitely looking promising so it’s not all doom & gloom. A return of the Oceania Cup would be great and hopefully it’s on the horizon.

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6 minutes ago, jim_57 said:

I tend to agree regarding this England side, they’ve been ruthless against Fiji, Samoa & PNG when in the past I’d expect all 3 to trouble them or at least keep it reasonably close. From an outsider’s point of view they seem to have that “something” that I haven’t seen an England team have in my time watching the International game. Whether they can convert that to a World Cup win is another thing but I’m more confident than I’ve ever been that they can do it.

PNG are improving albeit not as fast as I think could be possible but things are falling in to place. The link with Dolphins will hopefully see a few “Olam” stories over the next few years, Simbiken has a full time contract with them as well. I really think the golden ticket for PNG is a team in the QRL junior comps, do you have any info on that being in the pipeline or did you just mean you think it’s the logical next step?

Fiji could have been better this tournament if they didn’t have so many injuries & withdrawals which is a real shame. Imagine how different it could have been today with Ravalawa, Lovodua, Montoya, Milne, Blake, Saifiti brothers, Tariq Sims etc in the side. Either way there seems to be an ever increasing trickle of Fijian talent in to NSW Cup, QLD Cup & NRL sides, hopefully that trickle can become a flow in coming years.
 

France in particular and most other nations need a lot of work and help in the next few World Cup cycles but PNG & Fiji are definitely looking promising so it’s not all doom & gloom. A return of the Oceania Cup would be great and hopefully it’s on the horizon.

No current information on a Hunters youth team but there is a basis for the suggestion, at the start of 2020 a Hunters u20s side was either approved or well along the way to getting approved by the QRL for an entry into their Colts competition in 2021. Obviously we all know what happened during 2020 and the consequential seasons so those plans were shelved as QRL comps were disbanded and the Hunters then relocated to participate upon resumption of QCup. Haven't seen any further suggestions around the subject but that's also understandable on account of the Hunters still being located in Australia this season, hopefully these plans can be readopted as the club returns to normality from next season onwards. 

The Silktails for Fiji have been very successful so far in creating opportunities for their players, I saw the other day that Ipswich Jets have signed 6 of the 2022 squad to their QCup side for 2023, the close alignment with the Roosters has seen players cross over to their pathways as well which is a positive.

Some of the recent comments from Abdo re the end of season International window IMO seemed to foreshadow the Oceania Cup as the priority for the NRL, certainly comments around their focus being fostering RL in our own part of the world seem to reinforce that. I too believe for us that has to be the priority, there's too many quality and improving sides in the SH now to allow the emerging pacific nations calendar to be dictated by a rotating tournament as the 4N was. If we get a consistent Oceanic Cup that rebuilds a competitive image of International RL then we can begin developing a competition that is attractive to broadcasters and consumers in the SH, just as importantly we now have guaranteed sellouts or at the very least a financially attractive following for Tonga/Samoa in Auckland and PNG in Port Moresby. Then we can fit tours to the NH and NH sides touring the SH where possible to supplement the OCup as the basis of that calendar.

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8 minutes ago, UTK said:

If we get a consistent Oceanic Cup that rebuilds a competitive image of International RL then we can begin developing a competition that is attractive to broadcasters and consumers in the SH, just as importantly we now have guaranteed sellouts or at the very least a financially attractive following for Tonga/Samoa in Auckland and PNG in Port Moresby. Then we can fit tours to the NH and NH sides touring the SH where possible to supplement the OCup as the basis of that calendar.

" attractive to broadcasters and consumers..." do that and the sky`s the limit on many fronts.

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1 hour ago, UTK said:

No current information on a Hunters youth team but there is a basis for the suggestion, at the start of 2020 a Hunters u20s side was either approved or well along the way to getting approved by the QRL for an entry into their Colts competition in 2021. Obviously we all know what happened during 2020 and the consequential seasons so those plans were shelved as QRL comps were disbanded and the Hunters then relocated to participate upon resumption of QCup. Haven't seen any further suggestions around the subject but that's also understandable on account of the Hunters still being located in Australia this season, hopefully these plans can be readopted as the club returns to normality from next season onwards. 

The Silktails for Fiji have been very successful so far in creating opportunities for their players, I saw the other day that Ipswich Jets have signed 6 of the 2022 squad to their QCup side for 2023, the close alignment with the Roosters has seen players cross over to their pathways as well which is a positive.

Some of the recent comments from Abdo re the end of season International window IMO seemed to foreshadow the Oceania Cup as the priority for the NRL, certainly comments around their focus being fostering RL in our own part of the world seem to reinforce that. I too believe for us that has to be the priority, there's too many quality and improving sides in the SH now to allow the emerging pacific nations calendar to be dictated by a rotating tournament as the 4N was. If we get a consistent Oceanic Cup that rebuilds a competitive image of International RL then we can begin developing a competition that is attractive to broadcasters and consumers in the SH, just as importantly we now have guaranteed sellouts or at the very least a financially attractive following for Tonga/Samoa in Auckland and PNG in Port Moresby. Then we can fit tours to the NH and NH sides touring the SH where possible to supplement the OCup as the basis of that calendar.

Thanks, I was sure I remembered reading they were planning for a junior side pre-covid, glad I haven’t imagined that.

I read that Abdo quote and it certainly sounded like a revival of the Oceania Cup was their main idea. Hopefully if that is the case the top tier is either 4 or 6 and the 2nd tier can be expanded or a 3rd tier created to include the likes of South Africa, Phillipines and other Pacific Islands like Solomon Islands or Vanuatu.
 

Meanwhile I’ve made no secret of my preference to see a full Northern Hemisphere comp featuring all the European regulars including full strength England with Lebanon, Jamaica, USA etc split over 2/3 tiers at the same time. I’m not really sure what the other option is for England if the Oceania Cup goes ahead. If it’s in the 3 team format then maybe then can tour and try and get games against teams on their bye week.

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12 hours ago, Jinking Jimmy said:

“Kate enjoyed a giggle with England’s prop Sam Tomkins”. 
A very versatile player our Sam.

Well they do say that if you play Rugby League for long enough you’ll end up in the front row

Nigel Bell started as a winger, made his debut as a scrum half but ended his career at prop. Then there’s the best centre ever to play the game who spent his last few years as a prop

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Having watched the game back I thought England were really clinical in the first half and I was impressed with the attack. I do think the dominance had as much to do with PNG played particularly poorly than England playing well. I was really surprised with how often the PNG defence was going one on one in tackles (particularly up against Burgess, which is madness) allowing one tackler to be bumped off and the other defenders being slow to join. For me that's not England beating them to the chase it's absolutely shambolic defending. It was like defenders were doing their own thing rather than defending as a unit.

I'm pretty confident about this England side though. Good balance all across the park. The outside backs look strong, Williams and Welsby definitely our best halfback pairing. I think the front row has been impressive and Burgess, Hill and Cooper should be nailed on for the next game. The only change I'd be tempted to make is Thompson for Lees, who I thought was a bit ineffective in both attack and defence. 8 missed tackles is a lot for that sort of game and I think he's too intent on putting in a shot rather than wrapping up the man.

The only slight disappointment for me is Bateman has been the only second row to impress. Not that the others have necessarily played badly, but we certainly haven't seen the best of them.

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On 05/11/2022 at 17:21, StandOffHalf said:

Her Royal Highness probably prefers upper class sports like badger-baiting and fox-hunting.

FFS I wish people wouldnt post this type of tosh... they are not sports... every time this is debated we are educated by people who know more about this than us oyks on how they are actually essential ways to control populations of animals and to keep farmers safe.. it is the upper classes, once more, helping us and making sure the country isnt over run by Wiley foxes and cunning badgers (i mean it would be nice to see them deal with the ridiculous behaviour of toads but i am sure they will do this at some point... poop poop!)

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