Australia's lost aura

[Martyn Sadler]

My lament for the Kangaroos.

[Damien]

I do think regularity helped with this and the fact you knew they would be touring again in 4 years. I do also think the length of time they would tour and the mid-week games helped too.

[latchford albion]

The first time I ever saw Mal Meninga, Peter Stirling, Brett Kenny, Laurie Daley, Wayne Pearce etc. etc. was on a Kangaroo tour.  Today I can watch the best of the NRL on a weekly basis so the surprise isn't there at the moment in the same way.  Couple this with the disregard the Aussies appear to have for the international game and we're left with half empty stadia for their games in this World Cup.

[Dave T]

I sort fo agree with the general point of the post, but we do also need to be careful of romanticising past times. 

If I look at 1986, the Kangaroos played Hull KR in front of 6.8k, at Cumbria in front of 4.2k, Hull FC 8k, and 3 tests of 50k, 30k and 20k. For balance, games against Leeds and Wigan drew 30k.

[MatthewWoody]

"And unfortunately the Australians do nothing to help get it back.". → Totally agree with the article. 

 

[Jughead]

Some bits there that really lack relevance. All Blacks and Twickenham prices aren’t really relevant or really comparable to rugby league and Australia. 

They’re definitely still a big draw, as there’s been a lot of anticipation for the latter rounds of the tournament and the possibility of Australia v Fiji, Australia v NZ and possibly Australia v England/Tonga/Samoa in the final. I think people want to see games with some jeopardy to them, a lot of games in this tournament and certainly Australia games haven’t had that until the knockout stages.

Ticket prices, apathy towards them for the way people some feel about their decision last year, the irregularity of them playing on these shores and competitive nature (or lack of) of their games will have played some part in people’s decision not to watch Australia this time around. 

The proposed 2020 Ashes a year before the planned 2021 tournament could have played a significant factor in people’s decision making when it come to games and tickets but sadly, that never happened. 

Edited November 10, 2022 by Jughead

[iangidds]

Seems like we in the Northern hemisphere are to blame , we have done nothing for the international game for a long long time.

Attendees are sliding along with participation year on year , the powers that be in both countries should be ashamed at what they have not done.

[Dave T]

Just now, iangidds said:

Seems like we in the Northern hemisphere are to blame , we have done nothing for the international game for a long long time.

Attendees are sliding along with participation year on year , the powers that be in both countries should be ashamed at what they have not done.

That just isn't true Ian. 

[The Masked Poster]

1 minute ago, Jughead said:

Some bits there that really lack relevance. All Blacks and Twickenham prices aren’t really relevant or really comparable to rugby league and Australia. 

 

How are they not relevant? They illustrate that people will pay top whack prices to see premium sports teams. Often it was stuff like the Harlem Globetrotters, things that ordinarily people might not bother with but will do for famous, glamorous teams. (Whatever the sport) 

[WN83]

They’ve lost more than an aura, in my book, they’ve lost respect. The arrogance and contempt they’ve shown the International game has been a scandal. The ignorance I see on a regular basis towards anything to do with British Rugby League from people across the game over there is embarrassing. 
 

I’m not glad (because I’d have liked bigger crowds across the board) but I’m not gutted either, that the Aussie games haven’t pulled in bigger crowds than any of the other teams games. Why should people spend their hard earned going watching a side that is here simply because they couldn’t wiggle out of it this time? I’ve been to numerous games in the tournament but I had no interest in going to any of the Australian games and will only see them in the flesh should they make the final. 

In short, I’ve had enough of their BS. I’d go all Kevin Keegan and speak about how I’d love it if we beat them but I’m not daft, I still acknowledge they’re an exceptional group of players and as well as we’ve been playing, that would be tough to do. 

[Jughead]

1 minute ago, WN83 said:

They’ve lost more than an aura, in my book, they’ve lost respect. The arrogance and contempt they’ve shown the International game has been a scandal. The ignorance I see on a regular basis towards anything to do with British Rugby League from people across the game over there is embarrassing. 
 

I’m not glad (because I’d have liked bigger crowds across the board) but I’m not gutted either, that the Aussie games haven’t pulled in bigger crowds than any of the other teams games. Why should people spend their hard earned going watching a side that is here simply because they couldn’t wiggle out of it this time? I’ve been to numerous games in the tournament but I had no interest in going to any of the Australian games and will only see them in the flesh should they make the final. 

In short, I’ve had enough of their BS. I’d go all Kevin Keegan and speak about how I’d love it if we beat them but I’m not daft, I still acknowledge they’re an exceptional group of players and as well as we’ve been playing, that would be tough to do. 

What’s your opinion on England playing made up teams instead of northern hemisphere nations like France?

[IM2]

said this a week ago. NRL and ARL have thrown away the global brand that is the Kangaroos. 

[Welshleaguelover]

1 minute ago, WN83 said:

In short, I’ve had enough of their BS. I’d go all Kevin Keegan and speak about how I’d love it if we beat them but I’m not daft, I still acknowledge they’re an exceptional group of players and as well as we’ve been playing, that would be tough to do

That is the way forward to be fair.

Get England and NZ players calling them out. Call them a bunch of cowards for wanting a year off.

It might even build a rivalry with the Australian public and your average NRL fan might get behind the kangaroos again.

[WN83]

2 minutes ago, Jughead said:

What’s your opinion on England playing made up teams instead of northern hemisphere nations like France?

Well I don’t go to those games and I don’t watch them on TV, so that tells you everything. We’re not perfect, I get that but there have been fixtures against the French and our league doesn’t call the tune regards what numerous countries can do about playing fixtures. 

[MatthewWoody]

While, as I said, I agree with most of the article, we must say "we" (England, Super League, etc.) have been part of the problem. 
Being almost never able to beat them produced an effect. 
In addition to this, Origin is seriously better in a lot of aspects (crowds, tv ratings, rivalry, etc.). 

About when the article says: 
 

Quote

When they are over here they do very little to promote their own presence, they do little to promote the World Cup and they generally present an uninteresting and uninspiring face to the world. You might think, if they were serious about enhancing the value of the Kangaroos, that they would be in constant touch with the media in all its forms to get their players in front of cameras. But they don’t.

It's certainly true. I remember in 2017 Italy always had social meeting and commitments (visiting school, etc.) and did the same this year (I say Italy cause I know them, but the same can be said about other teams). I don't know if Aus did the same this WC. 
It seems to me now Australia - for those of you who are familiar with basketball, maybe not so many given basketball is not very huge in the UK - participate to the Int game just like US do in basketball: if they win, it's a relief, but it's not as important as it used to be. 
England are not better than they were in 2000 and 2008. They got to the SF and almost beat NZ in 2013, they were finalists very very close to Aus in 2017, won the series vs NZ in the time between World Cups, almost beat Aus in 4N, etc. If (if...) England win this and wins it beating Australia, well, a new rivalry will start. 

[Mumby Magic]

Personally I think it's just what we need before a world cup semi final. Ffs

[Dunbar]

I have made a number of posts on the profile of the Kangaroos.

But one that we British Rugby League fans must accept is that we haven't provided the competition that Australians crave in English/British rivalry with their teams.  The fact that a lot of the Australian posters on here want Emgland to win the World Cup for 'the good of the game' speaks absolute volumes.  They should hate us (in sporting terms) and love to beat us. The fact they don't is mostly our own doing.

And before anyone says they should invest in playing us anyway... well, I kind of agree but it is hard to justify when we have France on our doorstep and our choice is to play the 'Combined Nations All Stars' because they will give us a better game. 

That is the biggest act of disrespect on the international calendar. 

Edited November 10, 2022 by Dunbar

[gingerjon]

3 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

That is the biggest act of disrespect on the international calendar. 

A loud agree

[MatthewWoody]

7 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

I have made a number of posts on the profile of Kangaroos.

But one that we British Rugby League fans must accept is that we haven't provided the competition that Australians crave in English/British rivalry with their teams.  The fact that a lot of the Australian posters on here want Emgland to win the World Cup for 'the good of the game' speaks absolute volumes.  They should hate us (in sporting terms) and love to beat us. The fact they don't is mostly our own doing.

And before anyone says they should invest in playing us anyway... well, I kind of agree but it is hard to justify when we have France on our doorstep and our choice is to play the 'Combined Nations All Stars' because they will give us a better game. 

That is the biggest act of disrespect on the international calendar. 

spot on. 
I won't demonize the Combined Nations concept, but it shouldn't be the only game England are playing. 

Edited November 10, 2022 by MatthewWoody

[Mattrhino]

1 hour ago, Martyn Sadler said:

My lament for the Kangaroos.

There not even a dot of what they were even 10 years ago Slater, Cronk, Smith, Thurston, Inglis and Lockyer. 

They have no one close to these players now.

[Dave T]

If we look at the major Test matches since 2010, the most frequent games are:

Aus v NZ (22 Inc tomorrow) 

Eng v NZ (14)

Eng v France (11)

France would also have played England and other top nations more had they not been so poor that they actually lost 2 qualifiers for 4N that was pretty much designed to make France the 4th team when staged in Europe. 

I'm all for boosting those numbers, but that's because I think we should play a hell of a lot more internationals overall, but let's not feel to sorry for France in this. 

[Jughead]

17 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

I have made a number of posts on the profile of the Kangaroos.

But one that we British Rugby League fans must accept is that we haven't provided the competition that Australians crave in English/British rivalry with their teams.  The fact that a lot of the Australian posters on here want Emgland to win the World Cup for 'the good of the game' speaks absolute volumes.  They should hate us (in sporting terms) and love to beat us. The fact they don't is mostly our own doing.

And before anyone says they should invest in playing us anyway... well, I kind of agree but it is hard to justify when we have France on our doorstep and our choice is to play the 'Combined Nations All Stars' because they will give us a better game. 

That is the biggest act of disrespect on the international calendar. 

Since the 2013 tournament, England have played New Zealand nine times and their record is W5 D0 L4 PF152 PA150 with games that have ended 20-14, 18-16, 16-17, 20-14 and 14-16 and that’s without mentioning the 2013 semi-final score. 

England have also beaten Samoa (three times), Tonga, PNG and Fiji in that time period and have lost two of three games against Australia in that period. 

What more would you like England to do on field that’s would apparently satisfy the Australians? 

The three biggest and best nations having a history of games that, largely, are close encounters should be enough for more of these games and not allegedly having to prove themselves to play games. 

[Dunbar]

17 minutes ago, Jughead said:

Since the 2013 tournament, England have played New Zealand nine times and their record is W5 D0 L4 PF152 PA150 with games that have ended 20-14, 18-16, 16-17, 20-14 and 14-16 and that’s without mentioning the 2013 semi-final score. 

England have also beaten Samoa (three times), Tonga, PNG and Fiji in that time period and have lost two of three games against Australia in that period. 

What more would you like England to do on field that’s would apparently satisfy the Australians? 

The three biggest and best nations having a history of games that, largely, are close encounters should be enough for more of these games and not allegedly having to prove themselves to play games. 

I am not disagreeing with anything you say.

But I started watching Rugby League in 1984 and I have never seen England or Great Britain defeat Australia in a series or final / knockout game of a tournament. 

So that means Australians hasn't seen us beat them in a meaningful game in that time.  It really is no wonder they switched off caring about playing us.

We can state as many results as we like but the fact that some Australian Rugby League fans want England to win is all we need to know.

Hopefully things will change.  I hope they do.

[redjonn]

59 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

I.....

And before anyone says they should invest in playing us anyway... well, I kind of agree but it is hard to justify when we have France on our doorstep and our choice is to play the 'Combined Nations All Stars' because they will give us a better game. 

That is the biggest act of disrespect on the international calendar. 

Just on the France part. I get the argument but their is an issue.

Is that France with all the Catalan players or France without.   It is a problem to have a competitive game if France can't have many Catalan players. Even if England also won't be full strength without the NRL players.

Edited November 10, 2022 by redjonn

[WN83]

The Aussies started backing away from International Rugby League a long time ago. At the time, granted we weren’t winning series, but I find it difficult to compare them not wanting to play internationals against us (or pretty much anyone), with us not playing enough against France. In three match test series we won tests over the years and more often than not they needed to work their backsides off for series wins. Compare that to England games against France, with us consistently putting big scores on them and them not winning a test against the England in donkeys years and it doesn’t compare like for like.
 

I’m not saying our stance is right, I can’t stand the combined All Stars game and I think we should commit to travelling to France in every mid season for the foreseeable but the Australians aren’t just pulling away from internationals because teams don’t compete with them. They’ve done it because they’re happy to take the insular view that the NRL and Origin is thriving, so why should we bother! Especially when bothering means their players don’t get a longer rest.