Dunbar Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 17 minutes ago, Madrileño said: Not according to the captain of England. (edited for clarity as dkw is posting confused emojis) Which part of Tomkins saying he 'would have' been the best can you not understand. He is talking about what could have been over the last 10 years, not what would happen today. 2 "The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby. "If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madrileño Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Dunbar said: Which part of Tomkins saying he 'would have' been the best can you not understand. He is talking about what could have been over the last 10 years, not what would happen today. "I think Owen would be the best player in Super League" 19 seconds in. Clear as day. What part can you not understand? Edited November 23, 2022 by Madrileño 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunbar Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 Just now, Madrileño said: "I think Owen would be the best player in Super League" What part do you not understand? Listen to the whole thing. He is clearly talking about Farrell as a Super League player over the last 10 years, he makes that abundantly clear. It's not even as though I am arguing that Farrell wouldn’t have been a very good Rugby League player, I agree with him. But he is not suggesting that Farrell would be the best today. If you see that clip in its entirety and come to that conclusion then you are wrong. 1 "The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby. "If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkw Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 This is genuinely hilarious 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 17 minutes ago, dkw said: This is genuinely hilarious i've already ordered a shirt with his name on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madrileño Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 (edited) 23 minutes ago, Dunbar said: He is clearly talking about Farrell as a Super League player over the last 10 years, he makes that abundantly clear. He says if Farrell had played over the last 10 years, he would be the best player ever in Super League. He clearly says at the start that Farrell would be the best player IN the Super League if he came. I don't know enough about Farrell as a player to comment, but I do know that most people would struggle to name the best player in Super League right now - quality is at an all time low, so I will believe the England captain. I think he knows what he is talking about. Edited November 23, 2022 by Madrileño 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Stottle Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 1 hour ago, Leonard said: Leigh fans moan about thread hijacking. Leigh fans hijack thread. Who's moaned about thread Hijacking? I only said if you want to talk about union do it on the cross code platform. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunbar Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, Madrileño said: He clearly says at the start that Farrell would be the best player IN the Super League if he came. No, he doesn't say that. He says Owen would be the best player in Super League "every single year". This clearly means that if he was a League player rather than a Union player he would be the best. It is a statement that is saying if Farrell had chosen League he would have been the best. I don't know if you can't understand this or won't but I just don't care enough to bother any more. Edited November 23, 2022 by Dunbar "The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby. "If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RP London Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 1 hour ago, Madrileño said: TBF, there is a big difference between "looking at his union career" and people going on about "10 and 12 for the all blacks....Jeremy Guscott and Tuilagi" It has degenerated into a load of nonsense about union, instead of some technical detail around Owen Farrell. (He's not moving, BTW). whatever... we're just having a discussion.. if it deserves to be moved it will get moved thats what the Mods are here for. The discussion is around Farrell, whether he could or not and part of that is whether he is capable which then brings a discussion around where he is playing, how is he playing, are the issues a coaching issue/other players etc etc etc... as i say I dont care where it is its a discussion and the Mods will do what they feel is right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RP London Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 1 hour ago, Dunbar said: No, he doesn't say that. He says Owen would be the best player in Super League "every single year". This clearly means that if he was a League player rather than a Union player he would be the best. It is a statement that is saying if Farrell had chosen League he would have been the best. I don't know if you can't understand this or won't but I just care enough to bother any more. right at the beginning of the clip (which is a union show for union people and Tomkins knows that) Big Jim says "a young owen farrell".. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunbar Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 1 minute ago, RP London said: right at the beginning of the clip (which is a union show for union people and Tomkins knows that) Big Jim says "a young owen farrell".. Exactly. The part about Farrell is obviously a 'what could have been' discussion. I mean Tomkins literally says he is the best League player of the last 10 years despite not playing the game. That is a bit of hyperbole, maybe because it is a Union show, but Farrell had everything a player needs to make it as a top top League player. "The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby. "If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ELBOWSEYE Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 53 minutes ago, Madrileño said: He says if Farrell had played over the last 10 years, he would be the best player ever in Super League. He clearly says at the start that Farrell would be the best player IN the Super League if he came. I don't know enough about Farrell as a player to comment, but I do know that most people would struggle to name the best player in Super League right now - quality is at an all time low, so I will believe the England captain. I think he knows what he is talking about. Players present and former don't always have the best opinions so just because sam says it doesn't make it a fact. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATLANTISMAN Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 Who is this guy? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RP London Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 16 minutes ago, ELBOWSEYE said: Players present and former don't always have the best opinions so just because sam says it doesn't make it a fact. you mean, different people might have different opinions... well blow me down.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madrileño Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 25 minutes ago, ELBOWSEYE said: Players present and former don't always have the best opinions so just because sam says it doesn't make it a fact. You are correct. It doesn’t. However when I see guys in their 60s who have never even played League pontificating on a forum about a pro athlete's abilities, I am definitely going to believe the high performance athlete and pro player who is currently captain of England! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RP London Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 4 minutes ago, Madrileño said: You are correct. It doesn’t. However when I see guys in their 60s who have never even played League pontificating on a forum about a pro athlete's abilities, I am definitely going to believe the high performance athlete and pro player who is currently captain of England! and when you stop assuming you know people on a forum.. then we may all listen to you.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WN83 Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 (edited) Impossible to say how he'd go. In terms of publicity it would be great but I'd rather spend big money on current league players. I think the Tomkins comments were from an honest spot but I always look at Owen Farrell and think 'too small for the pack' and 'too slow for the backs' but If he'd played the game over a long period of time, I guess he would have played a role similar to Kevin Sinfield of mixing between loose forward and halfback and controlling his side. I wouldn't be surprised if this happened one day but even though he's 31 now and some would think that's too late, I still think it maybe in another couple of years. Andrew Farrell apparently said at a recent club function that Owen's plan has always been to play out his last few years in league but things change. Edited November 23, 2022 by WN83 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barnyia Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 He'll come over to league and do his apprenticeship for a year or two and go back to union and be a great coach using the things he learnt in league Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 4 hours ago, Harry Stottle said: Who's moaned about thread Hijacking? I only said if you want to talk about union do it on the cross code platform. Proof perfect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davo5 Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 9 hours ago, Derwent said: Unlike a lot of RU backs who have made the move to RL the lad can actually tackle and is very good defensively. I think centre would be his natural position in RL. I agree,he has the ability to be a really good centre but at 31 I would have to question his desire/motivation to make the switch after such a long distinguished Union career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midlands hobo Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 20 hours ago, ShropshireBull said: He would get smashed and be out half way through the season, not half the player his dad was. Off the field would be a huge boost for the game. His transferability to RL now is poor. He wouldn't move when he is only a year or two off topping the all points scorer table. His dad incidentally was a total bust as an RU player. Too old and never really fit in, too slow for an outside centre and got found out too small for inside centre and no instinct to play backrow. (In RU back rows are born not trained you either have the instinct or don't) the only players who transfer well between the codes generally are fullbacks and wingers. The exceptions are SBW and Brad thorn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graveyard johnny Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 if I was lucky enough to be a rugby league legend and achieve all the great things in the game and spawned any offspring that showed even the slightest interest in RU I would have them given up for adoption to fred and rose west 2 see you later undertaker - in a while necrophile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exiled Wiganer Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 11 hours ago, Leonard said: Apologies if this is cross code forum. Like I say - my knowledge is limited. But the Aussies can never muster a pack but can at the drop of the hat muster a back like that will finish chances no problem. We need 3 chances to score one and will look for contact. Usually athletes shoe horned into being backs, rather than natural "rugby" players. That seems to have not changed in 40 years. On the flip side - the Aussies can't make forwards. Of course NZ manage both. I agree that from afar Jones seems to be a relic. The sort of coach who will always make games that should not be close, close - due to tactics. Like Southgate, always concerned about the opposition. What on earth? Australia have a wonderful pack of forwards. They never stop. I thought England looked better close to the line in this WC, though we did bomb too many chances in the semi. Who this Jones? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exiled Wiganer Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 8 hours ago, Madrileño said: TBF, there is a big difference between "looking at his union career" and people going on about "10 and 12 for the all blacks....Jeremy Guscott and Tuilagi" It has degenerated into a load of nonsense about union, instead of some technical detail around Owen Farrell. (He's not moving, BTW). God - you’re still infesting the site? We need vichies on here like Leigh needs a train station. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Welshleaguelover Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 Nathan Cleary is what Owen Farrell would have been as a league player. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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