Jon Wilkin

[GUBRATS]

2 minutes ago, Tippytoe said:

He's Thoughtful Witty Intelligent and True. 

Or TWIT for short.

Or Thoughtful Witty Annoying and True 

Edited March 4 by GUBRATS

[Stanley30]

If it bothers people that much, just turn the sound off, watch the match and shut the eff up whinging about it all the time. Jeez

[Gomersall]

8 hours ago, GUBRATS said:

Or Thoughtful Witty Annoying and True 

He will have his own website Soon. Wilkinballs. A couple from Friday. “Leeds clung in”. “He has blood in his lungs”. Or words to that effect. 

[johnh1]

8 hours ago, Stanley30 said:

If it bothers people that much, just turn the sound off, watch the match and shut the eff up whinging about it all the time. Jeez

I do that already. Be great if they could find a way to have the crowd noise though.

[Oxford]

In defence of Jon : his bit on the wheelchair game for the Beeb was excellent and his utterings do achieve a level of media interest and fan involvement that might be focussed elsewhere. So his startegy of filling the emptiness is very effective.

[GUBRATS]

8 hours ago, Stanley30 said:

If it bothers people that much, just turn the sound off, watch the match and shut the eff up whinging about it all the time. Jeez

But how can I listen to Barry Mac then ?

[Oxford]

Just now, GUBRATS said:

But how can I listen to Barry Mac then ?

I had already thought of this and all you need is a recording of the last time each of the two teams played each other, play it at the same time and you'll barely notice any difference apart from the injured and banned players scoring of course.

 

[daz39]

I think Sky do it on purpose, they tell their 'lads' to be annoying then scour message boards to see how annoying they're perceived by the fans, then continually ram them down our throats, sit back and laugh at us knowing they've 'done' us again with yet another one.

[Dave T]

23 hours ago, Dunbar said:

No, that's not my point, I am not assuming anything.  Of course Myler could well have been hurt... he probably was, it was a big head shot.

The point is that if players these days don't stay down in televised games to 'win' a penalty then it wouldn't be an issue.

This may not have been the right incident for Wilkin to call our gamesmanship in our sport but overall I am OK with him doing it.

I do think sometimes this is overstated, although I don't necessarily disagree with your point, I feel a touch mixed on it. 

Let's be honest, players are in huge collisions many times a game, they could easily stay down after many tackles, but they are under pressure for a quick PTB. 

However, when they have had foul play (crusher, smack to the mush, late hit), then I think they have every right to not jump to their feet in a sprightly manner. And in most cases where players stay down, they do get a penalty. An 18stone forward leaning on your neck (even if it looks mild) is likely to hurt a fair bit. 

We appear to have turned this onto the victims a little too much, and it's led to silly things like guilty players resorting to dragging players to their feet. The offender in probably 90%+ of those cases is the tackler. 

Edited March 5 by Dave T

[GUBRATS]

3 minutes ago, Dave T said:

I do think sometimes this is overstated, although I don't necessarily disagree with your point, I feel a touch mixed on it. 

Let's be honest, players are in huge collisions many times a game, they could easily stay down after many tackles, but they are under pressure for a quick PTB. 

However, when they have had foul play (crusher, smack to the mush, late hit), then I think they have every right to not jump to their feet in a sprightly manner. And in most cases where players stay down, they do get a penalty. An 18stone forward leaning on your neck (even if it looks mild) is likely to hurt a fair bit. 

We appear to have turned this onto the victims a little too much, and it's led to silly things like guilty players resorting to dragging players to their feet. The offender in probably 90%+ of those cases is the tackler. 

I don't recall so much sympathy for Jamie Acton when Greg Bird committed a foul and then played ' dead ' to avoid being sent off ? 

 

[Dunbar]

7 minutes ago, Dave T said:

I do think sometimes this is overstated, although I don't necessarily disagree with your point, I feel a touch mixed on it. 

Let's be honest, players are in huge collisions many times a game, they could easily stay down after many tackles, but they are under pressure for a quick PTB. 

However, when they have had foul play (crusher, smack to the mush, late hit), then I think they have every right to not jump to their feet in a sprightly manner. And in most cases where players stay down, they do get a penalty. An 18stone forward leaning on your neck (even if it looks mild) is likely to hurt a fair bit. 

We appear to have turned this onto the victims a little too much, and it's led to silly things like guilty players resorting to dragging players to their feet. The offender in probably 90%+ of those cases is the tackler. 

That is all reasonable.

But from my perspective, the things I find frustrating in Rugby League (and other sports for that matter) didn't appear overnight. We didn't go from competitive scrums to rolling the ball to the loose forward overnight or players stepping over the ball at the play the ball.  We arrived where we are now by being tolerant to every small change.

I don't like the look of other sports where simulation is seen as a skill and it is only the referee at fault if a player is successful. 

Do we have a big problem with gamesmanship today?  No, of course not.  But should we set the standards that we want to adhere to moving forward.  Absolutely, yes.

[GUBRATS]

3 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

That is all reasonable.

But from my perspective, the things I find frustrating in Rugby League (and other sports for that matter) didn't appear overnight. We didn't go from competitive scrums to rolling the ball to the loose forward overnight or players stepping over the ball at the play the ball.  We arrived where we are now by being tolerant to every small change.

I don't like the look of other sports where simulation is seen as a skill and it is only the referee at fault if a player is successful. 

Do we have a big problem with gamesmanship today?  No, of course not.  But should we set the standards that we want to adhere to moving forward.  Absolutely, yes.

Spot on , coaches will push every tiny rule to the limit , where the RFL and the refs commissioner should be proactive is in identifying these little ' cheats ' early on , and clamping down ( after telling the clubs and coaches ) on them before they become an acceptable part of the game 

Tell the coaches to stick to coaching the good things about the game , if you try to make the game harder to officiate , then suffer the consequences , " you have been warned " 

[Dave T]

23 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

I don't recall so much sympathy for Jamie Acton when Greg Bird committed a foul and then played ' dead ' to avoid being sent off ? 

 

He didn't deserve any. 

[Dave T]

15 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

That is all reasonable.

But from my perspective, the things I find frustrating in Rugby League (and other sports for that matter) didn't appear overnight. We didn't go from competitive scrums to rolling the ball to the loose forward overnight or players stepping over the ball at the play the ball.  We arrived where we are now by being tolerant to every small change.

I don't like the look of other sports where simulation is seen as a skill and it is only the referee at fault if a player is successful. 

Do we have a big problem with gamesmanship today?  No, of course not.  But should we set the standards that we want to adhere to moving forward.  Absolutely, yes.

I suppose my challenge is that it isn't simulation. On the vast majority of incidents around this we see a player has been hit in the face, or had their neck leant on. 

I think the narrative has become too far in favour of the aggressor, even to the point that a commentator is criticising a player for playacting, and then the replay shows that he has been hit off the ball with a shoulder to the jaw. 

There does appear to me more ire aimed at players who have just been illegally hit. 

[GUBRATS]

1 minute ago, Dave T said:

He didn't deserve any.

Probably not , but in the context of Wilkins comment , it is the most flagrant example of his point I can recall 

[Dunbar]

3 minutes ago, Dave T said:

I suppose my challenge is that it isn't simulation. On the vast majority of incidents around this we see a player has been hit in the face, or had their neck leant on. 

I think the narrative has become too far in favour of the aggressor, even to the point that a commentator is criticising a player for playacting, and then the replay shows that he has been hit off the ball with a shoulder to the jaw. 

There does appear to me more ire aimed at players who have just been illegally hit. 

I didn't say it was simulation in our sport, I said gamesmanship. 

But I strongly believe that if we continue down this line of players realising they are able to influence referee and video referee decisions then I don't believe that simulation is very far away.

[Dave T]

26 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

I didn't say it was simulation in our sport, I said gamesmanship. 

But I strongly believe that if we continue down this line of players realising they are able to influence referee and video referee decisions then I don't believe that simulation is very far away.

Hasn't there been a tweak in the rules around VR involvement (only allowed to comment if yellow or above)? Or is that an NRL thing. I have it in my head for some reason. Maybe tweaks are needed. 

[Dave T]

36 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

Probably not , but in the context of Wilkins comment , it is the most flagrant example of his point I can recall 

At the risk of going over a 5 year old debate, I disagree. I really don't think we can go down the route of accusing players of not being hurt. It's a dangerous game. 

It's perfectly possible for somebody to hurt themselves committing foul play. 

[GUBRATS]

32 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

I didn't say it was simulation in our sport, I said gamesmanship. 

But I strongly believe that if we continue down this line of players realising they are able to influence referee and video referee decisions then I don't believe that simulation is very far away.

As I put 

Gregg Bird , we already have it 

[gingerjon]

10 hours ago, Stanley30 said:

If it bothers people that much, just turn the sound off, watch the match and shut the eff up whinging about it all the time. Jeez

A whinge about whinging is always my favourite kind of whinge.

[GUBRATS]

3 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

A whinge about whinging is always my favourite kind of whinge.

Are you whinging about it ? 

[gingerjon]

1 minute ago, GUBRATS said:

Are you whinging about it ? 

I am wryly observing it over a nice cup of coffee.

Quite, quite, different.

[Dunbar]

11 hours ago, Stanley30 said:

If it bothers people that much, just turn the sound off, watch the match and shut the eff up whinging about it all the time. Jeez

As I read this, I pictured those snooker commentators from David Mitchell and Robert Webb.

[GUBRATS]

3 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

I am wryly observing it over a nice cup of coffee.

Quite, quite, different.

Keep it up , the less we hear from you the better

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

16 hours ago, Futtocks said:

I doubt it...

 

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...would take that long.

Yep.....people like change then hate them...

Familiarity breeds contempt