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IMG Grading Unveiled


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8 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

They are investing because the money is now available , no other reason , and you know it 

I agree. There has been investment under every structure we've had. If all it needed was focused minds, theyd have done it during Licensing. 

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1 hour ago, Harry Stottle said:

Depends if all the gentle tweaks are designed or engineered in a particular direction, above is a post re Toulouse aiming (hoping - more like) for a Garde A, as it stands at the moment they are nowhere near deserving that accolade.

IYO Harry , IYO 

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Just now, Dave T said:

I agree. There has been investment under every structure we've had. If all it needed was focused minds, theyd have done it during Licensing. 

Dave, I was involved in the various arrangements for Wakey first buying back the ground and then the current redevelopment. 

Ask Mr Carter or Mr Minards their opinion on why they were doing it, and why the Council became so forthcoming with support in recent years, and its because they believed that without the improvements they would be thrown out of the League when a non straight p/r structure returned. 

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1 hour ago, gingerjon said:

Turns out if you can go up without addressing those things though then they don't get addressed.

As, to be blunt, the present state of the London Broncos pretty much attests.

This is a key point. It's a case study that we should spend a bit more time on. David Hughes has spent >£25m keeping London Broncos going for the last 20 years. Almost all of that in players wages and rent. The long-term result has been marginal so far at best. I bet there isn't one single person in this discussion who couldn't think of a more effective way of spending £25m on rugby league in London, leaving a more sustainable platform. The new IMG model is at least a step in the right direction, telling ambitious owners with the means to invest "do these things which are more important to the sport than your own clubs league results this season, and we will reward you".

If we'd had that framework in the the early 2000's, maybe I'd have been able to persuade the club to spend Henry Paul's wage on marketing, instead of an over-the-hill fullback who might help us win a few games but wouldn't improve the organisation for the long term. That was quite literally a conversation that took place. 

How can that not be progress? 

 

Apparently this site says I "won the day" here on 23rd Jan, 19th Jan, 9th Jan also 13th December, whatever any of that means. Anyway, 4 times in a few weeks? The forum must be going to the dogs - you people need to seriously up your game. Where's Dutoni when you need him?

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1 hour ago, GeordieSaint said:

No they really shouldn’t.

The likes of 2 x Hull clubs will likely have a B grade. But are substantially bigger and stronger clubs than anything in the Championship. Or Castleford or Wakefield. They should absolutely not be graded the same. That’s why there is a scoring system with grade boundaries.

Let's have 36 grades then 

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1 minute ago, Tommygilf said:

Dave, I was involved in the various arrangements for Wakey first buying back the ground and then the current redevelopment. 

Ask Mr Carter or Mr Minards their opinion on why they were doing it, and why the Council became so forthcoming with support in recent years, and its because they believed that without the improvements they would be thrown out of the League when a non straight p/r structure returned. 

Why didn’t they think this when Widnes, leigh, Salford, Warrington and Saints were threatened with expulsion because of their ground? 

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1 hour ago, Hull Kingston Bronco said:

Of course they're not, neither are the mighty Rervers. But now we know what counts towards it we can start doing stuff to get there, and I like that more stuff than "blow your owner's cash on a load of Aussies" is the stuff we're now incentivised to do eh.

So glad there are non running about in Rervers jumpers.

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16 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

So glad there are non running about in Rervers jumpers.

Being able to see the flaws in a system your own club benefits from is surely a positive, rather than a negative? 

Apparently this site says I "won the day" here on 23rd Jan, 19th Jan, 9th Jan also 13th December, whatever any of that means. Anyway, 4 times in a few weeks? The forum must be going to the dogs - you people need to seriously up your game. Where's Dutoni when you need him?

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3 hours ago, NW10LDN said:

Saints are in Merseyside and can reach into Liverpool. Warrington is its own borough with more than 200,000 people. Widnes are next door and they may be taken into account.

How exactly can St Helens reach into Liverpool?  What makes you think that Liverpudlians will ever care about a club which represents one of Liverpool's suburbs?

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21 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Dave, I was involved in the various arrangements for Wakey first buying back the ground and then the current redevelopment. 

Ask Mr Carter or Mr Minards their opinion on why they were doing it, and why the Council became so forthcoming with support in recent years, and its because they believed that without the improvements they would be thrown out of the League when a non straight p/r structure returned. 

But that backdrop has been around for decades. Wire used the same arguments when campaigning for theirs. I expect every other development has had this basis as part of the discussions for the last 30 years. 

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23 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

Let's have 36 grades then 

Even if we did it in the Russian alphabet we'd still be 3 letters short. The only viable option would be Cambodian, and how many people in Wigan or Leeds speak that?

 

Apparently this site says I "won the day" here on 23rd Jan, 19th Jan, 9th Jan also 13th December, whatever any of that means. Anyway, 4 times in a few weeks? The forum must be going to the dogs - you people need to seriously up your game. Where's Dutoni when you need him?

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Just now, Dave T said:

But that backdrop has been around for decades. Wire used the same arguments when campaigning for theirs. I expect every other development has had this basis as part of the discussions for the last 30 years. 

Not with the current owners, and since 2014 they have been able to be given the retort that it only matters on the field by other parties. And tbf to Wakefield, whilst they were fighting for the Newmarket site during that p/r period, they weren't half as bothered about that as they have been about securing the redevelopment of Belle Vue in the past few years.

I can only say what I know, and that is that there has been a feeling at Wakefield that since the time immediately before IMG were announced that whatever system was coming in to replace the existing model they were exceptionally vulnerable to being kicked out - and finally the council have taken those concerns seriously.

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2 hours ago, Harry Stottle said:

Couldn't agree more BP, I don't know why we don't just accept and be proud of what we have and look after the sport in it's birthplace in this country and make it as strong as it can be there.

The problem with that is that there isn't enough money available to be had from those heartlands, that's why there's no real money in the game.  In addition, in the era when multinational competitions like the Champions League, Europa League and Heineken Cup are seen as standard fare the regional M62 league which is all the game can offer as it is can't attract sufficient interest from elsewhere to bring in the necessary money from other places either.

And without a lot more money in the game, it will just fall further and further off the pace set by soccer and RU.  If Sky conclude that the game in its current incarnation has no chance of expanding its audience, they'll walk away and Michael Carter's suggestion that it could all be part time again could come to pass.

2 hours ago, Harry Stottle said:

I have been involved with and in this game for 60 years, and quite simply in my experience it does not travel in its Professional form of any note beyond it's 'spiritual home' of Lancs, Yorks and Cumbria, in its 'economically disadvantaged towns' I have lost count of how many clubs have come and gone in those 60 years, and that is not including all those that came and went before. It will be no different in the next 60 years - should it last that long, the game is simply not wanted beyond it's boundaries, it wasn't when Rugby League was at it's height when there wasn't much else going on, now there are far to many other distractions, past times, alternatives and the popularity of that behomoth that is Association Football to attract even moderate attendances of say 5000 in any area for a new Professional club.

It simply is as people like to mock "a local game, for local people" 

Putting on my tin hat now and getting into my Anderson Shelter to take cover !.

The game hasn't penetrated into new areas because what it can offer the public there now isn't something of interest to them.  That does not mean it can't be done though, because the NFL has succeeded in penetrating not only London but indeed all across Britain with their London series.

It just means that the public in areas outside the heartland has to be shown something capable of attracting and then keeping their interest, presented in a top quality manner.  That unfortunately is beyond the capability of the game's current setup.

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30 minutes ago, Hull Kingston Bronco said:

Even if we did it in the Russian alphabet we'd still be 3 letters short. The only viable option would be Cambodian, and how many people in Wigan or Leeds speak that?

 

Plenty in Hull speak like that 

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30 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Not with the current owners, and since 2014 they have been able to be given the retort that it only matters on the field by other parties. And tbf to Wakefield, whilst they were fighting for the Newmarket site during that p/r period, they weren't half as bothered about that as they have been about securing the redevelopment of Belle Vue in the past few years.

I can only say what I know, and that is that there has been a feeling at Wakefield that since the time immediately before IMG were announced that whatever system was coming in to replace the existing model they were exceptionally vulnerable to being kicked out - and finally the council have taken those concerns seriously.

Which shows how poorly licencing was done , as they should have been ' out ' in 2008 , along with CAS , and others 

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Just now, GUBRATS said:

Which shows how poorly licencing was done , as they should have been ' out ' in 2008 , along with CAS , and others 

Agreed 100%.

The consensus seemed to be that if licensing returned with the changes IMG (and indeed before IMG came into the picture) would bring, it would be done in a way that Belle Vue would critically hamper Wakefield's ability to be in the top flight.

They have also invested in other areas of the club, notably the academy, in an attempt to sure up their position.

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2 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

Which shows how poorly licencing was done , as they should have been ' out ' in 2008 , along with CAS , and others 

On this we might agree. My club moved heaven and earth to get a new stand built, a ridiculously complex endeavour that involved about 57 government agencies, the European Union before the genuises of Hull voted to leave it, and having to accept allowing a weird, grey office block built in the corner of our ground. 

Wakey and Cas had some CAD pictures made up for a press release, and got signed off. 

Apparently this site says I "won the day" here on 23rd Jan, 19th Jan, 9th Jan also 13th December, whatever any of that means. Anyway, 4 times in a few weeks? The forum must be going to the dogs - you people need to seriously up your game. Where's Dutoni when you need him?

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48 minutes ago, Big Picture said:

How exactly can St Helens reach into Liverpool?  What makes you think that Liverpudlians will ever care about a club which represents one of Liverpool's suburbs?

Reading too much into what I'm saying. Liverpudlians who watch RL can go and see St. Helens. That's all. I'm not suggesting that they will become the club of Liverpool. St. Helens won't be judged the same as Wigan or Leigh being in the same borough which is what Harry seemed to be suggesting.

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