Next England Football Manager?

[HawkMan]

Assuming Southgate is going, and every pundit seems to think he will, who should be the next failure..I mean outstanding candidate to take us to glory.

Edited July 17 by HawkMan

[The Hallucinating Goose]

I think @Harry Stottle should be given the opportunity!

[HawkMan]

2 minutes ago, The Hallucinating Goose said:

I think @Harry Stottle should be given the opportunity!

Okay I'll alter the poll to include him !!

[Gerrumonside ref]

There’s no outstanding candidate amongst the English contingent.

Potter or Howe is the likely direction I guess on further reflection.

Hmmn.

 

 

[Sidi Fidi Gold]

I would imagine if Southgate goes that Potter will be offered the Job, he played some good football at Brighton but their players couldn't put their chances away, I don't think you can judge him on his time at Chelsea because they signed about 300 players and he had the job of keeping them all happy

From a managers point of view International football is totally different from club football, at a club, you coach the players day in day out, at International level you're lucky to get the players together 6 times a year. In 1974 we appointed the best manager in the country in Don Revie, he flopped, if we had appointed Clough, he probably would have flopped, you just have to look at Spain who promoted a youth team coach, so did Argentina, don't get me wrong, I'm not suggesting we promote Lee Carsley, I'm just saying that there's no guarantee's in appointing a big name.

 

[Gerrumonside ref]

56 minutes ago, Sidi Fidi Gold said:

I would imagine if Southgate goes that Potter will be offered the Job, he played some good football at Brighton but their players couldn't put their chances away, I don't think you can judge him on his time at Chelsea because they signed about 300 players and he had the job of keeping them all happy

From a managers point of view International football is totally different from club football, at a club, you coach the players day in day out, at International level you're lucky to get the players together 6 times a year. In 1974 we appointed the best manager in the country in Don Revie, he flopped, if we had appointed Clough, he probably would have flopped, you just have to look at Spain who promoted a youth team coach, so did Argentina, don't get me wrong, I'm not suggesting we promote Lee Carsley, I'm just saying that there's no guarantee's in appointing a big name.

 

I don’t think you can easily dismiss Potter’s failure at Chelsea as England involves working essentially with big name players and potentially with a large turnover too due to injury, form and age.

He scores big as a good technical coach, but there’s much more to the England job in terms of managing expectation and pressure through the media than anything else he’s ever experienced.

The candidate will also have relations with every top club manager and will have less time to impart his technical vision than say day to day at club level.

I actually think in every respect bar perhaps the quality of the football at times, Southgate absolutely excelled in these almost political organisational aspects which speaks volumes about his character, judgement and intellect.

None of the English candidates absolutely fit the bill but then again we had no idea either how Southgate would adapt and evolve on the job.

Despite this I believe the manager picked has to be English and given time to transition over at least two tournaments before being judged barring non-qualification which would change things.

 

Edited July 15 by Gerrumonside ref

[Father Ted]

We need a manager who is used to coaching International players at club level. A manager who has a coached in the Premier League for years and won it.

A manager who has coached his club in the Champions League for years and won it.

My choice, Jurgen Klopp. 

[JohnM]

And you were doing so well!

[Futtocks]

Big Sam is poised by the phone on the doily on the occasional table in his hallway, waiting...

Edited July 15 by Futtocks

[17 stone giant]

Good decision by Southgate to step down. He's had more than a fair go (four tournaments) and I think it's only right that someone else now has the opportunity.

Let's see who puts their hat in the ring.

 

 

[JohnM]

Thank you , Gareth, for all you have done for the England team. The amount of abuse and ill-founded criticism you have been subject to has gone beyond what is acceptable. In any other field it would have been subject to legal action.You have every right to tell the naysayers like Lineker to f¥¥¥ off.

 I'm reminded of a few lines from Mike Harding's poem "Bring on the Rosy Cheeked Girls"

The sly-eyed, twisty-mouthed grabbers and fumblers,

The shifty-faced, two-tongued, leadswinging lizards,

The snotty-nosed, mardy-arsed bullies

And false friends . . .

And stick them up to their necks

In the foulest stink-pot of an old bog

You can find . . . head down . ..

And leave them there.

[Hammerless Nail]

Has Paul Rowley been linked with the job yet?

[graveyard johnny]

Neil Warnock

[Maximus Decimus]

I'll always defend what Southgate achieved, and I feel sad that he's gone even though it was the best choice. When the dust settles, and the hurt is forgotten we'll look back on this time as a golden age of English football. If such a bet exists, I'd put one on the fact that people will be begging for his return come 10 years time.

His replacement is tough. There were rumours around that things had been more difficult behind the scenes this time. We need someone who is going to be brave enough to be able to drop big names in favour of the team and not get slaughtered in the press for doing so. This points to a bigger more established name, but whether we'll get one is another matter. It might be a case of beggars can't be choosers.

Gary Neville made the point that the final was like pretty much every big game England have played in since about 1996. Sometimes, you have to accept that there might be bigger issues than tactics. Take the Man Utd job, they've gone through so many big established names that you can't blame the manager too much for their ills.

[17 stone giant]

44 minutes ago, Maximus Decimus said:

When the dust settles, and the hurt is forgotten we'll look back on this time as a golden age of English football. If such a bet exists, I'd put one on the fact that people will be begging for his return come 10 years time.

That's a bold statement considering the talent that England now have available. That's 3 World Cups and 2 Euros that you're forecasting will be so bad that people will be begging for Southgate to return.

I absolutely wouldn't put that bet on.

[17 stone giant]

52 minutes ago, Maximus Decimus said:

Gary Neville made the point that the final was like pretty much every big game England have played in since about 1996. Sometimes, you have to accept that there might be bigger issues than tactics.

But you can't have it both ways. It's fine if you want to say that it's same old same old, but you can't then put Southgate on a pedestal and claim he is so much better than what we've had before. He's been in the job for eight years, and yet you're arguing (by agreeing with Gary Neville) that it's the same old England that we've seen since in every big England game since 1996. It shouldn't BE the same old England if Southgate is so damned good.

[Maximus Decimus]

4 hours ago, JohnM said:

Thank you , Gareth, for all you have done for the England team. The amount of abuse and ill-founded criticism you have been subject to has gone beyond what is acceptable. In any other field it would have been subject to legal action.You have every right to tell the naysayers like Lineker to f¥¥¥ off.

 I'm reminded of a few lines from Mike Harding's poem "Bring on the Rosy Cheeked Girls"

The sly-eyed, twisty-mouthed grabbers and fumblers,

The shifty-faced, two-tongued, leadswinging lizards,

The snotty-nosed, mardy-arsed bullies

And false friends . . .

And stick them up to their necks

In the foulest stink-pot of an old bog

You can find . . . head down . ..

And leave them there.

The whole Linekar situation was a classic example of media stirring.

The panel were reflecting on the game (I think Denmark) and saying it wasn't good which was everyone else was saying. Linekar then said something like 'yeh, it was just a bit s**t really wasn't it.'

The media then confronted Kane saying 'Linekar said you're s**t, what do you think about that?'

Anyone listening to the podcast, knew they weren't overly critical. They were always looking for the positives, and Southgate was playing the team in a way that literally nobody agreed with.

[17 stone giant]

5 minutes ago, Maximus Decimus said:

The whole Linekar situation was a classic example of media stirring.

Ooh, a chance for me to do the internet pedant thing.

Who is Linekar? I don't know who that is and I can't work it out even though only one letter of his name is incorrect.

Did you mean Shearer?

[Maximus Decimus]

37 minutes ago, 17 stone giant said:

That's a bold statement considering the talent that England now have available. That's 3 World Cups and 2 Euros that you're forecasting will be so bad that people will be begging for Southgate to return.

I absolutely wouldn't put that bet on.

I think it's very naive to think that this level of success will continue.

We could have a much better manager and not do this well. We've been very fortunate at times (especially this time) and can't rely on that again. The reality is that there are always a not insignificant group of countries that could win a tournament with a bit of luck. We are but one.

Trust me, as soon as we have an earlier than anticipated exit (which will certainly happen), people will be unfavourably comparing it to the Southgate era.

It's very much a poisoned chalice, because all the new manager can do is win a tournament to be judged a success.

[Maximus Decimus]

29 minutes ago, 17 stone giant said:

Ooh, a chance for me to do the internet pedant thing.

Who is Linekar? I don't know who that is and I can't work it out even though only one letter of his name is incorrect.

Did you mean Shearer?

I genuinely didn't know I'd spelt that wrong! It looks right...

[17 stone giant]

Just now, Maximus Decimus said:

I genuinely didn't know I'd spelt that wrong! It looks right...

You can't get Gary's name wrong! He was my first football hero because of Mexico 86.

 

 

[Maximus Decimus]

38 minutes ago, 17 stone giant said:

But you can't have it both ways. It's fine if you want to say that it's same old same old, but you can't then put Southgate on a pedestal and claim he is so much better than what we've had before. He's been in the job for eight years, and yet you're arguing (by agreeing with Gary Neville) that it's the same old England that we've seen since in every big England game since 1996. It shouldn't BE the same old England if Southgate is so damned good.

I don't see a contradiction here. I could be arguing that Southgate is the best manager of all time (I'm not) but that he could only get England so far. Pep Guardiola could manage Everton but they wouldn't win the PL without investment levels that they don't have.

I think you're misunderstanding what I'm saying here. I think Southgate only did a good job overall (moreso in 2021 and 22), but that his record is historically incredible for an England manager. A not insignificant part of that was luck. Take this tournament:

If Denmark nick a goal against Serbia, we get Germany in the 2nd round - likely exit

If Slovakia drag out injury time like Spain did we go home in disgrace

We only beat Switzerland on pens, and even if we were good still is still part lottery

If we don't get a terrible penalty against the Dutch who knows what happens

You'd be insane to claim that Southgate's England was in the final based purely on merit. But there you have it, he did and that's what other managers will be compared to.

They might not get the luck.

 

 

[17 stone giant]

8 minutes ago, Maximus Decimus said:

I think it's very naive to think that this level of success will continue.

Only time will tell, but with the players we have available now, I will be very disappointed if in the next five tournaments, we can't produce something that would match or even exceed what we've seen for the last four tournaments.

Plus comparing isn't easy anyway. If we won the World Cup but flopped in the other four tournaments, how would you compare that to the Southgate era? It would lack the consistency of regularly getting to the QF or further, but we'd have a WC win. So what would people prefer.

Either way, if we are genuinely begging for the return of Southgate in 10 years time, we have sadly got some awfully bad performances to suffer in the next decade!

[Sidi Fidi Gold]

8 minutes ago, 17 stone giant said:

You can't get Gary's name wrong! He was my first football hero because of Mexico 86.

 

 

Mick Channon used to, can you remember how he used to pronounce his name " The boy Lie necker "

[17 stone giant]

13 minutes ago, Sidi Fidi Gold said:

Mick Channon used to, can you remember how he used to pronounce his name " The boy Lie necker "

Funnily enough I was watching that only recently - 8:30

And now you've reminded me that I also had planned to watch the Mick Channon documentary from when he was at Southampton.