London Broncos (Merged Threads)

[JohnM]

36 minutes ago, Archie Gordon said:

But this isn't about the game itself, it's about the sense of belonging. As someone living in the South, is RL my game? Do I feel wanted or valued by the sport?

Not really. 

Are you "Hello"? 

[Archie Gordon]

2 minutes ago, The Blues Ox said:

Yet some on here would leave us to believe that Mike Eccles has just sat there and not spoke to his chairman and asked why they have not been planning for next season. It just seems a bit of a reach.

Although David Hughes has got a lot of criticism, a lot of it very just, it is still hard to think that a guy would pit millions of his own money in to a club to try and kill them, its quite absurd that people are thinking like that. The problem now is there is no hiding the fact that his money has kept London going and that is quite a short fall to try and make up and London will not get by without an owner with deep pockets. The big question is the lack of potential for another shot in SL enough to put off potential investors?

Quite honestly, I don't think Hughes has ever acted rationally. My guess - it is just that - is that Eccles (and players) have wanted clarity about 2025 for several months but Hughes has probably just refused to engage.

[Coggo]

The 2026 14-club scenario is an open goal for an investor in London (including the NRL) to secure a semi-permanent Super League presence.

Let's hope it's taken.

 

 

[nadera78]

24 minutes ago, Coggo said:

The 2026 14-club scenario is an open goal for an investor in London (including the NRL) to secure a semi-permanent Super League presence.

Let's hope it's taken.

 

 

OK, let's run with this. What would you be investing in?

The Broncos have no fans, no players, no academy, no staff, no sponsorship base and no assets. It's going to cost you a couple of million p/a just to put a team on the field. Every year.

Can you build a fanbase? Maybe, but in a city where only one sport matters and everything else is so small as to be invisible outside of long-established major events, and playing a sport that very few people know exists (and even then often confuse with another, rival, sport), that's going to be very difficult. To make matters worse, the events of the past decade make that even harder because an existing group of fans have been driven away meaning you don't have anyone to call upon to help get things going. 

Can you find the players? Well, all the best local ones have moved to other clubs, leaving you with the leftovers. You're going to have to pay over the odds to attract players from the north or overseas. That's a constant drain on a limited salary cap.

Can you rebuild the academy? Yes, but it'll take time. And the wider decline of the sport in London means the community game is also in a weaker position so your source of young players is smaller. That's a very long term project.

Can you build the off-field staff? Of course, but it's more money you need to find.

Can you build a sponsorship base? Sure, but it'll be difficult when you're playing Championship games in an empty stadium that creates no real atmosphere or buzz. And, again, it'll cost you in the short term.

Can you build an asset base? No. There's just no land left in London that you could realistically buy and build a stadium or training ground on. 20 years ago, definitely, 10 years ago possibly. Now, no. That means you'll always be renting and at risk of relocation if/when relationships change or fail, just look at the Broncos history on that score.

TLDR; you'd be taking over an empty shell of a club with a damaged brand. Professional rugby league in London is dead.

[Gav Wilson]

4 hours ago, The Blues Ox said:

Yet some on here would leave us to believe that Mike Eccles has just sat there and not spoke to his chairman and asked why they have not been planning for next season. It just seems a bit of a reach.

Although David Hughes has got a lot of criticism, a lot of it very just, it is still hard to think that a guy would pit millions of his own money in to a club to try and kill them, its quite absurd that people are thinking like that. The problem now is there is no hiding the fact that his money has kept London going and that is quite a short fall to try and make up and London will not get by without an owner with deep pockets. The big question is the lack of potential for another shot in SL enough to put off potential investors?

That isn't the big question at all. If London build a viable club, they would be a shoe-in for an IMG Super League. 

[The Blues Ox]

7 hours ago, Gav Wilson said:

That isn't the big question at all. If London build a viable club, they would be a shoe-in for an IMG Super League. 

They would be working under the same criteria as everyone else which is going to make it very difficult to out score any current SL team. I presume that by the time they get their act together the last season in SL will have dropped off. Even if they were to sort themselves out I would give them the same chance as any other championship team, virtually zero.

[crashmon]

13 hours ago, Archie Gordon said:

But this isn't about the game itself, it's about the sense of belonging. As someone living in the South, is RL my game? Do I feel wanted or valued by the sport?

Not really. 

This
Three gold member season ticket holders for 20 years at London, are now 3 regulars at Guildford Flames Ice Hockey (actually 4 as my american wife comes to the hockey). I don't see us going back to RL now, we have found our sunday sporting fix.
And I cannot remember the last SL game I watched on sky.  I think it was England v Tonga third test was the last game I watched on TV

[RayCee]

54 minutes ago, crashmon said:

Three gold member season ticket holders for 20 years at London, are now 3 regulars at Guildford Flames Ice Hockey (actually 4 as my american wife comes to the hockey). I don't see us going back to RL now, we have found our sunday sporting fix.
And I cannot remember the last SL game I watched on sky.  I think it was England v Tonga third test was the last game I watched on TV

Personally, I have more than one sport I follow but like crashmon some only want/need/can afford/allow time for one sport. Nice you keep up enough interest to come along and comment and enjoy the hockey. 

The desire to have a SL club in London was ambitious but for various reasons hasn't worked. So maybe it's best to focus resources on where future success is more likely and easier to assimilate, areas in the north such as Goole and expand out from there. Have new clubs close enough to existing RL clubs to integrate without excessive travel. In due course expand further. 

[Worzel]

On 23/10/2024 at 19:52, Londonbornirishbred said:

I posted an "opus" on RLFans.com back in 2009, prior to leaving blighty for the Shaky Isles.

In it was a marketing brief on how I believed the then Quins RL could strive to reach a 5,000 average the following year, by using community engagement, local free volunteer marketing and social media.

15 years later, I refuse to speak with a Kiwi twang , support the All Blacks and applaud David Hughes.

Yes. The London Broncos are debt free, but I won't give them a bean of my cash whilst the CEO Loubser is still there, because he is as guilty as Hughes in that he has taken a wage for a decade and yet only seemingly earned it this year.

As for the 2009 Marketing brief? I have implemented it down here twice now, with the first club now selling out all their games and the second at 80% capacity. It wasn't and isn't that my plan is genius. It just involved hard graft, long nights and a lot of footwork.....but whilst Hughes was paying for everything, Loubser and co were happy to just sit back and do nothing.

Thanks for nothing Hughes.

You are Gutterfax and I claim my £5

[17 stone giant]

3 hours ago, RayCee said:

So maybe it's best to focus resources on where future success is more likely and easier to assimilate, areas in the north such as Goole and expand out from there.

I've already started work on a new logo that should help bring them some attention.

Now I just need to find out where Goole actually is. Anyone know of a decent internet search engine?

[Archie Gordon]

7 hours ago, RayCee said:

Personally, I have more than one sport I follow but like crashmon some only want/need/can afford/allow time for one sport. Nice you keep up enough interest to come along and comment and enjoy the hockey. 

The desire to have a SL club in London was ambitious but for various reasons hasn't worked. So maybe it's best to focus resources on where future success is more likely and easier to assimilate, areas in the north such as Goole and expand out from there. Have new clubs close enough to existing RL clubs to integrate without excessive travel. In due course expand further. 

Aka: goodbye Skolars, Broncos, KPP, McMeeken ...

[RayCee]

3 minutes ago, Archie Gordon said:

Aka: goodbye Skolars, Broncos, KPP, McMeeken ...

London RL doesn't have to disappear if the public in London want to support it. But is it worth spending limited resources in a city that hardly knows RL is played there and people like crashmon who are happy to walk away from it? In places like Goole the locals will get behind their club and support it.

Clubs in London can still exist in local leagues or if a club wants to get serious get a wealthy backer to fund them and London has plenty of them. If it comes down to saying 'goodbye', it's mainly because the public in London aren't interested in sufficient numbers and the well heeled are even less so. I hope someone comes along and decides to take up the Broncos. 

[Archie Gordon]

9 minutes ago, RayCee said:

London RL doesn't have to disappear if the public in London want to support it. But is it worth spending limited resources in a city that hardly knows RL is played there and people like crashmon who are happy to walk away from it? In places like Goole the locals will get behind their club and support it.

Clubs in London can still exist in local leagues or if a club wants to get serious get a wealthy backer to fund them and London has plenty of them. If it comes down to saying 'goodbye', it's mainly because the public in London aren't interested in sufficient numbers and the well heeled are even less so. I hope someone comes along and decides to take up the Broncos. 

There are tens of thousands of people in London who've regularly watched professional RL at one time or another. Viewing figures paint a similar story of decent engagement with the game. England/GB has done particularly well there. I'm not sure what the well-heeled being less interested means.

We also know that a London academy sitting on top of the community game can produce world class players, SL standard players, Champo standard players, and top Community game players.

All that is in danger. 

That is before we talk about the strategic advantage of London to the game.

[OriginalMrC]

1 hour ago, RayCee said:

London RL doesn't have to disappear if the public in London want to support it. But is it worth spending limited resources in a city that hardly knows RL is played there and people like crashmon who are happy to walk away from it? In places like Goole the locals will get behind their club and support it.

Clubs in London can still exist in local leagues or if a club wants to get serious get a wealthy backer to fund them and London has plenty of them. If it comes down to saying 'goodbye', it's mainly because the public in London aren't interested in sufficient numbers and the well heeled are even less so. I hope someone comes along and decides to take up the Broncos. 

Sorry but that's not accurate in the slightest. A poorly run London club not succeeding does not mean people aren't interested. There are many thousands of RL fans in London who watch or have watched the game and who turn out in big numbers for internationals. 

The fact that the current London Broncos haven't been able to tap into that is a indictment on Broncos and not to do with people not being interested.

[gingerjon]

1 hour ago, RayCee said:

London RL doesn't have to disappear if the public in London want to support it. But is it worth spending limited resources in a city that hardly knows RL is played there and people like crashmon who are happy to walk away from it? In places like Goole the locals will get behind their club and support it.

Clubs in London can still exist in local leagues or if a club wants to get serious get a wealthy backer to fund them and London has plenty of them. If it comes down to saying 'goodbye', it's mainly because the public in London aren't interested in sufficient numbers and the well heeled are even less so. I hope someone comes along and decides to take up the Broncos. 

You already know that Goole will be a success?

Can I get the lottery numbers off you?

[Dave T]

15 minutes ago, OriginalMrC said:

Sorry but that's not accurate in the slightest. A poorly run London club not succeeding does not mean people aren't interested. There are many thousands of RL fans in London who watch or have watched the game and who turn out in big numbers for internationals. 

The fact that the current London Broncos haven't been able to tap into that is a indictment on Broncos and not to do with people not being interested.

This is the problem, and not just with this, but many things in RL, we can't dismiss them because we do them poorly.

[Gomersall]

6 hours ago, Archie Gordon said:

There are tens of thousands of people in London who've regularly watched professional RL at one time or another. Viewing figures paint a similar story of decent engagement with the game. England/GB has done particularly well there. I'm not sure what the well-heeled being less interested means.

We also know that a London academy sitting on top of the community game can produce world class players, SL standard players, Champo standard players, and top Community game players.

All that is in danger. 

That is before we talk about the strategic advantage of London to the game.

 

[Hemel Rugby League]

It would have been nice if Broncos had acknowledged the London Junior League clubs that produced these players in the first place

[Londonbornirishbred]

On 26/10/2024 at 01:44, Hemel Rugby League said:

It would have been nice if Broncos had acknowledged the London Junior League clubs that produced these players in the first place

David Hughes acknowledged nothing other than David Hughes!

I get it. I really do. He is a wealthy man and he deserved to spend his money as he saw fit, but the list of catastrophic errors he amassed over his tenure is gargantuan! 

The clubs that delivered the kids that the academy turned into top class players were never anything other than a distraction to him. The same with Marketing. He felt that as he was bankrolling the club, that the RFL should throw their weight into marketing. Problem is, when they tried to help, he ignored them.

I used to watch the Hoists or West London from time to time and often spoke to the ANZAC players at these clubs about London. They had little interest, because they received no help. Nothing. The 

I filled a coach to Wakefield and 2 coaches to Wales back in 2009. I did it because I pestered cajoled and generally nagged everyone I knew to go...the club used to announce a coach for free and just expected people to rock up.....ergo, nobody bothered.

 

My point being. EFFORT........lots of EFFORT and yes, some money, will deliver results. Hughes thought the answer was just Money and so we have a corpse of a club, begging for handouts on funding pages and getting exactly what they deserve....which is about 8k.

Thanks Dave, but no Thanks!

Edited October 27, 2024 by Londonbornirishbred

[RP London]

Fund junior RL in London. DOs or similar to go to schools etc and showcase the sport. 

Junior clubs set up under the senior clubs. 

Broncos should be hosting some of the big southern conference games as warm ups.. (they used to, remember playing in a game for storm at the stoop as an opener to a match when they were harlequins).. the teams stay and start to feel a part of something bigger.. broncos should host special days for each club where they are acknowledged etc.. end of season dos should be having players along without a second thought etc etc..

Tap the market already there.. then build. 

Junior teams U14 u16 etc to be linked in and supported. Obvious pathways made obvious to the kids and parents.. training days set up at the club followed by a match that they are all invited to. 

All of this is simple... Sponsors will buy into the integration with kids and communities. Social media will love it, TV may even come along and showcase it.. 

An investment into the community and junior game in London is the simplist and the best way to get the ball moving again and it can/will attract future investment.. it can work relatively quickly as well.. 

 

 

Edited October 28, 2024 by RP London

[Deadcowboys1]

1 hour ago, RP London said:

Fund junior RL in London. DOs or similar to go to schools etc and showcase the sport. 

Junior clubs set up under the senior clubs. 

Broncos should be hosting some of the big southern conference games as warm ups.. (they used to, remember playing in a game for storm at the stoop as an opener to a match when they were harlequins).. the teams stay and start to feel a part of something bigger.. broncos should host special days for each club where they are acknowledged etc.. end of season dos should be having players along without a second thought etc etc..

Tap the market already there.. then build. 

Junior teams U14 u16 etc to be linked in and supported. Obvious pathways made obvious to the kids and parents.. training days set up at the club followed by a match that they are all invited to. 

All of this is simple... Sponsors will buy into the integration with kids and communities. Social media will love it, TV may even come along and showcase it.. 

An investment into the community and junior game in London is the simplist and the best way to get the ball moving again and it can/will attract future investment.. it can work relatively quickly as well.. 

 

 

While what you say would be true in an ideal world, we currently are not in that place. There is a significant difference between a rugby pitch at the Stoop & a football pitch at PL. I very much doubt AFC would allow any other game to take place on a match day, even less likely following recent damage. 

All the evidence of the last few years, tells us that Broncos can't afford to develope a decent squad in the Championship because the better players will continue to be cherry picked by other clubs. It's a mute point whether community clubs  Hills Hoists & West's are as strong  today as Peckham & London Colonials were in the early 80s.

[RP London]

2 hours ago, Deadcowboys1 said:

While what you say would be true in an ideal world, we currently are not in that place. There is a significant difference between a rugby pitch at the Stoop & a football pitch at PL. I very much doubt AFC would allow any other game to take place on a match day, even less likely following recent damage. 

All the evidence of the last few years, tells us that Broncos can't afford to develope a decent squad in the Championship because the better players will continue to be cherry picked by other clubs. It's a mute point whether community clubs  Hills Hoists & West's are as strong  today as Peckham & London Colonials were in the early 80s.

If we continue to not do anything we get to where we are.. if we continue to not do anything we are always "currently not in that place" and way behind and getting further.. it has to start somewhere and if they can't play on the same pitch it is a minor part of the "make the clubs feel part of London RL" which is what we used to have... 

Edited October 28, 2024 by RP London

[Deadcowboys1]

11 minutes ago, RP London said:

If we continue to not do anything we get to where we are.. if we continue to not do anything we are always "currently not in that place" and way behind and getting further.. it has to start somewhere and if they can't play on the same pitch it is a minor part of the "make the clubs feel part of London RL" which is what we used to have... 

Don't disagree but those were mostly days when Hughes didn't have carte blanche to do what he liked. With Hughes out of the way & if the club survives then that may start to happen again but most likely at RP not PL.

[Pen-Y-Bont Crusader]

All the other stuff mtioenned by RP though IS more than doable. 

All depends on whether those left at the club want to do it.....

[Archie Gordon]

Brentwood-Brixton u14s was played at PL last year. It is possible.