2025 Attendance Thread

[Sports Prophet]

21 minutes ago, EggFace said:

I'm glad you were not doing the ticks and crosses back in 1996-2002 mate.

West Tigers game was packed so thats a tick from me but the stadium looks like some trial or NRL country game and should not be used in an elite comp.

My scoring is all relative to the time and place. The NRL season average last year was > 20k. Leichhardt holds 20k. It was a beautiful long weekend Sunday. You say the place was packed, it’s a small suburban ground less than 75% full. It looked packed but I wouldn’t necessarily consider under 75% packed. Maybe I am being harsh.

I do agree with your sentiments on the stadium, except that matches shouldn’t be played there. It’s like Shark Park, what an absolute trash can of a venue. It would be hard for me to ever give that place more than a bare pass in its current state, and that’s my club.

The proposed upgrade of Leichhardt looks pretty smart though.

The important part is, I think in general, the Sydney NRL clubs especially are pretty slack at getting fans in the gate. Not always, but far more often than not.

[EggFace]

20 minutes ago, Sports Prophet said:

My scoring is all relative to the time and place. The NRL season average last year was > 20k. Leichhardt holds 20k. It was a beautiful long weekend Sunday. You say the place was packed, it’s a small suburban ground less than 75% full. It looked packed but I wouldn’t necessarily consider under 75% packed. Maybe I am being harsh.

I do agree with your sentiments on the stadium, except that matches shouldn’t be played there. It’s like Shark Park, what an absolute trash can of a venue. It would be hard for me to ever give that place more than a bare pass in its current state, and that’s my club.

The proposed upgrade of Leichhardt looks pretty smart though.

The important part is, I think in general, the Sydney NRL clubs especially are pretty slack at getting fans in the gate. Not always, but far more often than not.

Manly get 17,000 for most games now and that shouldn't acceptable yet the ground looks great on TV.

[Sports Prophet]

8 hours ago, EggFace said:

Manly get 17,000 for most games now and that shouldn't acceptable yet the ground looks great on TV.

Brookie has a capacity of 18k, so anything above 17k probably deserves a tick, but I don’t think I would ever give Manly more than one tick, because the ground is too small.

[Eddie]

2 hours ago, Sports Prophet said:

Brookie has a capacity of 18k, so anything above 17k probably deserves a tick, but I don’t think I would ever give Manly more than one tick, because the ground is too small.

Better to have 17k packed in an 18k stadium than 20k rattling around an 80k stadium. 

[Damien]

 

 

[Worzel]

4 hours ago, Sports Prophet said:

Brookie has a capacity of 18k, so anything above 17k probably deserves a tick, but I don’t think I would ever give Manly more than one tick, because the ground is too small.

The customer experience being one of 17,000 at Brookvale is far better than being one of 20,000 in an 40,000 or heaven forbid even 80,000 identikit stadium miles away from the club's fanbase.

The diversity of the TV optics of watching NRL games across a range of different style stadia is a strength, not a weakness. Better to be the 'hipster' sport, in touch with your community with occassional rustic elements, than just another "big stadia" clean and crisp cliche like the AFL. Points of difference have value. 

[Sports Prophet]

3 hours ago, Eddie said:

Better to have 17k packed in an 18k stadium than 20k rattling around an 80k stadium. 

Won’t find me arguing with that.

[Sports Prophet]

14 minutes ago, Worzel said:

The customer experience being one of 17,000 at Brookvale is far better than being one of 20,000 in an 40,000 or heaven forbid even 80,000 identikit stadium miles away from the club's fanbase.

The diversity of the TV optics of watching NRL games across a range of different style stadia is a strength, not a weakness. Better to be the 'hipster' sport, in touch with your community with occassional rustic elements, than just another "big stadia" clean and crisp cliche like the AFL. Points of difference have value. 

Are you disagreeing with anything I am saying or are you just saying?

Are you suggesting Brookie is adequate? A Sydney suburban club occupying the capital city’s entire northern peninsula having a stadium with a capacity smaller than the NRL season average?

It’s not like I haven’t acknowledged Manly’s 17k as a good result (), but we shouldn’t be handing out too many plaudits when the crowd figure is still well under the NRL season average. Or maybe that’s what you disagree with?

[Worzel]

20 minutes ago, Sports Prophet said:

Are you disagreeing with anything I am saying or are you just saying?

Are you suggesting Brookie is adequate? A Sydney suburban club occupying the capital city’s entire northern peninsula having a stadium with a capacity smaller than the NRL season average?

It’s not like I haven’t acknowledged Manly’s 17k as a good result (), but we shouldn’t be handing out too many plaudits when the crowd figure is still well under the NRL season average. Or maybe that’s what you disagree with?

I think Brookvale has a unique charm, yes. In rational businesses you update your facilities gradually over time when you have the resources to do so. The new Centre of Excellence stand has been an improvement. In time the Jane Try and the Lyon-Menzies may get improved. It doesn’t have to be all at once.

The nature of averages in a portfolio of products is that some will be greater, offsetting those smaller ones. But if the smaller ones bring other, unique aspects that contribute to the value of the sport - such as customer experience, aesthetic diversity, brand values positioning etc - then counter-intuitively you may be better off with them in terms of generating overall portfolio performance.

Strategy can be richer than average metrics. That’s the only reason I’ve added to this discussion.  

[Sports Prophet]

28 minutes ago, Worzel said:

I think Brookvale has a unique charm, yes. In rational businesses you update your facilities gradually over time when you have the resources to do so. The new Centre of Excellence stand has been an improvement. In time the Jane Try and the Lyon-Menzies may get improved. It doesn’t have to be all at once.

The nature of averages in a portfolio of products is that some will be greater, offsetting those smaller ones. But if the smaller ones bring other, unique aspects that contribute to the value of the sport - such as customer experience, aesthetic diversity, brand values positioning etc - then counter-intuitively you may be better off with them in terms of generating overall portfolio performance.

Strategy can be richer than average metrics. That’s the only reason I’ve added to this discussion.  

Taking on the merit of much of what you say, that Brookie couldn’t even meet a potential to hit the NRL average, I have to say, the stadium is not to a satisfactory standard. I wouldn’t necessarily say the experience of a full Brookie is better than 20k at Moore Park. Not that I’m advocating Manly move home games there.

More importantly, the turnstiles should be turning much more in Sydney than they are and debating whether 17k in an 18k capacity is better than 20k in a 40k capacity isn’t the right use of energy or line of questioning. It should be, what needs to be done to make it common to get 30k+ in that 40k capacity stadium? 

The crowds have increased at Manly as the minor improvements have come, but as a stadium, it’s too exposed to the elements and the experience along the hill is hardly a great one in the best of times. Throw a bit of inclement weather and much of Brookie is nothing more than a below average experience as far as I am concerned. More work is required to bring it to an acceptable standard. A Manly fan may feel different.

Edited April 30 by Sports Prophet

[Worzel]

38 minutes ago, Sports Prophet said:

Taking on the merit of much of what you say, that Brookie couldn’t even meet a potential to hit the NRL average, I have to say, the stadium is not to a satisfactory standard. I wouldn’t necessarily say the experience of a full Brookie is better than 20k at Moore Park. Not that I’m advocating Manly move home games there.

More importantly, the turnstiles should be turning much more in Sydney than they are and debating whether 17k in an 18k capacity is better than 20k in a 40k capacity isn’t the right use of energy or line of questioning. It should be, what needs to be done to make it common to get 30k+ in that 40k capacity stadium? 

The crowds have increased at Manly as the minor improvements have come, but as a stadium, it’s too exposed to the elements and the experience along the hill is hardly a great one in the best of times. Throw a bit of inclement weather and much of Brookie is nothing more than a below average experience as far as I am concerned. More work is required to bring it to an acceptable standard. A Manly fan may feel different.

As a Manly fan, former long-term Hill and occassional Jane Try seating occupier, I can promise you we do feel different. 

It's about choice. If you want the modern, corporate, "elite" stadium experience you can sit in the Bob Fulton or Ken Arthurson stands. If you want a 1980's seating experience without the concourse bells and whistles, you can sit in the Jane Try or Lyons-Menzies stand. If you want the traditional hill experience, picnic blanket with the kids and a 4-pack of tinnies in the sun, then you can go on the hill. Inclement weather is pretty rare, I accept that point but everything comes with downsides. All of those options are available, and I think the choice is a great thing.

The argument for the Hill is the same as the argument for terracing in the UK. It appeals to a category of fans, who want a different type of experience. I know Hull KR fans who'd get a nosebleed if they were forced to move from the East Stand into the Roger Millward seats opposite

I don't think the capacity is an issue personally, the northern beaches market close to Manly isn't that large (the parts of it further away from Manly itself don't necessarily contain Sea Eagles fans and can just as easily access other clubs). I think they'll inevitably rebuild the Jane Try at some point which would probably deliver the additional 4,000 you need for a higher quality but boutique environment. 

[langpark]

A rare mid-week game in France, and it looks like a full house tonight in Albi!

 

https://www.facebook.com/jacques.comptoirovalielavergne.1/posts/pfbid02tTwNm9LJuBfHaJSX5MPbf1iwVGHG354mVmbH9LCmrpgZPKCiWNHW9bAoDyKQLPMTl

[Sports Prophet]

6 hours ago, Worzel said:

As a Manly fan, former long-term Hill and occassional Jane Try seating occupier, I can promise you we do feel different. 

It's about choice. If you want the modern, corporate, "elite" stadium experience you can sit in the Bob Fulton or Ken Arthurson stands. If you want a 1980's seating experience without the concourse bells and whistles, you can sit in the Jane Try or Lyons-Menzies stand. If you want the traditional hill experience, picnic blanket with the kids and a 4-pack of tinnies in the sun, then you can go on the hill. Inclement weather is pretty rare, I accept that point but everything comes with downsides. All of those options are available, and I think the choice is a great thing.

The argument for the Hill is the same as the argument for terracing in the UK. It appeals to a category of fans, who want a different type of experience. I know Hull KR fans who'd get a nosebleed if they were forced to move from the East Stand into the Roger Millward seats opposite

I don't think the capacity is an issue personally, the northern beaches market close to Manly isn't that large (the parts of it further away from Manly itself don't necessarily contain Sea Eagles fans and can just as easily access other clubs). I think they'll inevitably rebuild the Jane Try at some point which would probably deliver the additional 4,000 you need for a higher quality but boutique environment. 

Yeah, I don’t think I agree. Last year was the biggest season crowd avg for Brookie at 16,473, significantly increased on over the averages for the decade prior.

Only the years 2005-08 (including a Premiership and R/up seasons) has the ground ever averaged 14k or higher.

Whilst I appreciate nostalgic opinions and favouritism for experiences of watching matches on a hill, in my experience the expectation for comforts (not just seating vs standing) has outgrown what Brookvale can currently offer.

I still stand by my opinion that Sydney is an underperforming city for NRL crowd sizes and I believe the rough conditions of the suburban venues is a major factor holding those crowd numbers down.

[Jim from Oz]

7 hours ago, langpark said:

A rare mid-week game in France, and it looks like a full house tonight in Albi!

 

https://www.facebook.com/jacques.comptoirovalielavergne.1/posts/pfbid02tTwNm9LJuBfHaJSX5MPbf1iwVGHG354mVmbH9LCmrpgZPKCiWNHW9bAoDyKQLPMTl

Why were they playing mid-week?? Quite a thrashing of the team coming 2nd, I see !!

[langpark]

1 hour ago, Jim from Oz said:

Why were they playing mid-week?? Quite a thrashing of the team coming 2nd, I see !!

I have not been follow the French League as much as I have done in past seasons, but I assume it was a catch-up game from a postponement earlier in the season.

[Anita Bath]

9 hours ago, Sports Prophet said:

Yeah, I don’t think I agree. Last year was the biggest season crowd avg for Brookie at 16,473, significantly increased on over the averages for the decade prior.

Only the years 2005-08 (including a Premiership and R/up seasons) has the ground ever averaged 14k or higher.

Whilst I appreciate nostalgic opinions and favouritism for experiences of watching matches on a hill, in my experience the expectation for comforts (not just seating vs standing) has outgrown what Brookvale can currently offer.

I still stand by my opinion that Sydney is an underperforming city for NRL crowd sizes and I believe the rough conditions of the suburban venues is a major factor holding those crowd numbers down.

Was last season the first full season of the new Fulton stand behind the posts which replaced standing area didnt it? That might have attracted more fans given the extra seating.

[Josef K]

I am not going the MW i just can’t afford it, i will be looking after some of my grandchildren instead. But as i ride to victory in UNO, i will be trying my best to watch the games on Saturday. Hopefully i’ll be home for the Saints match. 

[Father Gascoigne]

23 hours ago, Worzel said:

Better to be the 'hipster' sport, in touch with your community with occassional rustic elements, than just another "big stadia" clean and crisp cliche like the AFL. Points of difference have value. 

I've been to Sydney a couple of times, and everything about it is a deterrent to large crowds, from stadium locations to transport links. 

The big difference is that, in Melbourne, every game is like a home game for both teams if they're from the city. North Melbourne can get 50-60,000 to a home game playing Collingwood because it's just as easy for Collingwood's fans to get to the stadium as it is for North Melbourne's. You can have a core support of 15,000 and still end up averaging 30-40,000 because the away teams supply the fans. 

The two big stadiums are both in the CBD, and both are next to large train stations, to say nothing of the tram network that surrounds them. Every part of the city has the same ease of access to the stadiums, which is why you get fans of all teams all across the metropolitan area. 

In Sydney, the stadiums aren't as central and transport links nowhere near as good. You end up with highly regionalised support bases with weak away support. 

 

Edited May 1 by Father Gascoigne

[JonM]

9 hours ago, Jim from Oz said:

Why were they playing mid-week?? Quite a thrashing of the team coming 2nd, I see !!

It was due to be played on April 19th, and Albi.had promoted it quite hard, with free entry to female spectators. It was postponed by a lightning storm and hastily re-arranged. With nothing at stake, and the play-offs starting this weekend, Carcassonne rested about half of their team and gave a debut to several players. Today is a public holiday in France (and a lot of people 'faire le pont' and have tomorrow off too). A shame that a local derby between the top two clubs was reduced to this.

[Sports Prophet]

6 hours ago, Anita Bath said:

Was last season the first full season of the new Fulton stand behind the posts which replaced standing area didnt it? That might have attracted more fans given the extra seating.

Opened in 2022, it may have taken a few years to bed in, maybe poor weather in the last couple of years, or maybe not. Due to this discussion, I will have an eager eye on the crowd numbers for Brookie for the rest of the season.

[langpark]

9 minutes ago, JonM said:

A shame that a local derby between the top two clubs was reduced to this.

Reduced to what? They still had a packed stadium for it. Looks like it was still a big success! 

[JonM]

6 minutes ago, langpark said:

Reduced to what? They still had a packed stadium for it. Looks like it was still a big success! 

It was essentially a friendly between reserve/youth teams, and Carcassonne created some negative publicity by moaning about the fact that it had to be played at all and about the date (even though both clubs agreed the date). It would've been much more of an occasion if it'd been able to be played on the original date.

Limoux played St. Gaudens yesterday too, but they will have to play a play-off game on Sunday whereas Albi & Carcassonne get the weekend off.

[langpark]

1 hour ago, JonM said:

It was essentially a friendly between reserve/youth teams, and Carcassonne created some negative publicity by moaning about the fact that it had to be played at all and about the date (even though both clubs agreed the date). It would've been much more of an occasion if it'd been able to be played on the original date.

Limoux played St. Gaudens yesterday too, but they will have to play a play-off game on Sunday whereas Albi & Carcassonne get the weekend off.

Right, thanks for the details. Well I am glad none of that seemed to deter the Albi public, who still turned out in big numbers!

[Damien]

 

 

[RayCee]

SL attendance progress report:

https://rugbyl.blogspot.com/2025/05/super-league-attendances-2025-rounds-1-9.html