NRL eye SL takeover

[hunsletgreenandgold]

1 hour ago, Father Gascoigne said:

In what sense? It's a boost in a sense they're getting new eyes on the game in a foreign territory. That said, I would be incredulous of any claim the Vegas exhibition is what's behind the positivity surrounding the early rounds of the SL season.

I think you're being disingenuous. Vegas has undoubtedly had a huge impact on the UK sporting landscape, in terms of coverage and interest. It's bigger than anything i've ever seen leading into a Magic Weekend and even in recent years, a Challenge Cup final. That's not to take away from the good start SL as a comp has had, but Vegas is the talk of the town.  

Edited February 27 by hunsletgreenandgold

[Dave T]

1 hour ago, hunsletgreenandgold said:

I think you're being disingenuous. Vegas has undoubtedly had a huge impact on the UK sporting landscape, in terms of coverage and interest. It's bigger than anything i've ever seen leading into a Magic Weekend and even in recent years, a Challenge Cup final. That's not to take away from the good start SL as a comp has had, but Vegas is the talk of the town.  

I tend to agree. I've been surprised by how much Sky have got behind this. I think it is a very positive development, and if the season had more of these each year it'd be hugely positive for the game here imo.

I do think Magic had this for a while, particularly when we were going taking over new cities. It's a reason I'm not a massive fan of just staying in Newcastle each year and it does just fly under the radar for most nowadays. Things being new create a buzz.

[Worzel]

10 hours ago, Dave T said:

I think its naive to just believe that the NRL get good deals because they are good negotiators and SL don't because they are poor negotiators.

This is true. The NRL get good deals because after the initial Pay TV boom what has happened in global sports rights is that the #1 sport in each market (geographic & seasonal) increasingly gets the lions share of Pay TV content investment, and then the secondary and tertiary sports are left fighting for the scraps based on their ability to bring additional niche audiences and/or fill the schedule. The NRL was slow to get to this "sellers market" position because the Super League War reduced its value, and subsequently for a long time it was part-owned by the media company paying for the rights (you don't need to be a genius to understand how that held fees back).

In the UK the #1 sport is the Premier League, in Australia that is the NRL and AFL (split geographically), in the USA that is the NFL and Baseball (split seasonally), in India its cricket, etc. etc.. It's the same in all media markets globally.

When Super League first launched that business model dynamic was yet to evolve (the Pay TV firms didn't know what they needed to do to drive value) so buyer behaviours were less focused, and there was a sense we could become a season bridge for football (in the way the NFL and Baseball seasons don't compete for media money). The latter component also disipated, as it became clear the summer blocks were in the main addressed by international football tournaments.

These are the structural drivers in TV rights values over the last 20 years. Yes, we could have done more to defend value as an attractive niche (we didn't need to fall to this low a base), but the NRL is not in any way a meaningful comparator for Super League... their benchmark here is the Premier League, as the #1 sport. 

[Damien]

V'landys on SL:

 

 

[Worzel]

Even if the NRL doesn’t invest in Super League, just knowing that V’Landys thinks like this is very positive. It should give us a sense his belief in the international game is strategic, rather than seeing it as a “nice to have”, and that it isn’t limited to the Pacific.

I think he knows that in the commercial battle the NRL is in, which is versus AFL for Australian Pay TV dollars, the international game offers the NRL a genuine differentiator. AFL TV rights are still significantly higher than NRL ones, bridging that gap is the opportunity he sees and what he is focused on. 

[Damien]

2 minutes ago, Worzel said:

Even if the NRL doesn’t invest in Super League, just knowing that V’Landys thinks like this is very positive. It should give us a sense his belief in the international game is strategic, rather than seeing it as a “nice to have”, and that it isn’t limited to the Pacific.

I think he knows that in the commercial battle the NRL is in, which is versus AFL for Australian Pay TV dollars, the international game offers the NRL a genuine differentiator. AFL TV rights are still significantly higher than NRL ones, bridging that gap is the opportunity he sees and what he is focused on. 

And this is getting back to the point I keep raising. We can have all of this without needing the NRL to take over SL. None of the failings on this front require a takeover.

[Damien]

Just to add as well actions really do speak louder than words. V'landys has talked a good game on the international front but has been found lacking when push comes to shove. If the NRL devoted 10% of what we have seen in Vegas to the WCC (which has gone out the window in 2024), internationals (when's the Ashes tour again?) and the World Cup we'd by flying.

Edited February 28 by Damien

[Damien]

5 minutes ago, back in the day said:

Surely the WCC and NRL double header has to be held in Las Vegas over 2 days.

It's always been the natural solution to a few problems. I suspect the sticking point is that the NRL wouldn't want the WCC undermining the NRL.

[gingerjon]

11 minutes ago, Damien said:

It's always been the natural solution to a few problems. I suspect the sticking point is that the NRL wouldn't want the WCC undermining the NRL.

It’s a really bad idea.

[Worzel]

1 hour ago, Damien said:

Just to add as well actions really do speak louder than words. V'landys has talked a good game on the international front but has been found lacking when push comes to shove. If the NRL devoted 10% of what we have seen in Vegas to the WCC (which has gone out the window in 2024), internationals (when's the Ashes tour again?) and the World Cup we'd by flying.

I do see actions. His organisation has built a Pacific comp from scratch. They’ve also recognised that an Ashes series here is in the interests of the UK game, and so offered to switch it. The fact the   RFL haven’t yet been able to confirm one is more likely to be down to issues on this side of the world I think. 

[gingerjon]

1 minute ago, back in the day said:

How so??

The WCC should be a stand alone event. Vegas does not need more hurled at it.

Those two reasons make “stick the WCC onto Vegas” a poor idea. It holds both events back rather than adding to either.

[gingerjon]

Just now, back in the day said:

The WCC is dead in the water whilst the NRL sticks with its Vegas extravaganza.

Then it should remain dead.

[Anita Bath]

1 hour ago, Worzel said:

I do see actions. His organisation has built a Pacific comp from scratch. They’ve also recognised that an Ashes series here is in the interests of the UK game, and so offered to switch it. The fact the   RFL haven’t yet been able to confirm one is more likely to be down to issues on this side of the world I think. 

And the NRL has yet to confirm the 2025 Pacific comp.

[Worzel]

3 hours ago, gingerjon said:

The WCC should be a stand alone event. Vegas does not need more hurled at it.

Those two reasons make “stick the WCC onto Vegas” a poor idea. It holds both events back rather than adding to either.

We need to be realistic. There will be no WCC whilst there’s a successful Las Vegas. The latter is becoming the most successful NRL season launch strategy ever, and that is what the NRL want from it.

The only future for the WCC is within that model. We either lean-in and campaign for it, or we accept that the WCC is done. 

[Worzel]

2 hours ago, Anita Bath said:

And the NRL has yet to confirm the 2025 Pacific comp.

I’m not sure there was ever meant to be one with Australia competing in the Ashes? Surely it would be a fallow year by design?

[gingerjon]

5 minutes ago, Worzel said:

We need to be realistic. There will be no WCC whilst there’s a successful Las Vegas. The latter is becoming the most successful NRL season launch strategy ever, and that is what the NRL want from it.

The only future for the WCC is within that model. We either lean-in and campaign for it, or we accept that the WCC is done. 

We need to be realistic. In three years time, the season launch for the NRL will not be in Las Vegas.

[The Rocket]

3 minutes ago, Worzel said:

We need to be realistic. There will be no WCC whilst there’s a successful Las Vegas. The latter is becoming the most successful NRL season launch strategy ever, and that is what the NRL want from it.

The only future for the WCC is within that model. We either lean-in and campaign for it, or we accept that the WCC is done. 

It`ll happen and especially after this week with V`landys and Abdo seeing the passion that the English fans bring, I`ve no doubt they`ll be discussing how they can fit it into the calendar.

 

[Click]

10 minutes ago, Worzel said:

We need to be realistic. There will be no WCC whilst there’s a successful Las Vegas. The latter is becoming the most successful NRL season launch strategy ever, and that is what the NRL want from it.

The only future for the WCC is within that model. We either lean-in and campaign for it, or we accept that the WCC is done. 

That is quite a defeatist attitude to have,

Especially when the facts say that out of 2 Vegas events in 2 years, one of those years also had the WCC that was in no way related to Vegas.

Surely it would be more dependent on who the NRL is sending to Vegas and if they are also the NRL champions?

[Sports Prophet]

The obvious reason why the WCC is not played in Vegas is because the NRL clubs picked for the opening round are decided well before the team who would compete in the Challenge Cup is decided.

I guess you could announce a fifth club as a reserve, should a club chosen for the opening round in Vegas actually go on to win the NRL title.

I’ve always said the WCC as a season opener devalues the fixture and its meaning. With a more certain international calendar in place, you could perhaps play the match after the respective GFs in the same location (Australasia or Europe) depending where the end of season internationals will be played. Difficult in a WC year though.

[Worzel]

25 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

We need to be realistic. In three years time, the season launch for the NRL will not be in Las Vegas.

Sure. It might be somewhere else that creates an even bigger noise, or still in Vegas. It will be somewhere as part of an event like this though. The genie isn’t going back into the bottle.

You think the NRL cares about a stand-alone WCC between its winner and the winner of a second-tier comp? Come on 

[Sports Prophet]

1 minute ago, Worzel said:

 

You think the NRL cares about a stand-alone WCC between its winner and the winner of a second-tier comp? Come on 

Hold on everyone, let me just get my popcorn please

[Worzel]

3 minutes ago, Sports Prophet said:

Hold on everyone, let me just get my popcorn please

The truth hurts. I’m here for it! 

[Sports Prophet]

8 minutes ago, Worzel said:

The truth hurts. I’m here for it! 

It isn’t as strong a comp as the NRL, that is true, but in fairness, it does have strong clubs which could compete in the NRL week in week out, but the standard in SL really does fall off a cliff as you reach the bottom few clubs.

Despite that, I would still call it a first tier comp.

[Worzel]

13 minutes ago, Sports Prophet said:

It isn’t as strong a comp as the NRL, that is true, but in fairness, it does have strong clubs which could compete in the NRL week in week out, but the standard in SL really does fall off a cliff as you reach the bottom few clubs.

Despite that, I would still call it a first tier comp.

It’s a first tier comp, by definition, within its geography. But only 3 clubs at present could compete consistently with NRL sides, and only one of them would be in the top half of the table. That’s just how money, participation pyramids and frankly gravity works.

Eveyone knows that really. 

[Anita Bath]

5 hours ago, Worzel said:

I’m not sure there was ever meant to be one with Australia competing in the Ashes? Surely it would be a fallow year by design?

So the entire southern hemisphere comes to a halt because australia might be in UK. I think that would confirm the suspicions many have of the NRL commitment to the international game. “its all about us”…there will be a pacific championship when it suits the NRL.