Sun 9th Mar: SL: Warrington Wolves v Wakefield Trinity KO 13:00 (SS+/SL+)

[dboy]

Powell is completely open that he was brought in by Wire to "clean house" and change the culture.

That was what he was tasked to do, but player-power won out in the end.

At a Wakey fans' forum he was absolutely clear that he would never take on such a task again. He says that was his biggest mistake at Wire.

Edited March 9 by dboy

[Dave T]

4 minutes ago, dboy said:

Powell is completely open that he was brought in by Wire to "clean house" and change the culture.

That was what he was tasked to do, but player-power won out in the end.

At a Wakey fans' forum he was absolutely clear that he would never take on such a task again. He says that was his biggest mistake at Wire.

I mean, that's just a bloke who got sacked saying it was everyone else's fault and the only mistake he made was taking the job.

He ruthlessly outed players who went elsewhere and did a great job, as they had done with Wire previously.

[dboy]

Only repeating what he said in open forum.

It sounds to me like Wire knew they had problems, tried to fix the problems, players didn't want the problems solving, the solution to the problems was sacked and, crucially, it looks like the problems remain.

Go figure, eh?

[Just Browny]

Fair play to Powell for admitting that he made a pig's ear of his job.

[Dave T]

2 minutes ago, dboy said:

Only repeating what he said in open forum.

It sounds to me like Wire knew they had problems, tried to fix the problems, players didn't want the problems solving, the solution to the problems was sacked and, crucially, it looks like the problems remain.

Go figure, eh?

But this is the point - did the problems remain last year? Because nobody was saying this then. 

When we pushed Price apparently to change the culture we had a completely different team. 

[Dave T]

What i would add, there are quite a few threads from two years back on this where these arguments were done. I wonder whether the Wakey fans were so defensive of him then. 

Wayne Bennett is a brilliant coach, but he was a car crash on that GB tour. The most successful SL coaches often move on and don't do well elsewhere. 

It isn't anywhere near as simple as a coach is good so their teams always do well. It's almost as though there are all sorts of factors at play.

[dboy]

5 minutes ago, Dave T said:

But this is the point - did the problems remain last year? Because nobody was saying this then. 

When we pushed Price apparently to change the culture we had a completely different team. 

I'm not arguing with you, nor am I defending Powell.

I'm just saying what he said, and it's what many others have said TBF.

The people involved know exactly what the situation was/is.

Bottom line is, in the context of today's match thread, the best team won.

I don't know where Wire's problems lie - they are a talented squad - but they ain't performing like one.

[Padge]

7 minutes ago, Dave T said:

What i would add, there are quite a few threads from two years back on this where these arguments were done. I wonder whether the Wakey fans were so defensive of him then. 

Wayne Bennett is a brilliant coach, but he was a car crash on that GB tour. The most successful SL coaches often move on and don't do well elsewhere. 

It isn't anywhere near as simple as a coach is good so their teams always do well. It's almost as though there are all sorts of factors at play.

It is a club culture thing I believe.

From owner (shareholders), down to board, through to coaching staff. They all have to be on the same page. If any single part of the structure is not following the same path then things can quickly fall apart. This isn't saying that at Warrington this isn't happening, but if it is then they may have to look at the path they are on.

 

[watcherofRL]

1 hour ago, Wilderspoolmemories said:

Well that was awful. 

Even when we've won this year we haven't looked good. Last week was bad and this week even worse. There was a opportunity to bounce back and those players didn't have the stomach to take the chance. I don't accept injuries as an excuse as all teams have injuries. If we are totally weakened by losing 3 players then there's something wrong. 

Our pack isn't big enough and gets bullied every week. Burgess said he wasn't bothered about size in his forwards providing they were mobile. Well if that pack is mobile, we are in trouble. What we need is a front row which contains a modern day Les Boyd, Kevin Tamati, Adrian Morley, Gareth Carvell or two. A pack that is dominated every week like we are will more than likely lose every week. 

We need someone in the halves to take some of the workload off Williams as well. There's no confusion for the opposition late in the tackle count when we have the ball, it's going to Williams. Cut down his options and you cut down Warrington's options. 

Wakefield were fairly good and played with effort and commitment. They didn't have to be brilliant, their opponents had no effort or commitment. If every Warrington player hand on heart can say 'i did my best' then we can get ready for the championship next season. I've  already given up any ideas about Wembley or old Trafford......we simply aren't good enough. 

We need an overhaul ( again) starting at the top. Fitzpatrick is an ex player and has no business background. We need a business minded chief exec who knows that success is built on hard work from top to bottom, not on gimmicks and smiling faces as people board the plane ready to be humiliated in America. 

There are no positives to take, unless you count the upcoming return of wireflyer( the man in the green suit who races fans at half time), or a pre match pint offer of £5 a go. It's that bad!

Warrington, for a supposedly wealthy and well run club you are very quickly( once again) becoming the joke team of SL. 

Widnes may well dump us out of the cup next week if we play like we did today. That might be a blessing in disguise, someone at the top might realise that the more you paper over a crack, the bigger that crack can become. 

The players got rid of Powell, but he had the last laugh today. He got castleford working hard and playing well and he's doing the same at Wakefield, so I don't think he was the problem at Warrington.

Having a honorary pack is important as hard to make things happen when this isn’t the case. Did you never think that the game plan was to always goes through Williams which means Leyland and Ratchford are just making up numbers! At least leyland has a decent kicking game and in his full SL season last year with a smaller less experienced pack he was able to create things as he had autonomy- this is clearly not the case with Wire’s game plan. I fear for Hayes too - he filled the gap defensively but did the same thing as is asked of the 2 HB who played this year! 10 games and short memories means some fans are pinning their hopes on his return and will turn on him if things go wrong! Burgess needs to change his plans and mix it up 

[dboy]

I would add that Powell and Ste Mills (recruitment), make a big thing of doing "due diligence" on potential new signings.

They always talk about adding the right "characters" to the squad, not the best players.

[Dave T]

2 minutes ago, Padge said:

It is a club culture thing I believe.

From owner (shareholders), down to board, through to coaching staff. They all have to be on the same page. If any single part of the structure is not following the same path then things can quickly fall apart. This isn't saying that at Warrington this isn't happening, but if it is then they may have to look at the path they are on.

 

I agree. However, and i will leave this as my last post because it's not really the right thread  but also I've been consistent on this for years.

If we look at the last 15 years ago Wire have made loads of finals and won some lost some. We've lost every Grand Final, but often by a score or two in very good tight RL tussles. This is also a club who has two hugely successful RL towns and clubs on its doorstep so is down the pecking order for players, fans etc.

In reality, in a sliding doors experiment, with the odd bit of luck we'd have a few more titles to our name and culture doesn't become a regular topic. I feel it's a slight cliche that is being used. 

For me, it's just sport, I'm not arguing culture isn't a huge factor, but so are many other factors - Leeds' culture is hardly doing them any favours right now for example.

[Padge]

1 minute ago, Dave T said:

I agree. However, and i will leave this as my last post because it's not really the right thread  but also I've been consistent on this for years.

If we look at the last 15 years ago Wire have made loads of finals and won some lost some. We've lost every Grand Final, but often by a score or two in very good tight RL tussles. This is also a club who has two hugely successful RL towns and clubs on its doorstep so is down the pecking order for players, fans etc.

In reality, in a sliding doors experiment, with the odd bit of luck we'd have a few more titles to our name and culture doesn't become a regular topic. I feel it's a slight cliche that is being used. 

For me, it's just sport, I'm not arguing culture isn't a huge factor, but so are many other factors - Leeds' culture is hardly doing them any favours right now for example.

Sounds like time for a new thread.

[Dave T]

Just now, Padge said:

Sounds like time for a new thread.

No. Let's talk about something less depressing

Saints also lost!

[-Trinity-]

19 minutes ago, dboy said:

I'm not arguing with you, nor am I defending Powell.

I'm just saying what he said, and it's what many others have said TBF.

The people involved know exactly what the situation was/is.

Bottom line is, in the context of today's match thread, the best team won.

I don't know where Wire's problems lie - they are a talented squad - but they ain't performing like one.

I was at the same fans forum, and Powell did opened up about his time at Wire and was genuinely quite upset and spoke about how he was following order from above. I'm so pleased for him today, he's a top bloke.

Edited March 9 by -Trinity-

[Just Browny]

6 minutes ago, -Trinity- said:

I was at the same fans forum, and Powell did opened up about his time at Wire and was genuinely quite upset and spoke about how he was following order from above. I'm so pleased for him today, he's a top bloke.

So what was his preference - not to tackle this supposedly rotten culture?

There's very little about this version of events that makes sense. He got rid of a tonne of players, fine. He then replaced them with a tonne of players who seemed to have even worse attitudes (McGuire) or be loyal but not good enough (Matautia). Many of those he got shut of - presumably to clean things up - have gone on to play miles better at other clubs (Mulhern, Hughes, Charnley, Davis etc etc).

[dboy]

The problem wasn't the players he got rid of - it was the players who remained who got rid of him.

Can we get back to the thread - Wakey deservedly won today.

Well done Wakey.

[Just Browny]

3 minutes ago, dboy said:

The problem wasn't the players he got rid of - it was the players who remained who got rid of him.

Can we get back to the thread - Wakey deservedly won today.

Well done Wakey.

Sounds like he got rid of the wrong ones then.

I agree on the second part.

[Dave T]

10 minutes ago, Just Browny said:

So what was his preference - not to tackle this supposedly rotten culture?

There's very little about this version of events that makes sense. He got rid of a tonne of players, fine. He then replaced them with a tonne of players who seemed to have even worse attitudes (McGuire) or be loyal but not good enough (Matautia). Many of those he got shut of - presumably to clean things up - have gone on to play miles better at other clubs (Mulhern, Hughes, Charnley, Davis etc etc).

The Matuatia episode is the single biggest thing I'll be critical of Powell for.

[dboy]

3 minutes ago, Dave T said:

The Matuatia episode is the single biggest thing I'll be critical of Powell for.

As a non-Warringtonian, can you explain what that was?

[Agbrigg]

At the end of the day Wire have lost a game to a side that many have underrated and many still do. Its not the end of the world and I am sure wire will win more than they lose this season. If todays loss had been against a more 'fashionable' side I dont think there would be so much doom and gloom.

 

[moorside roughyed]

On 07/03/2025 at 21:50, moorside roughyed said:

Wire must forget and move on from the Wigan game. Wakefield will see this as an opportunity for a win with all that's gone on.Come on Warrington,come on you Wire. Wire by 12.

Totally wrong on that one. Had to leave after 20 minutes ( 7 month old grandson kicking off,too loud for him). Sounds like I didn't miss much talking to some Wire fans in town after the game. Pretty grim.

[OMEGA]

Whatever the internal politics and wranglings of Warrington Wolves they got soundly outplayed by Wakefield today!

Whilst there was some competition in the first 20 minutes it was the Wakefield Trinity pack that came out well on top. Just too big, too strong and also a bit too mobile. I’ll throw in that they handled the ball better as well as the Matty Russell try shows with Atoni and Vangana both showing good hands and awareness.

Once on top it was typical Powell expansive play that got Trinity on the outside of Wires defence over and over. Trying to play expansive doesn’t work unless you’ve earned the right by winning the middle and then you need hard working edge players to unselfishly run lines so that the half backs can play out the back and test edge defences. Wakefield are doing that really well and it’s a superb team effort that making it happen.

Wakefield are still without 5 genuine starters so they’re proving to have some depth of quality and talent in the squad.

[Just Browny]

13 minutes ago, Agbrigg said:

At the end of the day Wire have lost a game to a side that many have underrated and many still do. Its not the end of the world and I am sure wire will win more than they lose this season. If todays loss had been against a more 'fashionable' side I dont think there would be so much doom and gloom.

 

Did the Wakefield fans underestimate their side? Very few made the trip over on a sunny day.

I think you're right that a few people have taken Wakefield lightly. I expected a tough game.

[dboy]

1 minute ago, Just Browny said:

Did the Wakefield fans underestimate their side? Very few made the trip over on a sunny day.

I think you're right that a few people have taken Wakefield lightly. I expected a tough game.

Very few??

Maybe 500? 

Yeah there should always be more.

Don't forget - we are Wakey - the new boys - unfashionable, we know our place.

I think Wakey fans travel in hope, rather than expectation.

Maybe this will change

[RigbyLuger]

Waiting for the press to criticise Burgess, unless they're scared or in awe of him.