World Club Challenge Development

[The British Lion]

First of all, huge congrats to HKR for their win. It was uncomfortable watching in the last 20, but they did enough to hold on and what an incredible achievement! Sold out stadium, and passionate support - well done!

I had some thoughts following on from this game, and, please I know the general ambiguity we see from the NRL over this fixture. There are people who think it should be played following the respective NRL and SL Grand Finals  - Im not one of them, I think it sits as a great season starter to be honest. Where it should be played and maximising the interest etc.

But now - we have a really interesting expanded global team rep teams to take advantage of.

Could RL potentially capitalise on this.

Catalans, Toulouse

New Zealand Warriors

PNG NRL side

These teams to compete in a short comp and the finalists to be a curtain raiser to the WCC? Just to begin with - and have a strategy to expand a WCC? In this time assuming none of them have earned the right / won a NRL or SL title, could this be something to kick start a global challenge? I'd love to see this develop, personally.

 

[N2022]

8 minutes ago, The British Lion said:

First of all, huge congrats to HKR for their win. It was uncomfortable watching in the last 20, but they did enough to hold on and what an incredible achievement! Sold out stadium, and passionate support - well done!

I had some thoughts following on from this game, and, please I know the general ambiguity we see from the NRL over this fixture. There are people who think it should be played following the respective NRL and SL Grand Finals  - Im not one of them, I think it sits as a great season starter to be honest. Where it should be played and maximising the interest etc.

But now - we have a really interesting expanded global team rep teams to take advantage of.

Could RL potentially capitalise on this.

Catalans, Toulouse

New Zealand Warriors

PNG NRL side

These teams to compete in a short comp and the finalists to be a curtain raiser to the WCC? Just to begin with - and have a strategy to expand a WCC? In this time assuming none of them have earned the right / won a NRL or SL title, could this be something to kick start a global challenge? I'd love to see this develop, personally.

 

Nice idea ... but 

1 I'm not sure there's time for a tournament there

2 I'd rather have internationals

[The British Lion]

1 minute ago, N2022 said:

Nice idea ... but 

1 I'm not sure there's time for a tournament there

2 I'd rather have internationals

I too would rather have internationals 100% - hard enough in itself right?! Just an idea 

[Coggo]

The World Club Challenge is a glorified pre-season exhibition game that the British clubs put everything into but the Aussies treat as a warm-up for the NRL.

The frequent wins by more battle-hardened English clubs mask to some extent the now six-decade uncompetitiveness of British sides against the Kangaroos, and make us feel that we’re not miles behind a national competition that will soon have central funding per club larger than the entire Super League gets per season. 

What was the question again?

[Adelaide Tiger]

5 hours ago, Coggo said:

The World Club Challenge is a glorified pre-season exhibition game that the British clubs put everything into but the Aussies treat as a warm-up for the NRL.

The frequent wins by more battle-hardened English clubs mask to some extent the now six-decade uncompetitiveness of British sides against the Kangaroos, and make us feel that we’re not miles behind a national competition that will soon have central funding per club larger than the entire Super League gets per season. 

What was the question again?

I think most people on this forum would agree that the NRL is a far stronger overall competition than the SL and that one quite magnificent result - oooops, three years running - does not mean the gap between the competitions has narrowed.

But, ever since the WCC concept began on an annual basis we get the same old ar$e gravy from NRL teams.  This year Rovers had played two competitive games - TWO - and that is if you include the titanic bash-a-thon against mighty Lock Lane.  And that makes them battle-hardened?  What about these superhuman NRL players, fresh as a daisy, unable to beat a team of a few pommies and NRL cast offs?

If an NRL teams wins the WCC they say it is because the SL is second rate but if they lose it is because they couldn't care.  Verbal tom-####.  I listen to it most years over here.

The Aussies are the biggest whingers whenever one of their teams fail.  The Aussie cricket team have just got their backsides spanked and failed to get out of their group at the 20/20 WC.  Is there an inquisition?  Is it time for self reflection? Instead sports presenters are claiming 'It doesn't matter because no one cares about the tournament'.

 

[Pulga]

I want to preface this by saying that I am an Aussie that quite likes the WCC. Unfortunately, it is true that it means very little here. It's a catch 22 where if the English win it'll be seen as a warm-up game that the Aussie players themselves don't care about but if Australia win it'll be seen as the obvious result from a far better competition.

I don't have the answer that will change things.

[gingerjon]

Given that the game is essentially dependent on the two clubs agreeing, is there anything to stop other clubs in SL arranging friendlies/challenge matches against other NRL teams that same weekend?

[Eddie]

5 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

Given that the game is essentially dependent on the two clubs agreeing, is there anything to stop other clubs in SL arranging friendlies/challenge matches against other NRL teams that same weekend?

Yes the SL clubs have fixtures arranged. Plus the WCC series was expended a while back it was ######. 

[Tommygilf]

35 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

Given that the game is essentially dependent on the two clubs agreeing, is there anything to stop other clubs in SL arranging friendlies/challenge matches against other NRL teams that same weekend?

This is what is wrong and is also indicative of why our international schedule hit such a problem too. The Leagues/NGBs should be the ones invested in these games/events (like we had with the tri/4 nations), not club to club on an ad hoc basis (like we have had with random bilateral tours).

That would allow expansion or relocation of the tournament to be centrally driven rather than on an ad hoc basis. It would also prevent NRL clubs refusing to play.

[The Rocket]

1 hour ago, Pulga said:

I want to preface this by saying that I am an Aussie that quite likes the WCC. Unfortunately, it is true that it means very little here. It's a catch 22 where if the English win it'll be seen as a warm-up game that the Aussie players themselves don't care about but if Australia win it'll be seen as the obvious result from a far better competition.

I don't have the answer that will change things.

I think the fact that the Super League team has won the last three contests has given the contest a bit of cred and would lead it to being a successfully marketable event if it was played in OZ next year, it`d probably have to pre-season again but I don`t think that would affect it`s drawing potential.

[gingerjon]

29 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

This is what is wrong and is also indicative of why our international schedule hit such a problem too. The Leagues/NGBs should be the ones invested in these games/events (like we had with the tri/4 nations), not club to club on an ad hoc basis (like we have had with random bilateral tours).

That would allow expansion or relocation of the tournament to be centrally driven rather than on an ad hoc basis. It would also prevent NRL clubs refusing to play.

Indeed. But given we are where we are - with clubs choosing to play in Vegas, play in WCCs, play wherever, and the RFL bending to that - there is nothing to stop any of them ringing up Sydney Roosters and challenging them to a rumble at the Jungle.

[Coggo]

4 hours ago, Adelaide Tiger said:

I think most people on this forum would agree that the NRL is a far stronger overall competition than the SL and that one quite magnificent result - oooops, three years running - does not mean the gap between the competitions has narrowed.

But, ever since the WCC concept began on an annual basis we get the same old ar$e gravy from NRL teams.  This year Rovers had played two competitive games - TWO - and that is if you include the titanic bash-a-thon against mighty Lock Lane.  And that makes them battle-hardened?  What about these superhuman NRL players, fresh as a daisy, unable to beat a team of a few pommies and NRL cast offs?

If an NRL teams wins the WCC they say it is because the SL is second rate but if they lose it is because they couldn't care.  Verbal tom-####.  I listen to it most years over here.

The Aussies are the biggest whingers whenever one of their teams fail.  The Aussie cricket team have just got their backsides spanked and failed to get out of their group at the 20/20 WC.  Is there an inquisition?  Is it time for self reflection? Instead sports presenters are claiming 'It doesn't matter because no one cares about the tournament'.

 

There will be no self-reflection among our antipodean cousins other than the need for a warm-up game or move it away from February.

Of course, there won't be a warm-up because the World Club Challenge is a pre-season glorified exhibition game.

Maybe they should move it to Las Vegas? Well, they could and maybe should. But moving it to a neutral venue in the regular season would of course make it much less likely that the English team wins.

So maybe they should leave it where it is, and we can all delude ourselves that we're not light years behind the NRL.

Edited February 24 by Coggo

[The Hallucinating Goose]

10 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

Indeed. But given we are where we are - with clubs choosing to play in Vegas, play in WCCs, play wherever, and the RFL bending to that - there is nothing to stop any of them ringing up Sydney Roosters and challenging them to a rumble at the Jungle.

Christ, can you imagine how many the Roosters would put on Cas? 

[Coggo]

1 hour ago, Pulga said:

I want to preface this by saying that I am an Aussie that quite likes the WCC. Unfortunately, it is true that it means very little here. It's a catch 22 where if the English win it'll be seen as a warm-up game that the Aussie players themselves don't care about but if Australia win it'll be seen as the obvious result from a far better competition.

I don't have the answer that will change things.

Not sure there is other than leave it where it is and we can all enjoy it for what it is.

Those calling for a super shiny big-big World Club Challenge haven't thought it through.

A World Club Challenge worth the NRL taking seriously is a World Club Challenge that English teams lose more often than not. 

Be careful what you wish for.
 

Edited February 24 by Coggo

[Dunbar]

11 hours ago, Coggo said:

The World Club Challenge is a glorified pre-season exhibition game that the British clubs put everything into but the Aussies treat as a warm-up for the NRL.

The frequent wins by more battle-hardened English clubs mask to some extent the now six-decade uncompetitiveness of British sides against the Kangaroos, and make us feel that we’re not miles behind a national competition that will soon have central funding per club larger than the entire Super League gets per season. 

What was the question again?

I was so pleased that Hull KR won the WCC this year. For several reasons, but not least that if this is the stuff you come up with when the English side wins, it would have been unbearable if the NRL side actually came out on top.

[dufftown1]

54 minutes ago, Coggo said:

Not sure there is other than leave it where it is and we can all enjoy it for what it is.

Those calling for a super shiny big-big World Club Challenge haven't thought it through.

A World Club Challenge worth the NRL taking seriously is a World Club Challenge that English teams lose more often than not. 

Be careful what you wish for.
 

Why is losing more often than not a problem?

[Trojan Horse]

I’d like to see an end of season game like Magic weekend at one venue where the top 6 in SL play top 6 in NRL. 3 games in one stadium. 

[dufftown1]

The gap between the NRL and SL is big but its not gargantuan.

The best SL sides would compete in the NRL. They would struggle with the depth etc of a full season nut would be competitive. Top 4 or 5 in SL would probably be somewhere around mid table. 

The rest yeah would probably struggle and be near the bottom but someone always is. 

I also think its wrong to think that position is static. As an extreme case, if SL and NRL.were to merge or 6 teams were to join or there was some kind of champions league style regular competition, the horizon of SL would change. Money, visibility etc would come in and SL clubs would structure themselves to compete at that level and get closer. 

The WCC attracts money, fans, eyeballs. Like internationals it is a shortcut to the casual and the neutral. It is one of two areas we need to dream big and think long term. So of course we dont. 

[RP London]

Before we start adding to it I think we need to make sure it has a place in the calendar that is untouchable.. I'd also say we need to decide what it really is, as a game too. 

For me we should be looking to build it as the "super bowl".. 2 conferences of the same league playing each other to determine the true "world champions".. I think you can build something big out of that.. 

Perhaps it is as it is and billed still as the world championship.. 

but the key is we have to decide what it is we want from the game IMHO before we start to look at what we can tack onto the side of it (which is very RL)... maybe just maybe a one off stand alone game, billed properly and developed can be all we need (rather than an expanded comp).

[BroncoFan]

6 hours ago, Adelaide Tiger said:

I think most people on this forum would agree that the NRL is a far stronger overall competition than the SL and that one quite magnificent result - oooops, three years running - does not mean the gap between the competitions has narrowed.

But, ever since the WCC concept began on an annual basis we get the same old ar$e gravy from NRL teams.  This year Rovers had played two competitive games - TWO - and that is if you include the titanic bash-a-thon against mighty Lock Lane.  And that makes them battle-hardened?  What about these superhuman NRL players, fresh as a daisy, unable to beat a team of a few pommies and NRL cast offs?

If an NRL teams wins the WCC they say it is because the SL is second rate but if they lose it is because they couldn't care.  Verbal tom-####.  I listen to it most years over here.

The Aussies are the biggest whingers whenever one of their teams fail.  The Aussie cricket team have just got their backsides spanked and failed to get out of their group at the 20/20 WC.  Is there an inquisition?  Is it time for self reflection? Instead sports presenters are claiming 'It doesn't matter because no one cares about the tournament'.

 

KR didn’t even play their first team against Lock Lane so they actually had one game before the took on the Broncos who have 4x their salary cap.

[hunsletgreenandgold]

2 hours ago, Coggo said:

There will be no self-reflection among our antipodean cousins other than the need for a warm-up game or move it away from February.

Of course, there won't be a warm-up because the World Club Challenge is a pre-season glorified exhibition game.

Maybe they should move it to Las Vegas? Well, they could and maybe should. But moving it to a neutral venue in the regular season would of course make it much less likely that the English team wins.

So maybe they should leave it where it is, and we can all delude ourselves that we're not light years behind the NRL.

I'm also certain you've never played a game of RL in your life - just an armchair warrior. It's telling when I read the nonsense you post compared to the hurt in Reece Walsh's face at the full time hooter. 

[Coggo]

4 minutes ago, hunsletgreenandgold said:

I'm also certain you've never played a game of RL in your life - just an armchair warrior. It's telling when I read the nonsense you post compared to the hurt in Reece Walsh's face at the full time hooter. 

I play and watch both codes of rugby, Masters/Vets and open age. I've played Masters RL for England and represented Great Britain at TTR (tag).  

Edited February 24 by Coggo

[hunsletgreenandgold]

5 minutes ago, Coggo said:

I play and watch both codes of rugby, Masters/Vets and open age. I've played Masters RL for England and represented Great Britain at TTR (tag).  

............did ye aye? Okay champion.

 

Quite the achievement to still be so clueless then - fair play. 

Edited February 24 by hunsletgreenandgold

[Worzel]

Great article from Gavin W on the World Club Challenge in the Guardian today, making the argument for why this fixture should be locked in rather than a discretionary event

 

Edited February 24 by Worzel

[RP London]

47 minutes ago, Worzel said:

Great article from Gavin W on the World Club Challenge in the Guardian today, making the argument for why this fixture should be locked in rather than a discretionary event

 

I was saying very similar to my RL group of mates on the weekend.... Just play the game, a one off world championship and make it the biggest game it can be.