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Toby Chopra

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Posts posted by Toby Chopra

  1. 2 hours ago, The Blues Ox said:

    Yep up there with the worst draws apart from maybe London away. Club loses money and Cats probably one of the last teams you want to play on a heavy pitch where their forwards will just batter ours. I'd honestly consider switching this game to France if Fax could make the money work for them.

    Why would Fax lose money on the game? I get there wouldn't be many away fans but surely more locals than normal would turn out to see one of the top Superleague teams?

    • Like 1
  2. 45 minutes ago, Dave T said:

    So, four weeks in, how's it working for people?

    I must admit, I'm loving it. Watched more RL on TV than ever, and am really enjoying having a steady stream of SL through the weekend. I haven't used SL+ so can't comment on that

    Positives:

    Loads of SL! I no longer have to wonder what the TV game is - they all are!

    Enjoy multi-match Friday nights (guaranteed I'll be interested in at least one game)

    Great highlights online

    Better commentary overall as we've split up 'the mob' to cover more games.

    Full match repeats - always RL on Sky Sports

    Great BBC coverage

     

    Negatives:

    The Friday night overlap is a positive in many ways, but it isn't as enjoyable flicking through games as too much goes on in RL to lend itself to that. I'm coming round to 1 match per slot.

    Whisper this one - spoilers 🤣

    Some average production - fewer angles, poor Video Ref coverage, some below average commentary at times.

     

    For me, it's been a great success - I expect numbers are modest, but having so much coverage guaranteed, all produced at a solid level (not perfect), and as someone who watches much of my RL on TV, I'm loving it. This is absolutely enough to make me never cancel Sky Sports.

    Are other people enjoying it too?

    Agree wholeheartedly with your analysis, and if the experts tell us that this is good for growth then I'm all for it. 

    It hasn't really resulted in me watching any more rugby league, two or three SL games a week is enough for me, usually the Thursday and Friday games. So it's nice to have the choice on a Friday and I have switched games a couple of times when the first choice became a bit of a procession.

    I'm planning to try and catch a bit more NRL this year in the mornings.

    • Like 1
  3. 2 hours ago, Dave T said:

    Obviously people like this are often pretty secretive about their wealth, but I wonder how poor he and his business are at the moment? 

    My understanding is that due to the 'unique' way TWP we're organised, they struggled to get government support through the various schemes, so costs were substantial, and they have sympathy for that. But I think it would be a little blind to ignore the fact that their start to life in SL had been a car crash and they put all their eggs in the SBW basket. 

    Agree. Perhaps, if COVID hadn't happened, there was some sort of plan that would have monetised a global rugby star to fix the holes in the TWP business model, but the price of that was a much worse team overall, and that rarely ends well. 

    I look back on it all with a fond memory of idealistic dreams, like most things pre-2020!

  4. 1 hour ago, fighting irish said:

    I'm not saying it was right to leave people ''high and dry'' 'Arry, but I'm not prepared to turn a blind eye to the way he was treated by Robert Elstone, as if it was immaterial in his decision to stop pouring millions into the game. 

    Like most things Robert Elstone did, it made very little difference overall.

    • Haha 1
  5. 5 hours ago, OriginalMrC said:

    Where are they getting the players from for this venture? Been here before haven't we 

    Overall it sounds like a massive scam to me ($1.5mn please guv, here's your "team", see ya)

    But if it is legit, and did get some traction, the unfortunate truth is that the English game would be pillaged for players in the early years and serious damage would be done.

    • Like 1
  6. 2 hours ago, PREPOSTEROUS said:

    Was The Hive ever any good for London? I note Barnet FC are planning on returning to Underhill and i imagine the stadium will be lookin for a new tenant. Perhaps its somewhere they can start to put down roots. I read they're paying a fair whack to be at Wimbledon. 

    On the plus side it's a short walk from a tube station and 5 minutes from the M1, so quite accessible for both London and Northern fans. The area itself isn't prime audience building territory, but staying anywhere for more than a couple of years and not putting out an awful team probably matters more.

    It wouldn't be the worst option if Hughes/anyone else wanted to put together a proper multi-year plan.

  7. 2 hours ago, Tre Cool said:

    well no, he's recently made a statement on his reasons for voting for IMG and that he now thinks some changes need to be considered.

    It's still deflection though. Even if London were given maximum points for catchment, and if academy was included in foundation spend they'd still be miles off a place.

    It pains me to say this because as a southerner I'd love the Broncos to be successful, but the facts on the state of the game in the south are hard to argue with.

    But we'll make the most of this year as it is - so far I'm going to be going to four games this season - and I think many southern rugby league fans will give it a go too, just to see top flight RL, if not the Broncos. So hopefully there will be some decent crowds and Plough Lane is a great little stadium, much better than Ealing for SL.

    But long term we need a proper plan for London RL.

    • Like 6
  8. A small anecdote, but for some reason his name is seared into my sporting memory from one of those many great games on Grandstand in the 80s - GB's draw with the Kiwis in 1985. Pinner was captain, and when Lee Crooks knocked over a last minute touchline penalty to draw the game and the series, I've never forgotten Ray French extolling "Look at the smile on Harry Pinner's face", and Pinner indeed with a huge grin.

    • Like 1
  9. Will be interesting to see how it plays out, and whether SL+ grows the audience,or just cannibalises it, especially when Sky have it all anyway.

    I don't think you can underestimate how annoying the 48 hours blackout can become. I used to subscribe to NFL Gamepass for a few years, which allowed me to watch my own (rubbish) team that Sky rarely showed, plus use all the on-demand and catch up capability.

    But as you got later in the season, it became increasingly annoying - I had to stay off the news sites for a couple of days, and I couldn't watch live the top teams matchups in the run-in, and of course the playoffs, which Sky had live exclusivity over. 

    In the end, I dropped Gamepass, and went to NowTV all year round - less choice and flexibility, but ultimately the best games live.

  10. 11 minutes ago, EggFace said:

    Fans won't adapt to the changes so te RFL has just done a own goal....lets hope a backlash from the fans, players, coaches , owners, Twitter, Youtube and forums like this might make the RFL think again.

    Most fans won't have a problem. They'll still be able to watch their teams play rugby league, there will still be tackling and contact. It will just, possibly, look a bit different. It's not like it's the first time tackle laws have changed.

    I think people bind it up too much with their wider complaints about the game, or a more litigious culture. In reality, the sport will mostly carry on.

    My prediction is that come this time next year, more people will be complaining about the gradings than the tackling. 😁

    • Like 2
  11. 5 hours ago, Odsal Outlaw said:

    This is such a shame to see the direction the sport is heading in. Safety is important, but let’s also recognise that we sign up to play a sport with a level of risk. If someone gets hit on the head then send the offender off, but don’t start sanitising the game. 

    I remember when the shoulder charge was banned - also a poor decision.

    I wonder if boxing will force punches only below the armpit?

    The problem is saying the sport has "a level of risk" is too vague.

    We now know what the players we love to watch are signing up for is a heightened risk of brain damage and life long injury.

    Either the sport says that up front - like boxing has effectively done - or it takes action to reduce that risk.

    If we choose the boxing angle of being up front about it, the risk is that the full contact game in the UK slowly dies at a youth level. That's what I'm witnessing in union down here in Sussex. 

    So the alternative is to try and change the sport so we can faithfully say to people it's reasonably safe to pursue a career in it. 

    I'm not an expert. I don't know whether these tackle rules will have the desired effect. I'm seriously doubtful about the ability of the RFL managing this properly, and what the NRL does is crucial.

    But I also totally can see why they're doing something because the alternative of burying their heads in the sand and being destroyed in the courts is potentially even worse.

    • Like 1
  12. 1 hour ago, Archie Gordon said:

    Has the RFL said anything about this yet? What dispensation have they announced?

    I find it more than odd that clubs in, e.g., Tier 5 can have their applications rejected based on their ground but a SL club is accepted without having a ground at all.

    It really is shocking. Not so much the lack of statement - sometimes these things have to be dealt with behind closed doors - but the very fact that a club in the flagship league has got to within 3 months of season start without a binding stadium deal. No other comparable sports league allows this, the deadline is always prior to the end of the previous season. 

    Some people on here were getting hysterical about the gradings and how the situation regarding London would look etc, but all that was irrelevant compared to this.

    The RFL have seriously dropped the ball.

  13. 12 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

    It moves them to being a tenant of the same guy who owns them. That feels like a step forward, albeit not a massive one.

    Yes, it's potentially a small step forward in terms of the ground, as there wasn't much scope for growth at Penryn. But the RL club isn't going to be the main focus of the ownership group any more and so we'll have to see what effect that has. I don't know how much they've put in each season up to now. 

  14. Just now, Archie Gordon said:

    Perez is addressing that to the football fans who need reassuring. It's exactly what I would say to them.

    True, but I also think he means it. I don't think this is a Trojan Horse for rugby league.

    But I suppose we should see it all in perspective. It's still amazing that Cornwall RL has existed at all and every year they keep going - even as a tenant of Truro FC - is a win for rugby league. 

    • Like 5
  15. 3 minutes ago, iffleyox said:

    Just read that myself - feels like a ‘we’ve ended up in Cornwall and it’s shown us a massive opportunity we didn’t know about, let’s do football’

    Indeed.

    I suppose on the upside if the article is accurate they're not giving up on RL - they'll need another tenant for the stadium and with Pirates staying in Penzance there's opportunity for the RL side to carve a small niche.

    But it doesn't sound like the group will be pumping significant investment funds into the RL club, football is the focus for growth now and the RL club will have to wash it's own face, albeit with potentially a good stadium to work out of.

    Time will tell if Cornwall RL is embedded enough now to survive. I hope so.

    • Like 3
  16. 13 minutes ago, Coggo said:

    Perez buys Truro City FC

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/67546796

    I guess that confirms Cornwall will move to Truro when their new ground is ready.

    Not exactly the most inspiring quotes from Perez in terms of rugby league:

    "I don't think too many people would say 'let's buy a football club to support a rugby league club', I think that's a strange play to make," he said.

    "I'm a football fanatic, a lot of people on the group are football fanatics and we're here to take this club up, that's what we're here for.

    "If it wasn't for the rugby league club we wouldn't know about this operating environment so that is a factor, but we're talking football."

     

    • Like 3
  17. 39 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

    Such a shame in very recent times Salford have been up there playing some very attractive football, been Grand Finalists and CC finalists and with the 'whip round" receiving well into the 300K's shows that there is still some affinity for them in the locality, but there in lies the problem there is simply not enough of them and with the recent success one must question will there ever be and minus the benefactor that is the difference of keeping their heads above the water line or sinking.

    Reading between the lines if anything positive is going to improve the situation it is not going to happen till mid spring at least 4 months away and probably up to about round 8 or so into the new season.

    Basically the RFL is inbetween a rock and a hard place, do they sorry Salford or take the decision that they will grant them the goodwill and forward their funding in the hope that it will all come good in the spring?

    I think we're all getting ahead of ourselves a bit on what the exact situation is at Salford, and assuming we're reaching some sort of crisis. It might not be.

    But (getting ahead of myself a bit 😁) ...IF it is serious, then the only decision the RFL has to make is what will ensure 12 clubs complete a full season in Superleague in 2024. 

    If stabilising Salford is the best bet for that, then they should. If replacing them now with another team gives the best chance of a full season then so be it.

  18. 1 hour ago, MZH said:

    I don't like the way the gradings have been done either, however, and I'm sure this will have already been mentioned, the current gradings are only provisional, and they will change next year. If London have a decent year on the field and can address a few of the little off field things they have been graded down on then there's no reason why they can't keep their place on SL. They have a lot of work to do, but its not a lost cause.

    It's not a few little things, it's several massive things. The biggest downgrades are due to the fact they've no fans and therefore very low revenue compared to comparable clubs. Nothing suggests 2024 will do anything to change this, even crowds like 2019 (which were poor) won't move the dial. 

    All credit to what Mike Eccles achieved at the end of last season but London are not remotely a Superleague club in waiting.

  19. Just now, Toby Chopra said:

    It not pointless work. Its work that will help IMF sell the sport for more than the pittance we currently get. If you only see stadiums in terms of "regular fans" coming through the turnstiles you're missing half of what modern sports stadiums are supposed to do. Which is why the sport is so undervalued.

    Lol, if the IMF were involved we'd really be in trouble! I mean IMG of course.

    • Like 1
    • Haha 1
  20. 30 minutes ago, Griff said:

    Box ticking is worthless.  In itself.

    Odsal scores well on the IMG scale.  Lots of boxes ticked.  Is the fan experience good?  No.

    Now we have Cas proposing pointless work on the ground.   Just to tick boxes.

    It not pointless work. Its work that will help IMF sell the sport for more than the pittance we currently get. If you only see stadiums in terms of "regular fans" coming through the turnstiles you're missing half of what modern sports stadiums are supposed to do. Which is why the sport is so undervalued.

    • Haha 1
  21. It will only be a fraction of the domestic deals of course, but there's definitely some revenue to be had in the UK for overseas sports, and given the coverage is already there, it should be easy enough to tap.

    The NFL has built a small but loyal audience in the UK, which gets around half the viewing figures of rugby league, but also has a similar number of subscribers to gamepass. All in, that'll be worth something in the low single millions in revenue to them, especially as the broadcaster has no production costs. The NFL says it has more customers in Germany now, so across Europe as a whole they're definitely found a way to extract extra revenues.

    Whereas I can't see how the NRL currently gets much at all. Surely it's worth the effort to try and build it up a bit - at least as much effort as they're going to make in the US.

    • Like 2
  22. 4 hours ago, Dave T said:

    I don't disagree with this. The NRL don't need Europe. It's an inconvenience. Even though England stages the biggest international tournaments and has the main interest for things like World Cups, in the grand scheme of things the returns are modest to the NRL and they can just afford to buy the SH nations. 

    They have the NRL, Origin and SH internationals, they can do things like Vegas. They are insular and this is the outcome. 

    I agree with all of that on their approach, but I do still find it odd how little effort they've made to boost the profile of the NRL in Europe and particularly Britain, even purely for their own benefit.

    Europe is a wealthy, highly developed sports market that has multiple pay TV options and a familiarity with rugby, yet the NRL must be getting almost nothing for its TV rights here. Compare with the effort the NFL has made to introduce an "alien" sport in Europe. NRL is leaving money on the table in Europe for my mind.

    • Like 3
    • Thanks 1
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