Dave T
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Posts posted by Dave T
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in my oppinion these are much better players than the way over rated 6 penaltys a match bridge
michael shenton
leon pryce
karl pryce
kirk yeaman
kallum watkins
tony clubb
joe westerman would be an excellent centre
ryan atkins best centre at warrington.
I love posts like this.You just show yourself up as a simpleton who can't count or understand the game. Last year he gave 14 in 23 gams, this year he has given 4 in 17. Hardly 6 a game, or anywhere near.
L Pryce has given 14 in 18 games this year
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And you also speak for everyone who share your "twisted" view I take it. SL is a closed shop and the majority of fans that are already in it want it to stay that way in order that some of their weak clubs, both financially and on the filed, can stay there and pick up the nice fat cheques from Sky. Many couldn't give a toss about what is happening outside their tight little circle. How much depth and vision is that?
Actually you are wrong, and here's why.
Firstly, SL is not a closed shop. At the first stage of licensing 2 new teams were admitted. How is that a closed shop? There is a very very good chance that we will see more than 1 change this time round.
Secondly, the majority of fans don't want it to be this ficticious closed shop. You will find that the vast majority actually feel that certain clubs should be replaced by the likes of Widnes and Barrow.
You can dislike licensing as much as you want, but don't just make arguments up.
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Personally I think the position is up for grabs, I don't think anybody is a natural replacement (as has been seen by some of the players suggested).
As we saw last year, a few young lads came through and did a good job, and we shouldn;t be afraid of putting somebody in the deep end, whether that be Briscoe, Atkins or whoever.
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Serious point, just leave this thread as it will clearly never recover, but if you do want to discuss this topic, I would recommend posting on the thread that RP helpfully linked to. You will see there have been many views posted on there and I'm sure people will interact with any new views.Just lock it mate, even I've lost the will to live!!You'll also see that there was plenty of disagreement on that thread, so don't take it personally!
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There are quite a few clubs that got in at this first stage that don't necessarily have the right setup. Most clubs who applied for a license got a C grade. It was then up to the RFL to decide which clubs got in, and it is clear that Crusaders had a big advantage by being in a promotional area.So Celtic got in to SL based on facilities at The Brewery Field, infrastructure and youth talent, or set up as you call it?
What do you expect, they are between teams in different divisions, this has pretty much always been the case!The inter divisional games have all become a joke other than the Barrow v Cas cup game, the others were settled by upwards of 40 points in the main between each of the 3 divisions, that is hardly competitive is it?
I'm not here to defend Crusaders, this has been discussed to death.Brewery Field...
Would it do Batley any good going up to SL in their current form? What kind of investment could they attract in SL? If they can get investment and the interest is there, then why are they any different to Fev, Barrow, Widnes and Leigh who do have ambitions of promotion. If you are saying you can't get to their level, then, well I'm sorry, you don't deserve a SL spot.We know at Batley, as most of other Championship clubs do, that we will never get in to SL under the current regime. We earned the right, met the criteria as it was, as did Keighley in the same season only for the rules to be changed after the season had ended to stop us getting in. Hence, we know the dream of playing top flight rugby has gone along with upwards of half of our support, who then went to watch the Bulls, Rhino's and Huddersfield who were aloud to chase the dream to become the best, and none of whom have been seen again at the mount.
Even though the SC has been reduced, it is still too high for many clubs, as the income just doesn't cover it.In regard to Sh!t or bust promotion campaigns, surely that is what the salary cap is for? To ensure that there can no longer be a sh!t or bust approach. I thought it was designed to make sure clubs could not overspend on players and therefore down to sensible investment and infrastructure of the club to ensure they are the best in the league?In a P&R situation you then have to increase from around
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Whilst you make some valid points in some of your other posts, I do need to pick you up on some things here:
But you are missing whole point, the game is a joke because too many results are easy to predict, and too many teams are not in with a shout of winning anything and never will because of the closed shop mentality.The results are no more predictable nowadays than they have ever been, even when we had P&R. We have seen bottom teams win at top teams this year, just as every other year. Nothing to do with a closed shop.
Why do teams have no dream to chase? That dream may be a bit harder to achieve now (ie you need to build up your club rather than going for a sh!t or bust approach on the field).Most of the teams in the country have absolutely no dream to chase. The gap gets wider every year between top and bottom and you could ask what is the point of playing at all, if you are guaranteeing no matter how good a team is on the field that they can never play in the top division because you are smaller club and therefore can never strive to be any better?All clubs are eligible for SL if they get the facilities and setup right, that hasn't changed, however has become more difficult to achieve.
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I'm not so sure. Decent teams don't normally take two heavy defeats on the bounce, and Crusaders are showing some signs of being a decent team.I'm afraid I have to agree with you.I'm away so I can't make the game this time. May the best team on the day win!
I think we should win, but maybe by 12-18pts rather than a hiding.
Hoping to make my first trip to Wrexham, so looking forward to this one...
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I am concerned that I will get halfway through an article in Rugby League World, get to the point at which Warrington are criticised only to find the rest of the magazine blank.
Am I missing the joke? (Clearly I am!) Any chance of an explanation?
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The fact is we had P&R for a decent spell, and it hasn't exactly set the world on fire, so trying something new (which is actually P&R over 3 years rather than 1 year) is worth a go in my book.
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As long as they abide by the rules, there is nothing to see here.
It would be fantastic if the clubs had no more than 3 overseas players, however that isn't going to happen for a few more years (if at all) and if clubs try and get round the rules, that is when they deserve stick, not for making the odd signing.
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Look how mad the country goes for the FIFA World Cup. Our games have been moved all over the place to compete, that will be ten times worse if the tournament is in this country.That would do, 14 million pound please!You really wanna see tours back dont you! I long for a GB Lions tour again too, but dont think the Aussies are too keen.
I say avoid it, let's take the opportunity to have a tour, you send invites, and you will get teams wanting to play the Lions in midweek.
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Some responses as expected to my question!
What about if we were offered compensation to do this?
Personally, I wonder why we don't look to have a month's break, and send a GB team to Oz/NZ for a proper tour. The whole country will be football mad for that month, much more so than for any wolrd cup abroad.
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Changing this question round a bit, what would people's thoughts be if there was a request to postpone all RL games for a period of 1mnth during the tournament?
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The winners do get rewarded, with prize money and trophies.Sport is a game were the winner gets rewarded IE with promotion to a higher level franchise is total bulls@it yet another thing we have adopted from the statesYou can finish bottom year on year out but if you have money and a posh stadium you can get away with it money is killing sport its killed football and it will kill RL as a sport face it we have no sport only poorly run business that losers money season in season out
It is unlikely that you will finish bottom year on year if you have a decent stadium and money. If you do, crowds will drop, sponsorship will drop, your ratings each time will be reduced, and if teams are then proving themselves to be stronger in the lower division, they will take your place.
'It's killed football'. No it hasn't.
It hasn't killed sport, and won't do.
When I go watching an RL game, I see two teams playing a brilliant game on the field. There have always been off-field politics, right back to 1895.
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Again, you are ignoring other words around the word prevent.I'm not saying that they shouldn't have been charged with failing to stop it, just that failing to prevent it is a nonsense charge.It says 'best endeavours to prevent'. Did they make an announcement before the game. Do they do that at every game so that it becomes engrained? Do they have the Respect policy in the matchday programme?
Personally I would suspect that they would have these things in place, especailly after the issues last year, but the Judge and RFL clearly feel that they didn't do enough. I'm sure recommendations will be made, and that will be interesting.
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I just think in this financial climate fining a club for this in this quantity is unwarranted. I suspect Castleford may even rather have 2 points docked. Or given them a fine for
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It's actually their lawyer's comments, not Richard Wright. You'd think their lawyer knew the charges he was defending them against ?
As for your comments about if it happened at Warrington, what would your views be if the club did all that it considered that it reasonably could and the chanting still happened anyway ?
The fans who chanted are to blame, not the club. It's as simple as that.
Yep, apologies I just skim read it.
The fact is the RFL press release doesn't seem to link in with Findlay's comments. Interestingly, in his release he says that the club did everything they could on the day, what about after the day and the inquiry that will have taken place.
As for the Warrington point, if the club had done everything then I would be annoyed, but the fact is that people are showing blind loyalty to the club. There was an inquiry, and if the guilty charge is wrong, then they will rightly win the appeal.
Was their an appeal for names after the incident? I have gone through the archives on the Cas site and can't even find the press release after the original incident now.
If they had done absolutely everything they could to firstly control the crowd, and secondly conduct a full inquiry, then the RFL could have easily given them a
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I've not really changed my mind much since this was first reported. I think
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From the report on the BBC website
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_leag...ord/8772418.stm
the charges against the club were not that there was chanting, they were that the club failed to take its best endeavours to prevent or stop any chanting
Cheers, however that is just Richard Wright's wording rather than any official judgement. They are expected to receive the judgement by the end of the week, and that certainly isn't how the RFL have worded it in their official press release.
Quite disappointed with the attitude of some of the Cas fans on the other site. The vast majority are refusing to blame the fans, and aiming their anger at the RFL with a couple at Gareth Thomas.
I can genuinely say that if Wire got done for this kind of thing, I would be angry firstly with the dickheads who chanted, and secondly to the club for not doing all they could to resolve the issue.
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Regardless of what the judge criticised them for, the initial charge was of not preventing it. I am not arguing about what they could or couldn't have done during or after the chanting, just that it is stupid to charge any club with not being able to prevent it in the first place. Because the fact is that no club can prevent it, only warn against it and take action once something does happen.
Preventing it and failing to deal with it are two entirely separate and different things.
From the RFL website:
Castleford were found guilty of unacceptable behaviour, of breaching the RFL
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In an ideal world we should have dignity and respect for mankind (personkind to be PC)
What we have here on this thread is people's views and opinions.
Rightly or wrongly it is down to an individual(s) whether they can tolorate this behaviour or not. ie Ignore.
some will laugh it off, others will blow the roof off, others will report it or others will kick out.
for me there is no way another human should be subjected to any "abuse" but it happens, so as individuals we have to make a decision.
Tolorate (no way should we have to IMHO)
Report
Or Monitor the situation (how can we defuse, discuss, manage it)
we live in a cruel cruel world with many different views / beliefs / opinions
MODS
Lock this thread FFS, somebody is going to say something they might regret.
Paul, with all due respect there is no reason to lock the thread. Not every thread can be about the nice things in RL. This is very relevant, and will probably get much more press than anything else happening in league for the next few weeks, so we should be able to debate it.
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I think you are misunderstanding what I mean. I'm not exonerating anyone or saying the clubs have no responsibility in these matters.
Of course clubs can take proactive action such as warning people what will happen if they do chant offensive stuff, as I said on page 1 of this thread, but they simply can not physically prevent someone from doing so beforehand. Clubs must do all they can to stop it happening, but they can only do so much and ultimately the only people who can stop it are the fans themselves. Clubs can remind fans every 30 seconds about it but if one idiot decides to shout something offensive then I really don't see what any club could do to prevent the actions of an individual(s) who decides to ignore all of the requests and warnings not to do so. The only really tangible thing that clubs can do is identify the culprits and make sure they are banned for life, and they must be obligated to do so, but again that is different to prevention.
So doesn't this go back to the point about whether you have read the reason why they have been done?
They haven't been done because the fans shouted something vile, they have been done because of their shoddy response to it.
The tribunal was chaired by his Honour Judge Rodney Grant, who criticised the club for failing to take steps to stop the homophobic chanting, for failing to identify the perpetrators, for failing to challenge the chanting and for their failure to undertake a meaningful inquiry afterwards
So they were criticised for failing to take steps to stop it (did they make an announcement there and then? did the stewards act on this?).
They have been criticised for failing to identify the perpetrators (it is very common for fans to be highlighted now by either CCTV, public appeals, strong stewarding etc.)/
They have been criticised for failing to challenge the chanting (linked to point 1)
They have been criticised for not undertaking a meaningful inquiry.
They haven't simply been done because their fans chanted some stuff, it was their inadequacy to deal with the issue. Had they proven they had dealt with this strongly, I suspect no more than a suspended sentence, although that is only my opinion.
You are focusing on the fact that they couldn't prevent this happening, yet most of the criticism from the Judge is aimed at Cas' responseonce it did happen.
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Are you suggesting that there is only one level of abuse and offensiveness?So its OK to call the Ref or linesman ####..s? And surely any abuse should be frowned upon?Depends which pub you go in. Call somebody a ###### you will usually get a smack for your troubles or ignored.
But thats not the point. Who cares if somebody has been locked away for being gay or black on this discussion? We are talking about what happens at a Stadium. Why is it OK to abuse somebody who is an official or somebody who has Red Hair or is from Liverpool, Australia etc but not somebody who is Gay or Black at a Rugby match? Surely the same rules apply to all? I have seen on here people abuse Australian Posters and its accepted.
If I was at a RL match and called James Graham a 'Ginger Scouser' (obviously from my seat where he can't see me!), and then turn and call a handicapped girl at the front a 'f*cking *******' that they are the same thing because they are both abuse?
It is absolute nonsense.
EDIT: just in case some found my terminology offensive.
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I don't personally know what action Cas took at the time, the comments on here seemed to suggest that it was other fans who actually shut them up as opposed to anything the club did, although I cannot confirm that. Surely an announcement (ideally before it happened - I know my club certainly make announcements in place before and during the match) and then perhaps a visible presence of stewards in that area. Nobody would necessarily have to be ejected, as you say, this could be difficult, however making an announcement there and then that this is not acceptable, and putting a line of stewards in front of this small section of crowds would demonstrate that the club were taking this seriously. For anybody that was there, did anything like this happen?It was only a small section but how can you prove that this person said it or not amongst a group of people? How do you eject somebody from a ground for allegedly saying something? It could easily of been others near him. And it could easily get to the point where somebody tries to sue a club for allegedly chanting something and being kicked out due to no evidence. We all know Lawyers would likely have a field day with trying to win that one. I think its very harsh to blame Cas as a club and fine them. What framework do the RFL have in place when Internationals or Cup Finals are held and a section chants somethjing like this? What Framework is there for Clubs to follow, to stop this in future?Maybe the RFL could explain to all clubs what they expect from Clubs and Stewards regarding Chants and how to deal with it. What may in thought be easy to do in reality is harder to achieve.And I fail to see much difference from the abuse the match officials get than what Thomas received. And the abusing of match officials is normal and sung at all games." The referee is a Wan:er" or "who
Kear sees the light on franchising
in The General Rugby League Forum
Posted
But now we see Warrington win it who finished 10th. We have also seen Hull win it, Huddersfield make two finals, Catalans make a final and so on.
A bit of luck with the draw and all it can take is one very good performance to get to Wembley.