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Steve May

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Steve May last won the day on March 27

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  1. *sniffs patriotically while humming Nimrod* That was beautiful. I have a tear in my eye. But now you’ve got that off your chest, perhaps you’d like to answer my question?
  2. I have. Four days later I’m still waiting for your answer. Tick tock tick tock.
  3. Good stuff. But which of the three possible Brexits do you prefer and why do you think that will be good for the country? And be specific. That will help to convince me that you’ve actually thought about it.
  4. I think you misunderstand what I mean. You can’t escape reality. What I mean by that is that actions have consequences, and they will happen even if you pretend to yourself that they won’t. I see nothing at the moment that suggests Brexit won’t still happen and I see nothing to suggest that the Leavers understand the consequences of what they want, or that they care. But the consequences will still happen. And they’ll care then.
  5. Increasingly, it feels like it should be the Remainers saying “Suck it up, you won!”
  6. The question in 2016 was incomplete. That’s why we’re in this mess. My question is better, and I’m asking it now. What is your answer?
  7. Pretty much every single politician who campaigned to Remain in the EU voted in favour of invoking Article 50 in Parliament A large number of politicians who campaigned to Remain in the EU voted in support of the agreement negotiated with the EU to leave. The reason we haven’t left is because the group of politicians who are most in favour of leaving the EU repeatedly voted against leaving the EU.
  8. My list is, so far as I am aware, mutually exclusive and completely exhaustive. Either show me I’m wrong about that or pick one of the four and let’s argue about your choice.
  9. Yes. Very easily. It’s a gift. Meanwhile, are yougoing to bother engaging with the argument? Pick your Brexit option. Sooner or later, you’ll have to.
  10. The thing about socialism is that it works extremely well, it’s just never been done properly.
  11. Absolutely. As Ive pointed out to the extent that I’m boring myself, there are only three possible variants of Brexit, two of which are fraught with real danger and one of which is a Brexit so soft as to be completely pointless. None of the Brexiteers are able to refute this because it’s true. Most of them completely ignore it and continue to live in a fantasy world of their own creation. You can’t argue with them on this because they are arguing from a gut feeling that has no connection with reality. They want a Brexit that simply doesn’t exist. And it’s easier to blame others for this than to admit their own, deep misunderstanding of the situation. The failure to realise their impossible dream feels like a humiliation for them, which leads to the anger we see. But reality always wins in the end. The only question is how much damage will be done along the way.
  12. They really wouldn’t. When Brexit completely failed to deliver the promised land they would have needed to explain why, and they’d need another scapegoat. It would be the fault of people who voted Remain for sure, then immigrants, Muslims, Jews, intellectuals... You’ve seen faint glimpses of it in the way anyone and everyone has been blamed for Brexit not being as easy as promised. Anyone but the Brexiters. Civil servants, judges, MPs, journalists, on and on and on. Its an old and tragic story. It always ends badly. Always.
  13. What frightens me is the rhetoric used by mainstream politicians - and let’s be honest this is 95% a problem of the right wing parties - legitimises ever more extreme positions. And then you get a ratchet effect as extreme positions become normal, moving only in one direction. Difficult times. A quotation from Thomas Paine comes to my mind more and more often these days - “If there is to be trouble, let it be in my day, that my child may have peace” Ironically, given where we are, he was referring to the struggle for American independence from British rule.
  14. Any referendum must give an answer that can be implemented. That means the only options on it should be 1. Remain in the EU 2. Leave the EU but remain in the single market and customs union 3. Leave the EU completely but erect full border controls between the UK and the Republic of Ireland 4. Leave the EU completely but separate Great Britain and Northern Ireland such that Northern Ireland remains within the EU single market and customs union but Great Britain leaves them. Those are the four possible Brexits. There are no other options. Any other option you may believe exists is simply a variant of one of those four. So if you want to put it to the people, ask them to rank those four options by preference, single transferable vote style. Each has difficulties but at least they are not impossible. Options 3 and 4 might lead to civil war*, but that might well be a price the British people are happy to pay. * an actual civil war, with death and murder and bombs going off in places like Warrington, not the civil war threatened by geriatric Brexiters sitting in Wetherspoons at 11am getting damp eyed to the Dambusters March
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