Exiled Wiganer

If I have read it correctly, they’re saying that there was 3 times the revenue. If true that’s some achievement.

England could have a great home series against any of the other top 5 teams. It was suggested to Samoa’s coach after the final that they might come back again, That might have had no basis in fact, but I would be happy to watch them again over here. It’s potentially horrific for NH league. It’s no so much that the NRL doesn’t need us, it’s that we need them, but no one seems interested.

And hence one answer to the question “how many attended the women’s final” could be 67k, and the aggregate women’s World Cup figure could include that, eg in an overall made up figure of 130k. But it would be wrong to argue that 550k attended the men’s and women’s world cups. Figures can be slippery! how about this as a made up fact: far more people watched Samoa play than any non big 3 team in any tournament…

It may already have been mentioned but Jon Dutton acknowledged that the men’s tournament failed to reach its targets in his BBC interview. He did highlight that we had doubled the TV figures compared with 2013 (I appreciate that an increase would be inevitable given the number of games shown but nevertheless some of the figures have been none too shabby). He was also enthusiastic by the way the women’s and wheelchair games had gone. I would give him some credit for acknowledging the shortfall.

It was made up by me completely. Thanks for acknowledging my original thought. Though it did come with a caveat that I hadn’t checked it. The “problem” this runs into is how to count double headers, but having been at pretty much all of the matches in question, I am happy enough with the NZ figure looked at any which way. The Australia figure is a lot more doubtful as 10s of thousands left before they started and there weren’t many left by the end. And - I hesitate to write this in case it’s considered to be a made up stat - how many watched the women’s final?

I am slightly confused, though, when your figures above had both semis with 67k watching. Did anyone watch yesterday women’s final? Or did 60 odd k?

I divided the semi by 2, which I thought was the accepted convention. If we do adopt that approach then the 2021 women’s tournament attracted huge (world record?) crowds. Which makes the 2021 overall total much higher. That’s brilliant news for 2021’s figures!

I have not done the legwork on this, to my shame, but I wonder whether more people watched Samoa live (175k plus?) in this World Cup than any other team in any other World Cup…

Thanks. Well, sadly, when I hear Yeo I will still think of yoghurt.

(Was it Tom Trbojevic?)

Well, you were lucky, because it was the only thing being discussed where I was sitting, and on the long journey home. I have heard it mentioned repeatedly, whenever the Aussies play. There are 2 groups that are unlikely to be bothered, however. Those who know their Campbells as well as their Batemans, and those casual watchers for whom they’re a bunch of great athletes going about their business. And we want as many of those as we can. Having double checked, I made the initial point, I made it clear that this was a personal gripe. I can’t compare Wayne Pearce with the current Aussie loose forward, when, honestly I am not sure who played “13” for them.

In the NRL they don’t have squad numbers. 1 is always the full back. The Aussies had a hissy fit when asked to move to a squad number system so devised one so random that meant that anyone used to watching league but unfamiliar to these big in Sydney but nowhere else players couldn’t make head nor tail of. There was one player, Tedesco, who played in the position his number suggested. And it’s probably fair to assume Addo-Clark was on the wing. As for the others, I think Wighton is a back, and Martin is a forward, but am not 100% certain. Oh, and Cleary is a half back, which I recall from watching the NRL. It annoyed and distracted me, and compounded my sense of our game having become NRL versus the world, with the Kangaroos an after thought.

Oh, and as for TV viewing figures, as many people watched the wheelchair final as watch State of Origin. In most worlds, the SH authorities would like a slice of that level of exposure.

Someone mentioned Tom Trbovic (not sure about the spelling). I watch a lot of league and have not got the faintest notion why he might be considered a top class as opposed to a decent player. Has he even played against England? I appreciate that COVID has distorted everything, so maybe in time we will get to know these players. We should bear in mind that the NH is an absolutely massive market for international league - there is zero chance of any of the SH teams playing for their country in front of a crowd that size at a world renowned stadium. I would have thought that some of them might want to do so again…

I have 2 problems with getting a sense of how good these players are. First, there refusal to use proper numbering - as good an example as any of their contempt for internationals - meant I was constantly slightly confused as to who even had the ball. The second is that we haven’t seen nearly enough of them to form a view as to how good they are. I struggle to compare Sterling with whoever their half back is when he hasn’t played against England/GB, and may not ever do so. I appreciate neither of these is a great reason, and they perhaps show that I am not a discerning watcher!

No, he’s making it up. He’s a sociopathic anti league troll.

Don’t we have these sorts of matches anyway in the NH, when we play the Euro comps? I thought that the top pros for countries like Italy only play world cups? I like any idea that rewards a nation for having developed its own players.

Let’s be clear - if we cannot persuade Oz and NZ to tour again the NH is toast. We will never build a fan base or inspire people. More people attended yesterday’s games as neutrals than will ever watch any international Down Under. It will (by my reckoning) be the highest grossing international fixture of all time. We are told (and the players say) that they want to play internationals. Meninga has stated that he wants to play internationals. Whatever it takes, we need Oz and NZ to come over here. Because without that, we face an existential crisis to end all existential crises, and are on our way to oblivion.

Over 2,500,000 viewers for the wheelchair game!

I may be wrong, but I think you’re Australian, with an interest in the Kangaroos. I am very gloomy indeed about the prospects of seeing the Kangaroos over here this decade. Does anybody over there care about whether the Kangaroos play at all? And, if so, could you see them ever coming to the UK?

How about you set out your thoughts on where this one rates relative to the others? That would be on point.

I think you can make a case for 2021 being the best ever. It set out its stall to be 3 successful competitions, and delivered magnificently on the wheelchair and women’s front. Over 2.5m tuned into the wheelchair final!!! That was an undoubted triumph. The women’s were only marginally less successful, and there is clearly huge huge potential for growth there. As for the men’s, we have had ambitious pricing against the backdrop of a cost of living crisis which meant that crowds were lower than we would have hoped. And yet… they were within 10% of the 2013 figures, which, while considered a triumph, pretty much gave away many 10s of thousands of tickets. One thing that I would revisit with the men’s is the number of teams. I can see that 16 feels like a good number, but I don’t see why we need more than 10 and would be happy with 8. Cricket is a vastly bigger game, and yet they had 12 in their T20 comp. I struggle to get excited by foregone conclusion games with artificial teams. In that respect I prefer some of the other formats we have used in the past. It’s hard to compare, but I think I enjoyed 2013 more: it just felt like it was buzzier. While I enjoyed 2008, it wasn’t really a competition for the ages until the final. 2017 was a litany of missed opportunities, with PNG and Tonga providing rare highlights in a tournament treated with apathy in Oz. 1995 was a lot of fun, though it was hard to see much of it (did the BBC only show the first and last game in full or am I misremembering). 2000 was a catastrophe. So, my league table would be: 1) 2013 2) 2021 3) 1995 4) 2008 5) 2017 6) 2000 i would note that the SH world cups have not just been inferior than the NH ones, but that clearly the gap between the potential and the reality is far far bigger, given the massive existing audience.

I completely agree that, if we look to potential game changers for the international game, Wales and France are the only ones with any hope of success.

I get v annoyed when the commentators say that our game is simple, or that teams simply do the basics. Ours is a fantastically difficult game to play this well. The Aussies are the best of the best, and to dismiss what they do as “basic” down plays excellence under pressure.

I agree that we don’t help ourselves. My focus is narrowly on this game and the consequences of the easy Aussie win. Because, honestly, if they walk this, I am not sure we will ever get an international calendar and I don’t think we will play Australia over here this decade. And how can our young supporters be inspired by players they never see?