Exiled Wiganer

He was playing in the NRL a couple of weeks ago with a 6 on his back.

He looks good to me, in the same mould as French, Looking forward to seeing him tearing through next year.

I would ask the players, and try and do what they want. The experience from the couch will be the same wherever they play.

I would walk away from this thread if I were you. Good luck to him. I think he has talent, and would love to see him develop in our game, but I could understand if he didn’t fancy being Ellery’s Son all his career in TGG.

We are lucky to have any games to watch at all. And as a game we are hugely indebted to the much maligned RFL for stepping up. In Oz, V’Landys is showing what a man of drive and vision can do with the greatest game. By the looks of it, we may have pretty much a full complement of teams playing next year, when, god willing, we can see them in the flesh. And that was by no means certain. Let’s not under estimate the level of stress that all the players have had to go through and the sacrifices they continue to make to keep safe and well (and I appreciate that many of us would swap places with them in an instant). As to the outcome, if Saints win, it will be a devalued, asterisked title, but if anyone else wins my god they will have earned it!

If it’s dry and we hold our own up front, we should be close. We have a decent side. What will be fascinating is how the players react to the dead man walking coach. Not that this is a big game, but a loss places even more emphasis on the forthcoming derby, in which fixture he is zero out of 5.

It wasn’t made out in that way. There was no outrage, there was analysis. There was concern over the action causing such a bad injury, with potential career ending opportunities. You seem to see the world entirely through a one eyed filter and consider debate over a tackle which caused severe injury to be a bit of a laugh. Hold onto the win over the kids as tight as you can though.

I am not sure that concern over this particular incident should cheer you up, but each to their own I suppose.

I understand risk, and I understand probability. I also watched this particular tackle. There are of course a few different elements to it. Once Saints successfully argued/the disciplinary concluded that the contact was higher up the leg than it appeared to me, they were on course to conclude that there was nothing to see here. I am not even suggesting they are wrong, and certainly not that they are biased, simply that the “man in the street” could well look at the 2 tackles and their outcomes and shake their head. I am mystified not outraged. In any case, sadly, even a ban would be very cold comfort for Wells.

Are you citing injury risk in the context of a tackle which actually may have ended a player’s top flight career? There was no need to weigh up potential risk in the instance. So, if that is a factor I will remain mystified, even if I am in small group or indeed a group of 1. Having played and watched TGG for decades I find the 2 findings inconsistent, but the disciplinary have the advantage over me of better information and greater knowledge.

Fair enough. That’s their job. It does make Flower’s 2 match ban mystifying. Sadly, it looks like Wells’ season has finished, and probably his Wigan career. So its effects were certainly catastrophic for him.

That is supposition, and I would suggest that the way Wigan have worked with, say, Zak Hardaker, who left a smaller club (and bigger ones) to join us shows we have due regard for the all round well being of our players off the pitch. As for whether he is coached well, or being properly utilised on the pitch, that’s a different story.

I am not sure I buy into the narrative that suggests ex Salford players fall into terminal playing decline and a deep depression on leaving the club. Hastings’ former half back partner seemed pretty settled as he took us to the cleaners yesterday. In reverse, which is perhaps more relevant to this particular thread, I was pleased to see Sarg, Mossop and Brown all playing well. They are good lads as well as good players. Sarg in particular is made to play full back, and was pretty much our best player at Old Trafford in that position before leaving for the Titans.

Our rise and dominance was a masterclass in generating income to reinvest; all achieved through success breeding success, after over a decade of stagnation, leading to relegation. It also became a study in the self defeating nature of too much dominance and the precarious nature of success. Our rise and rise was funded, not on millionaire owners, but out of money generated. There is an economics text book to be written from it. Ironically, with our new backer, we now have deeper pockets than we have had at any time aside from the Whelan era (and arguably even then).

Well done Salford. Really well deserved. Great coaching. It is a tragedy that their long suffering fans won’t be able to be there, but I hope they nevertheless treasure the achievement. Shame for Warrington, but sometimes you’re the hammer, and sometimes you’re the nail.

Lam has lost every big game we have played. Great effort from Leeds though. Classy performance.

I was thinking about this the other day - to what extent do the commentators’ emphasis affect the disciplinary? Say, if you compare Sky’s reaction to Smithies’ indiscretions against their ignoring Walmsley’s attack on Wells’ knee, would that be a factor in the process? Surely they aren’t influenced?

Sure. Am happy for the disciplinary to take a look, they are normally pretty sensible. I wouldn’t have bothered looking at it again save that the recent Flower 2 match ban looked so innocuous. Ironically, I don’t think Flower should even be wearing a Wigan shirt after what he did to the club and the game, so I wasn’t even that bothered by the outcome.

Applying that rule, then. Walmsley is in a great deal of trouble, as he applies all of his weight below the left knee (and he only took out the left leg) of a player already held up by 2 of his colleagues, with the end result being a very serious injury. Moreover, as the player had already been held up he had a lot of time to choose exactly where to put his 19 stone. If you stop the recording at 19:42 on the clock, it is crystal clear. Like others, I can’t help but idly muse what might have been In TRL land had a player in red committed that that tackle with that result. But it is a matter for the judiciary, and I am sure they will take a look at the 2 legged slip down the body tackle on a moving player that lead to a 2 match ban for Flower as against this. Tbh, it is pretty much the definition of a dangerous attack to the legs. Which, as I understand it, the game is looking to stamp out.

Tbh being invisible we would only have his word for it.

If the standard is that Flower gets 2 matches for being in the wrong place and Smithies gets 6 for his misdemeanours, then Walmsley should get a long ban. He was third man in, tackled low, twisted the leg and Wells has suffered a bad injury (after having recovered from multiple bad injuries). I am not even sure it is controversial to suggest it - anyone who cares to can take another look at what lead to Flower’s 2 match ban. As to the benefit of a game like that, I am really not sure there is one for anyone, save that this is another game played on Sky that helps pay the rent. I doubt any Wigan player will have learnt anything very much other than Saints’ first team is far better than their reserves. Seeing a young player in that context is a long way removed from how that same player may look slotted into a strong side. This was all about Lam realising that his future at the club is on the line on Saturday (no pressure, mate).

I feel so sorry for Wells, whose career has been blighted by injury. To be so badly injured in that way is a tragedy.

Possibly. We need to hold onto the ball when we have it, and kick well, to keep this down below that. In any case, it will signify very little in the scheme of things. Tbh, while he is resting at least 10 players, I would not be surprised if he doesn’t rest even more. Lam has no contract for next year, so Saturday’s game is everything for his future.

I must say I thought the first 30 minutes were very uneventful, but once it got going that was a very good game. There is very little between these 2 teams. We have such a good back line, we just need to hold our own in the middle. It is just a shame that we won’t be able to focus on the derby, but even with half a team rested I think we could be competitive at this rate. I am not usually one to criticise my own side (no, really), but I am glad that is one game nearer Flower leaving the club, he is a disgrace.

They’re on the 100th wave by now.