Dave T

So pretty much textbook as you'd expect. Exactly as many of us guessed.

I assumed it was a joke at first, but then saw people had genuinely donated

I'm not sure we do. I think events wash their face by being cheap. It's why Warrington stages internationals. It's why women's games are held as double headers and we abandon neutral grounds. It's why fanzones at Magic are no more than a couple of cheap market stalls. I'm not one for being reckless, but to build an event into something great, you sometimes have to invest.

It's the problem overall isn't it. No matter what point you bring up there, the root cause of the problems is that we half-ass things and do them on the cheap. For me, we need to get to a place where we are prepared to lose money on big events. Our events are our biggest marketing tools, but they appear to have to wash their face from day 1, so we minimise costs which means we limit growth.

I agree, it's why I added my line about it needing to be done properly, and that goes for wherever it is played. I just don't buy the benefits that apparently playing at Wembley brings, and I thing the size of the stadium is a real negative. And I don't just mean capacity, it absolutely dwarfs old Wembley despite a modestly larger capacity. I think there are better ways to target London nowadays. But I do understand why some would never want to leave Wembley.

I've long since championed the Cup moving, but I'm in a minority on this. I'm over Wembley personally, I think it's too big, expensive, can be difficult to get to at times, and imo not that good a stadium unless you go Club Wembley. I quite like the idea of moving around, I think we can get ourselves out there a lot more. I do think when we used to play Cup finals and Magic weekends in places like Cardiff and Edinburgh it felt like we were more out there pushing ourselves. If we did do that though it is important that a) we do it properly, make plenty of effort and not do it on the cheap, and b) we don't abandon London, maybe Magic there and/or internationals.

I think there is something in this. I've just watched both tackles, and Pryce's was absolutely the worst of the two. What has to be remembered though is that if this was last year, O'donnell would have received 8 matches, as the RFL decided foul play isn't to be taken as seriously this year and have watered down bans.

We've delivered huge crowds in Cardiff and Edinburgh before.

Are the teams they are playing RL teams? What's their pedigree? Have TWP got any players?

Probably don't need to worry about that.

Of course. The season ticket point is purely around sales mechanics. Every RL game should be an event of some sort irrespective of how tickets are sold. Even with season tickets we are still looking to shift thousands and thousands of tickets for every game.

Of course demand will always fluctuate, but in reality, these group games will always be the easiest to get tickets for and cheapest games, because your season ticket holders have already spent a bomb on regular games, and in many instances cant/wont add substantial additional costs onto that. But the point is, that those tickets, are dirt cheap. You could watch City v Sevilla for £22-£47 - even lower if you're a member.

Correct. We demonstrate pretty much the same patterns as football fans do. We just have a much smaller fan base so it looks more stark. As a Man City fan the games I go to are the European group games, because a) there are always plenty tickets available, and b) they are usually very cheap. Football don't just ignore the challenge.

I'd happily look stupid for a 20k crowd!

Where have you been for the last decade or so? Of course this will be a disappointing crowd.

We have examples everywhere of this. It's why PPV doesn't really do well. It's why Netflix charge a fee and then don't charge extra for other shows. It's why it's possible to get tickets for Cup games in football. Demand drops for 'all pay' - in football the demand exceeds stadium capacity often so it is hidden somewhat, but they sell cup games for far cheaper to fill grounds, and sometimes make purchase compulsory too.

Indeed, they are fixing the wrong thing. Scheduling is not the issue. It doesn't mean we shouldn't be better at it, but it ain't a game changer.

Pretty much all of our 'cash pay on the day' games are poorly attended. It is a factual thing, no matter how many times people try and twist it into something else, or add other factors. It is likely that a bog standard Wire v Hudds league game last week will get a bigger crowd than a Wigan v Wire quarter final. There is not a chance in hell that more people are attracted to that game. We are ignoring the ticket sales point and this failure to make it work on a membership scheme has seen it look less attractive which has an effect on all rounds, including the semis and final. Once we've killed the cup, using the same logic, we will then move on to kill the playoffs. It's inevitable.

I don't think a heartland vs expansion debate is massively relevant here. As a sport I think we should have a clear expansion strategy, but I don't think it's the biggest thing at play here, or even a big factor. We haven't done much well. Heartland or wider, that's the problem.

On a serious note, I enjoy the bits I enjoy now. More and more I'm happy to do other things instead of watching the match. And tbh, that includes watching other sports.

You'll never hear me say the game will die. I accept it's personal, but there is less in RL for me nowadays

The world cup was the killer for me. Should have been world class, was meh at best.

I think it can only ever work as a supplementary thing for fans, it's too niche to replace a TV deal worth millions and millions of quid. Now, maybe if we'd have worked up an interest in international rights we could have sold them on to Oz, France etc, but nobody cares about them, and why would they? We had the right idea in 1997 with the WCC, but we pushed that too far. We should be in our 26th season of a proper WCC comp by now, and the four nations and world cup was the right idea - but everything has been abandoned, the World Cup has just been cancelled. Tbh, I'm not sure I've ever felt so pessimistic about the sport.

Not a cat in hells chance of getting 100k at £37.50 per month.