bowes

Gateshead's (and Blackpool's) futures are looking a bit shaky to say the least. Skolars will definitely stay around for years to come IMO, whether that's at this level or (say) National Conference League or equivalent level I'm not so sure but a lot depends on what happens both with Harlequins and with Championship licensing. Good win for them today though.

They'll guarantee a team promotion based on minimum criteria again, if no club meets them then they can legally make no change, best compromise. The only clubs that might meet them in 2015 (aside from invited overseas clubs) are Halifax and at a push Leigh IMO. They both might fall short

Can't we just have one merged 'ParisSurtout's crazy expansion plans' thread?

If they fold due to lack of income the other features won't save them, why don't people get that? No amount of local players or junior development will pay the bills.

Yes, the boundaries are odd. Sport England use the standard regions. Whether that matters for funding purposes I don't know, I know there was talk they'd be keen on getting at least a semi-pro team in each region and South East has probably the fewest rugby league teams of any region (though this is much improved with the likes of Guildford, Southampton, Sussex Merlins etc being relatively new), so a boost there may help. Either way Sport England region is irrelevent to the 3 important questions about Oxford or Milton Keynes: 1. Would a backer be found in those places or David Hughes want to stay 2. Would London players want to travel there to play 3. Would the support base be there I believe 3 would be better than at Twickenham but no idea how much by, no idea for points 1 and 2

They do use them for some things, or at least Labour did not sure about the Conservatives. But Sport England and the EU are the 2 main things I can think of. Certainly it's not midlands, though it's not London either

Assume this would be a team of mostly London & South East locals? Not the worst idea, they'd be competitive nowadays, though where would be suitable to play? Stoop too large and expensive and New River too small. Of course Skolars reserves and amateurs would need preserving in the Haringey area, perhaps as Haringey Hornets. I'd like them to find a viable setup for Super League somewhere in the South East (which Milton Keynes is officially part of, as is Oxford) but failing that I'd go for this option.

Paris doesn't know any French, he's actually from Huddersfield

fervent traditionalist, there should be a conference on the Moon and 10 on the Sun. We should also ban northern teams from playing rugby league as some of their fans are flatcappers who hold the game back

I suspect they were trying to get as low a crowd as possible to give them an excuse to drop the South Wales matches and just play in Wrexham

If Toulouse leave the Championship then it's too late to join French Elite 2010/11 and if they play French Elite 2011/12 they can't play SL 2012 as the seasons overlap and vice versa. Thus they'd be applying for SL from no league (aside from the reserve team link up with St Gaudens) and if they got accepted they'd have had a full year sabbatical (which would lose them players), though of course when they get rejected they could then join the 2011/12 French Elite.

Apparently those rules date to before the RFL confirming that they would have to make a final, but who knows? Think they're more there for a potential big money Stade Francais bid, but who knows? Also the RFL set the requirement of clubs making an average crowd of 2500 either 2009 or 2010, Toulouse got about 2300 last year and are much lower this year so they can't

Toulouse were 7th in the French Elite before entering the Championship. The salary cap is fair as it applies to everyone not just Toulouse, though I'd instead have Toulouse in the French Elite on condition they can only apply for SL on making a French Elite final (they'd still struggle but would make more sense) and meeting the other criteria there. You can't just chuck them in for being French and watch them collapse due to getting smashed every week. Toulouse had their chance to get in, if they'd have finished in the top couple of the French Elite in 2007-08 rather than 7th I suspect they'd be in by now. Making excuses for them being French won't pay the bills or run a SL club so is pointless No white French people want to live in the UK, unlike New Zealanders in Australia so don't see how we can help that, they wouldn't play for us if we wanted them. Also there's a lot stronger rugby league in New Zealand than France and you still only have one NRL club there

There are plans and it needs to happen but there's no definite form to it, it may merely end up promotion and relegation with minimum standards. A lot depends on what happens with the amateur game switching from winter (if it happens), the RFL wanted something like: Super League Championship National 1 National 2 West/East/South etc. But the NCL want to stay as they are (perhaps in summer) and the other leagues aren't keen to switch. 2-up-2-down is destroying clubs but a licensed Championship would need to be bigger and you need something better than the RLC to put excluded C1 clubs in (or else attract clubs to step up to C1 from the NCL plus Bramley with lower entry criteria)

Yeah while I still think the NCL will probably switch at some point but only on its own terms not as part of a pyramid (unfortunately IMO) and juniors likely will, I can't see the BARLA leagues agreeing to it. The RFL have a centralised coach company which pushes down the travel prices but it's still a huge cost I can't see them keeping it long term (perhaps better just to pay travel by and to Hemel in the NCL?). Last year there seemed to be efforts to drum up interest in going back towards the old format (play your region twice and the other region once) or something along those lines, maybe north and south with cross division fixtures, but the travelling was still too much for southern clubs so seems to be either a north/south split or not at all. Yeah either that or something like North Wales Crusaders depending on how wide you want to appeal

FFS get a grip on reality. Toulouse were 7th before they joined the Championship so couldn't compete with Lezignan there. Any idea of Toulouse in SL from 2012 is a joke, pure and simple, whether Crusaders is okay we'll see, I'm not so positive about it as I was a month or two ago. Toulouse WILL NOT be in SL in 2012, just accept it. It's only Australians proposing this from the other side of the world, all our resident expansionists (except the nutter Paris) have accepted it

Bramley can't get the ground for Championship 1, I'd hope that when they license (and hopefully expand) the Championship they'll relax Championship 1 standards, or ideally have a unified pyramid if the amateur game goes summer. Hemel it's a tough one, once the NCL switches to summer I'd like to see them rejoin that as it would give them more games and they do meet the off field standards. Nottingham could go either way, north or south but I think north would be less travel. Since none of the southern sides have any intention of ever stepping up it would be better to build up a southern competition (include some or all of the midlands), whether this is something for next year or something to work towards I don't know, rather than having a RLC National with no side south of Coventry (we're about as far south as you can be and still manage it and even then only if the RFL still pay for all the travel costs). The NCL would be there for southern sides wanting to step up anyway, so no need for another northern based national competition. Hemel don't actually pay for the bills as the RFL cover all travel costs for the RLC National, but can't see that continuing if they have another national summer comp with better on and off field standards and if Hemel (and perhaps Nottingham) joined better geographical spread

Perhaps when there's a RLCN South that would be a good place to start? The RLCN won't survive the NCL switch to summer under the current format IMO. Also the southern teams (Hemel aside- they could go NCL or something) can't sustain trips up north every other weekend so there needs to be something above the local leagues for these teams that's not fully national

You do realise that first seasons in a new location are almost certainly better crowd wise than a second season? Plus lack of history won't pay the bills. I hope Crusaders survive in Wrexham, but I'm not as sure they will as I was a couple of months ago

The Carmarthenshire proposal is a suggestion for CPC Bears who are one of the weaker Premier Division sides, and the theory was based on them having 4 feeder sides this year. All 4 turned out to be fictitious, but they managed to get something by effectively a forced merger of all 4 sides. Don't think they'll get anywhere, maybe we could get 2 good proper amateur clubs in Wales feeding into the Scorpions (one to be Bridgend or Pontypridd based, the other could be somewhere Monmouthshire/Gwent I guess) playing in a better competition, with the Welsh Conference below that as a way of introducing RU players into the game

You mean Rugby League Conference? No, most of the games are now getting called off presumably because some players would rather go to RU pre-season 6-8 weeks before the season starts than play rugby league. Maybe between all the clubs you could get something but I'd rather start off with a Scorpions reserve team before we look at another pro side

There were 2 proposals yes, but I don't think there was ever the player base for 2 sides, so more a case of either or. The other proposal were to be Bridgend based. Blackwood Bulldogs considered it at one point but they can't even fulfil their fixtures as it is

Unless Toulouse make this year's grand final it would be impossible for them to get in without the RFL being pathological liars. Having said that if Catalans were still finishing 3rd there'd be a better base for Toulouse if they could pick some players up there, but Toulouse would still have to be okay first. Bringing in a 2nd SL French club when the one club is down the bottom would be ludicrous, but that doesn't mean they should automatically bring Toulouse in when Catalans have a good season unless Toulouse can also justify it. And aren't Catalans having a player exodus?

The Super League record low crowd is 500 (Paris got it- forget who against) and I think there's a real chance this will be broken

SL wasn't full of French players before the Federation trained rule was brought in (there were a couple), so not sure how much of a difference it will make, though I guess 5 years of Catalans will see a few more players floating around. Toulouse in SL would be reckless at a time when Catalans are struggling