Dave T

One of the challenges around time wasting is that you struggle to get much sympathy when as a tackler youve spent all the rest of the match making the play the ball as slow as possible.

Isn't it something vague like 'without delay' or something?

I do think people just need to chill. We dont need to kneejerk just because some people don't like a ptb taking 10 seconds instead of 3.

Indeed. Its almost like its the perfect t argument as to why the clubs shouldn't be the ones deciding stuff like this.

Great stuff. But jeez, that's an ugly graphic in that post.

Well, the last person who had proper control was Wood. There was an owners coup when he ousted them.

Yup, its been a problem forever, but the evidence against it is coming thick and fast right now. I dont even necessarily think its just an 'I'm alright Jack' problem, running things so complex by committee is impossible.

Club owners come and go.

Double post

Hmm. You can't pull people for fiction and then deny what actually happened in 1995/6. London were parachuted into the new top flight for 1996. They did not earn on-field promotion, them and PSG benefited from being handpicked, everyone else was based on league rankings. Now, I dont agree with the poster you are replying to, and am more in your camp that London needs far more support than they have. But we dont need to claim they werent parachuted into SL (or given overseas players dispensation). I would argue that is the case for many areas, I notice you ask for London to receive the same patience and support that has been extended elsewhere - im not sure i see much patience and support for any clubs, we have a long history of throwing clubs under the bus. Catalans benefited from being handpicked, and protection for the first year or two, but outside of that nothing really. Let's be honest, if they were as bad as what London put on the field, theyd be left to the lower division. Catalans first few years was fine, but after that they've been left to themselves, and let's be honest, the terms of their participation are worse than other clubs. So we shouldn't really be looking for London to have similar support to others, we should be looking for expansion/special strategic clubs like this to have a hel of a lot more support than they have ever had.

Yeah, its ok, but it looks a little Samoa-y

If I was IMG I'd be getting out of here tbh.

Yes. History does rather suggest that we need a strong leadership team who will make decisions without being micromanaged by a committee of clubs.

I think the RFL are pretty clear about what you can't do and why, and I think its really simple to never be penalised for this in your whole career, and I'd say 99.9% of players never will. Interestingly, I think Horne actually slowed it down more with his mucking about!

TBH, it looks to me like they have just looked at the incidents and have rather accepted that Martin's was very little: "The panel concluded that this incident does not meet the criteria for Unnecessary Contact as per the regulations, describing the contact as “de minimis” meaning virtually nothing"

The thing to be crystal clear on here though is that the agreement to bring in IMG was the clubs. The agreement to approve reimagining RL was the clubs. The agreement to go with grading was the clubs. And if we nip back a few years, the decision to go with licensing, was the clubs. The decision to change their mind a few years later, was the clubs. And Super 8's, the clubs. And so on. And all of the above is fine, I'm perfectly happy that the clubs get their say, but doesn't it strike you as odd that they keep changing direction every 3 years or so.

Is there a video of the Martyn one, because the edited clip I saw, it looked pretty much nothing in Martyn's i.e. a shirt tug rather than a lifting of the player.

Let's be clear here though. The tackler can't pick up the player. That isn't his role. You don't get to tackle the player and then pick them up and control the ptb.

What I would say here is that there is only a split second between the tackler getting up and him pulling the ball carrier. Its not like he has lay there for 3 or 4 seconds. Watch it with the time running, its less than a second. So I think to claim there is time wasting is odd.

You can of course choose to do whatever you want with your time, and if you dont like the sport, it is definitely time to move on and do something else. But this just smacks of sulking because something has gone against your team.

Why didn't you question your support when other players were banned for it?

It can't work like that. What happens if next time somebody has a broken neck and the tackler decides to just lift them like a rag doll because they can't control their discipline?

This is possibly the easiest thing not to get banned for.

This one became more interesting the other night though, and is probably a perfect example of the frustrations that fans, players and coaches have. Tai fumbled a catch over his line versus Hull and then grounded it with the backs of his hands. The ref sent it up as a Try, and was overruled as the VR said it was intentionally grounded. Yet nobody grounds the ball intentionally with the backs of their hands. There were a lot of similarities with those two incidents, both saw a #### up and then the body on the ball. One saw a decision of no grounding, one saw a decision of grounded. Both had been sent as a try from the ref. Neither was an orthodox grounding, and both followed an error. We exacerbate the problem by ignoring some written rules, and then adding in interpretations of things that arent written. The Leeds disallowed try the other night just feels a weird decision instinctively. I dont have an issue with the refs, as long as I've watched RL, fans have asked who the clown is that day, this isn't new, and people used to hate Whitfield, and others will still talk about #### ups from Russel Smith in 1994 or Ganson at Cardiff and so on. But the governing body and the rulebook owners just dont help the refs imo when they have so much scrutiny. I'm a fan of simplifying things as much as possible (on the Wembley incident, I think you should have to use your hand/arms to ground it), I'd scrap this nonsense around regathering the ball with a full grip, why is that necessary? I dont think the authorities give the refs a chance tbh. And then we just see bad decisions like the Cas v Wigan one.

To an extent, all you can do is improve your numbers and hope the outcomes follow. Improving the numbers and getting skilled negotiators hopefully leads to that competition you refer to.