David Dockhouse Host

The current structure has promotion and relegation. Something I'm against and my suggestion (as a talking point) would remove this. The point I was debating was a reply to a poster suggesting it remains the same. So I'm not sure if you think I was proposing we maintain Pro/Releg? I also never claimed there's lots of imminently potential cash for the lower leagues? Not sure if you thought I was arguing there was? The problem with these threads is people don't always read back precious posts, we all usually only read the most recent and can mistakenly believe a point is being made which isn't. So back to my suggestion, rather than two leagues of ten, two conferences of 10, East and West. Play each other twice in same conference, and one game with each team in the alternate conference, therefore removing loop fixtures. This would be 28 games. Top three of each conference would play off for a GF with no relegation. East and West winners straight into semi final with week one off 2nd placed East plays 3rd placed West for semi final spot and Vice Versa. This would be current SL clubs plus top 8 in championship. Second tier would have its own league with potentially an application to be in the top 20 every few years. Yes there are issues with this suggestion, I'm aware the money being spread around 20 is not attractive to the top 10/12, you lose some of the big games across conferences from 3 games to 1 potentially but I think overall this has merit for all the reasons I've stated before such as reducing over familiarity, same team fatigue, more spread geographically, more attractive to investors, more options for TV games, no relegation etc.

Enjoying this game, found the Saint's Cas game frustrating Cas are a good team but made many unforced errors and poor decision making. Dropped balls on tackle one, losing possession in own half, kicking ball out on the full, not getting two in the tackle etc. All fixable, so hopefully those young players will learn and improve from their experiences

I agree and this hasn't been ignored, in fact discussing alternatives are to consider how to raise the lower levels so they contribute to the overall attraction. I also don't believe one league if ten would be that attractive either. Or 8 which will happen next time the overall value decreases

I agree the game isn't ignoring it, my post was in response to another poster not the 'game' itself

But it does impact on it, so cannot be ignored

He is very good. I hope he does more but for me different pundits works best as I like different views. I'm one of a rare few who like Phil Clarke

The whole sport is the product. Creating something the 5 clubs you mention is a spiral downwards. No business increases by reducing, it's counter productive and short sighted not to say selfish. You seem to think it's one or the other, either look after the top 5 clubs or all clubs. It's not one or the other, both aspects are important. Those 5 clubs cannot survive without other teams to play, unless they want their own league of 5. All these same reasons were given when going from 14 to 12, so the question remains, what happens when the money drops again because Sky viewers are bored of watching the same 10 teams? Go to 8 or your top 5? We are doing it your way now and the money has dropped, fans perception is at an all time low in my lifetime, sky paying less, crowds down, NRL lack interest in SL and World Cups yet you wish to retract further? Just looking after the top 5 won't help the other teams improve, and for the good of the game other teams have to have that opportunity, Tolouse, Bradford, York some others all have potential to be a bigger club, close the door and they never will. Any structure has to be attractive to Sky and/or other TV stations to have the chance of increased revenue. We have to attract investment and advertising, St Helens v Warrington numerous times a year isn't attractive to investment. I work all over the UK and you'd be surprised how many people say where's that when I tell them I'm from St Helens. If we continue to do it your way we will be back to semi pro quite soon, it's an ever decreasing product. Is that what fans want? If so fine, if not one league of 10 isn't the long term attraction anyone other than the same clubs think it is, IMO.

Rugby League doesn't revolve around St Helens, the structure isn't created just to keep one team happy. Dewsbury I doubt would make the top 20 teams so your point wouldn't stand. You've also been selective, identifying one match against another, when my point was clearly longer term attraction. The issue with over familiarity is short term gain (larger gate) longer term disinterest. If you continue to do what you've always done you will continue to get the same results, which is a decreasing economy and attraction in the sport. So Saints can play Warrington 5 times a year and we can pat ourselves on the back that this is better than playing a lesser team whilst contributing to the longer term demise. When we go down to ten teams and they cut the money again are we going to go to 8 because playing the same top teams gives us a better gate?

We discussed this in the show. Keep doing what we are doing our league just gets smaller and smaller. To grow and increase income we have to offer better value, one way is to not repeat the same fixtures time and again. Fans lose interest and the pot gets smaller, increase the exposure, reduce loop fixtures increase interest and the income will hopefully follow. If not we are no worse off and have more teams involved

"Why on earth are we doing this" ? Because we don't have enough money. Because we cannot sell it for enough money to TV channels. The clubs themselves are wanting ten teams so they have more money. It's a reaction to the problems, not the cause of. Ignoring the suggested change and letting clubs adapt so they have more money without considering all the contributing factors is what's dangerous, if we ignore they do this anyway so we must discuss

I think everyone agrees that constant change is bad, but if change can improve what we have why wouldn't we do that? There is a proposal to change anyway, to go to two leagues if 10. So proposals of alternatives are natural and shouldn't be dismissed. The show discusses the challenges we have, funding, the clubs, loop fixtures etc. All of which are challenges which shouldn't be ignored, they should be discussed and corrected if possible, if not we should know the reasons why. Burying your head in the ground and ignoring these challenges is more dangerous than discussing them.

Thanks for reminding me of the Shield, the standards vary in the women's game currently and the structure helps keep it competitive and there's interest at all levels.

Looking for some feedback please We are looking to create a new set with a large table to stand behind, meaning we can more easily fit guests into the studio, would that be better? How long should episodes be? What guests would you like to see? Should the episodes be about the guest or a topic or both? What topics make good viewing? Any other constructive feedback?

We covered these briefly in our short round up show earlier this week. Would be good to review this festival also. Currently investigating press passes so we get more access to these things

If you watched the show you would see my idea of two conferences of 10 rather than leagues, how about that as a hybrid of Martyns idea and the two leagues of 10 idea?

Castleford lost several players to York City Knights at the start of the season, they are still a very good team which shows how great they were. I think Saints are the stand out team, they seem very well coached from Pips insights, mentally well prepared also, so it would be a big upset if Saints didn't win but I'm looking forward to tomorrows games. I want to go but have to strip wallpaper before my painter comes next week true storyif I get it don't in time I'll be there

Ha ha, mad cap or innovative?

Women's rugby league episode here.

Sorry for the bump, just for those who may not have seen it. Here Total Rugby's Martyn Sadler discusses his proposed League structures and why he feels it is a genuine opportunity to share finance, opportunities yet safeguard against over spending. Also looking for feedback on our set up as we're thinking if getting a large table, but that's better for the Dockhouse Rugby thread

Good topic on the show and question in the feed, can the women's game go professional?

Please give the video a like it really helps. And if you can leave a comment on YouTube that would be brilliant. It helps our show but also helps promote the Women's game, it needs more exposure and a comment Junos the video up the feed so more people can find it Thanks all

Live this morning is the latest episode where Saints player Pip Birchall discusses the women's game from amateur through to Super League and International. I also called them the Fittest and Fattest team in the league, meaning Fastest not my only error to date but probably the biggest

Earlier this week we had the pleasure of Pip Birchall Saints and Ireland Rugby star join us in the studio We discussed Women's Rugby along with the LDRL and PDRL and that great Wheelchair Grand Final. We have a longer dedicated episode out early tomorrow morning with Pip discussing her career, development of the Women's game amongst other RL topics but please check out our mini episode here whilst you wait.

Earlier this week we had the pleasure of Pip Birchall Saints and Ireland Rugby star join us in the studio . We discussed Women's Rugby along with the LDRL and PDRL and that great Wheelchair Grand Final. We have a longer dedicated episode out early tomorrow morning with Pip discussing her career, development of the Women's game amongst other RL topics but please check out our mini episode here whilst you wait.

If they could buy it and make income from it great. 8k is big enough I believe, 5k should create demand if they can sell out. Corporate, pitch size, parking, toilets, somewhere to get a pint and public transport are key to making it work IMO