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World Club Championship - Your Thoughts


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On 02/10/2021 at 21:38, Spotty Herbert said:

Without wanting to politicise a topic that deserves proper discussion, the UK is far more backward and insular than it was ten years ago, consequently making it much more like Australia. However, I strongly believe that the insularity and parochialism of the NRL reflects the wider population it serves and this is a barrier to developing the world club championship concept.

To be fair, the Super League clubs are similarly parochial and self interested. We will not develop internationally until we find and support leaders who can drag all the Super League and NRL clubs along behind them with an agenda that convinces them they will all benefit from a stronger world game.

It's pretty ironic that you are so quick to label others 'insular' when it's clear from your writings that you have only the shallowest of understandings about either RL culture in Australia or Australian culture and history more broadly speaking.

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6 hours ago, The Great Dane said:

If you try to sell it as the pinnacle of the club game, or as more important than the NRL GF, you are only going to get a lot of people down here's noses out of joint.

 

I agree that many will see the NRL title as the pinnacle, that’s why I pitched it as “a” pinnacle, rather than “the” pinnacle.

If played straight after a GF and a SL team were to win, there would be few excuses for the naysayers. 

I can’t think of any sport that has a credible playoff title at the start of the season. It defies common sense. Anything other than a season ending WCC is merely an exhibition that at least the Australian public doesn’t associate a lot of prestige to it. So despite players needing 8 weeks off after a GF and all the other hurdles like an international calendar (oh how I wish there was one) will simply need to be navigated.

I suspect the NRL will think it’s easier just to put it in the too hard basket. Shame. 

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5 hours ago, The Great Dane said:

The last time I paid any real attention to the WCC was 2017. The Sharks preparation for the WCC in the weeks leading up to it was to take tours of London, Paris, Barcelona, and probably other places I'm forgetting, to go on regular day trips/shopping sprees, and to go out most nights. I'm sure I don't have to tell you, but that is not how an NRL team prepares for a game they are taking seriously!

I was saving a possible reference to the Sharks for @Sports Prophet. Judged on performances, they are the only example I can think of in recent years who didn`t appear to have adequately prepared.

5 hours ago, The Great Dane said:

In fact it'd be pretty simple if they could pull it off; if they simply took the initiative and held a handful of successful, profitable, WCC's down here, the NRL/club's attitude towards the WCC would quickly shift. 

Really? - You think the RFL have the power to organize a WCC in Australia. And this would be without the wholehearted cooperation of the NRL, who would meekly comply and just provide the opposition?

 

5 hours ago, The Great Dane said:

So yeah, 19k in Melbourne is not really a great turnout for what is meant to be a big a event. Especially not when it's in the preseason before the AFL's season has kicked off...

I stand by the comment that 19k is a healthy attendance for a pre-season one-off game. It passes the threshold for the occasion to come across well on TV.

Standalone club fixtures, where the whole competition consists of just one game, are a hard sell in any sport. The world club Soccer game between the European and South American champions has never generated much interest over here, so far as I recall. 

In my view, the best time to play the WCC in Oz is a fortnight before the start of the NRL regular season, with that game on Friday night followed by the women`s and men`s Indigenous/Maori games on the Saturday.

Rugby League, unlike Aussie Rules, has a modest international profile and is conspicuously more multicultural. A weekend emphasizing these two advantages over their main rival is a good way to launch into another year of code war. 

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16 hours ago, unapologetic pedant said:

I was saving a possible reference to the Sharks for @Sports Prophet. Judged on performances, they are the only example I can think of in recent years who didn`t appear to have adequately prepared.

Melbourne have always treated it as a chore and half ###### it, they've just had such good teams that it's not as obvious. Manly's trip in 2012 was similar to the Sharks. In fact pretty much every club in the last 20 years that I can remember has either treated it as an excuse to go on a bender or as a glorified trial game except the Roosters, St. George, and Rabbitohs.

 Maybe some others have taken it seriously as well, but even so they're still in the minority.

16 hours ago, unapologetic pedant said:

Really? - You think the RFL have the power to organize a WCC in Australia. And this would be without the wholehearted cooperation of the NRL, who would meekly comply and just provide the opposition?

Absolutely.

It'd be no different to Wigan and Hull organising their matches down here in 2017, except they'd have a more attractive product to sell than a SL game and a couple exhibition matches.

The NRL wouldn't care as long as they got their cut. The NRL clubs would probably be relieved that they don't have to travel to England a few weeks before the season starts and all they have to do is show up on the night. I'd even bet that local governments and sponsors would be keen to support the event.

So yeah it's more than within the RFL's means, and if they handled it right it could be a pretty big deal for them. 

16 hours ago, unapologetic pedant said:

I stand by the comment that 19k is a healthy attendance for a pre-season one-off game. It passes the threshold for the occasion to come across well on TV.

Well you can give up on the NRL ever taking the WCC seriously if you are comfortable with those sorts of turnouts...

The only way the NRL will ever embrace it is if it's a big money spinner for them, and 19k in Melbourne at that time of year for what is supposedly a big event, potentially once in a lifetime, isn't a big money spinner by any reasonable standard.

Now I accept that the 2018 WCC was hastily thrown together, and that had it been better organised it probably would have drawn better, but at that time of the year in Melbourne (when there's literally no major sports competition in the city) you'd want to be pushing towards a sell out at AAMI (30k) for it to be considered a significant success.

16 hours ago, unapologetic pedant said:

Standalone club fixtures, where the whole competition consists of just one game, are a hard sell in any sport. The world club Soccer game between the European and South American champions has never generated much interest over here, so far as I recall.

That sounds like they are struggling with issues similar to the ones Super Rugby had when RSA clubs came to Aus and NZ, and vice versa, more than anything.

16 hours ago, unapologetic pedant said:

In my view, the best time to play the WCC in Oz is a fortnight before the start of the NRL regular season, with that game on Friday night followed by the women`s and men`s Indigenous/Maori games on the Saturday.

Rugby League, unlike Aussie Rules, has a modest international profile and is conspicuously more multicultural. A weekend emphasizing these two advantages over their main rival is a good way to launch into another year of code war. 

I don't have a strong opinion on when the WCC should be played. I recognise the issues with playing it in the preseason, but I can't come up with a better alternative that doesn't have issues as well.

I also wouldn't link it with the All Stars game either. Lets put it this way; the only reason the NRL has continued to persist with the All Stars match is because they're afraid of being called racist if they cancel it permanently...

I also don't really see RL's international profile or perceived multiculturalism as a significant advantage over Aussie Rules either, but that is a whole other discussion.

Edited by The Great Dane
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On 04/10/2021 at 19:28, The Great Dane said:

It's pretty ironic that you are so quick to label others 'insular' when it's clear from your writings that you have only the shallowest of understandings about either RL culture in Australia or Australian culture and history more broadly speaking.

On that topic we will have to agree to disagree. All I can see from your posts that is that you believe the NRL needs take no responsibility for the promotion of the game outside their own backyard. To me, that is a very good definition of "insular".

I have visited Australia, watched the game in Sydney and Brisbane, read widely about Australian history and RL culture and would suggest that I understand far more than you give me credit for. I wish I could give your posts more credit.

Edited by Spotty Herbert
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Keep it to be played after both the NRL & Super League seasons are completed

Edited by R L Winger
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2021.jpg

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11 hours ago, Spotty Herbert said:

On that topic we will have to agree to disagree. All I can see from your posts that is that you believe the NRL needs take no responsibility for the promotion of the game outside their own backyard. To me, that is a very good definition of "insular".

If that's all you are getting from my posts then you need help with your comprehension skills.

If it wasn't for the NRL's promotion and player development RL would barely exist in the Southern Hemisphere outside of Australia and PNG. It'd have no mainstream presence in NZ, and it'd effectively not exist in the rest of the PI's.

So yeah, they already take heaps of responsibility for the promotion of the game outside of Australia, in fact they do significantly more for RL in NZ and the PI's than they do in more than half of Australia, which BTW is a terrible state of affairs and an abdication of their responsibility to the sport.

Could they do more? Maybe, it depends on the situation. However they have no obligation to do so, just like the RFL has no obligation to give funding to other nations or develop players en masse throughout their region...

So yes the NRL does have some responsibility to promote of the game outside of Australia, however that does not mean that they have a responsibility to participate in events that are going to negatively effect them, financially or otherwise, simply because it might positively effect others. You have to take care of yourself before you can take care of others.

11 hours ago, Spotty Herbert said:

I have visited Australia, watched the game in Sydney and Brisbane, read widely about Australian history and RL culture and would suggest that I understand far more than you give me credit for. I wish I could give your posts more credit.

"I've been to Sydney and read a couple books, so I think I'm better placed to run your affairs than you are."

How stereotypical of you...

Edited by The Great Dane
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