ELBOWSEYE

After the dust has settled I think the match has to be looked at overall,
Was it a success: Yes high quality game with two highly committed sides.
The need for the concept to be pushed further is needed to develop the game and to close the gap on standards in the two comps.
As for the Wire fans who stayed at home and couldn't be bothered to turn up the Sky cameras could never replicate a top atmosphere and when you speak to a couple from London who travelled seven hours on the motorways to be there it shames some of the locals.
The debate about the refs should not let us get side tracked from the overall experience and were these building blocks could help move the club game on.

Problem with your view, it was not so clear cut as even the commentary team could not agree after numerous views.

The tackle was not a shoulder charge (in my opinion) but I agree he leapt up into the player. The tackle by ben Westwood last week against Salford was worse but he was just sin binned so the panel are like the referees inconsistent.

buy a Ferrari and plough the fields with it and wonder why it makes little impact,
two things amaze me is how people turn up and watch that and why SB has now starting his best years wasting the talent he has standing around bored on a rugby pitch.

Record crowd for Sale yesterday of 11,247 against Leicester, closely followed by Quins playing a 'home' game at a sold-out Twickers (82,000).

If true well done but I saw footage of an empty stadium at Salford when they quoted a 10k crowd as for the one at RU HQ  no knocking that they are the Gerald Ratners of sport and fair credit to the people who pulled that off. As I originally said they only shout at the successes and sweep the opposite end stories under the carpet, the exact opposite happens when reporting on RL. 

I'm not very convinced by that squad, particularly in the halves. You could argue that its possibly an improvement on last year's squad, but not as much so as Catalans with Carney, or indeed Saints with Burns (and Walsh available for more than half a season). Its probably safe to assume that Wigan will be their usual selves, so I'd expect those to the the top 3, with Wire, Leeds, Cas and Hudds scrapping for 4th place, maybe along with Salford, who have also improved much more than Wire on paper at least, and finished last season quite strongly.

And then there's HKR, with more or less an entirely new team capable of anything from hopeless to challengers, and the 'comatose giant' of Hull FC, whose squads don't lose much in comparison to Wire's either.

All told, I'd think the Wire are just as likely to finish outside the 8 as coming away with the league leaders shield.

Can't wait to find out though!

Big hook but I will jump on it, the squad last year performed well above what was expected but the signings and the extra experience of the younger players puts them high on the grid and any person who understands the game would expect them to be in the mix when trophies are handed out. outside the 8, really I think the forum needs to introduce testing on forum members if you are serious.

Letting Chris Riley go and signing Kevin Penny.  Somebody explain that to me please.

Letting Riley go was right for the player and club, the retaining of Penny makes no sense.

I am sure there are options from the academy side who are worth a punt and if the unannounced addition who word has it is a centre/ stand off it makes even less sense.

Oh well may as well make up a hat trick of replies.

 

In theory yes, but in practice how do clubs "make progress" without investment, and where do clubs get the investment money from? It could come from profit i.e. staying so far in the black that there's lots of money left to invest in building the club.

 

But I find it hard to find any club that has done this or is doing this now. It may be that Leeds have become a bigger and better club post their 1996 crisis, but I don't know how much still unpaid directors loans were in the mix.

 

Can anyone actually name a club that has built itself up without being gifted big money to get there?

How clubs were given or loaned money is not the issue its how they are run now that matters, they could have been run well for 50 years and gone bust now, the net result is they are bust. The need for income to fund sports clubs is now more critical than ever before, costs are generally more impacting now and the need for off the field revenue more important. The accounts are now open to scrutiny now so how money is brought into clubs and spent is easier to see. If a benefactor supports a club but does not improve the club to be self sufficient he will be a short term success but if he develops the club structures to be more financial effective it could be a long term plan. 

Only change in the 19 is Wood replacing Russell, no Westwood.
Will play Ratchford at FB and bring in Wood as prop and put Harrison at 13.

I will humour you, the timeline in the list of what he wants to do need to be considered, the proposal to buy RU players was a ploy to break the salary cap, the plans changed when Harris was appointed and he failed to get backing for the cap proposals. The NRL club was talked about and although he has the money, the ease that he bought Salford is not going to work in the NRL with a cash rich competition.

He has plenty of money/enthusiasm/drive/ideas but he would be better off working at reducing Sale Sharks grip in the stadium so he can promote the local club in the local stadium.

The performances have improved (before Wakefield) and with the recruits for next season they will get better, he had unreal hopes on what his squad was capable of but Harris will move them in the right direction and also advise him on who to recruit.

Just watching the tape. No quarrel with the decision.

Stood watching the game with a club full of Saints fans and thought the decision was correct and a brave call by the ref,

Saints fans still thought the ref was bent to Leeds though.

This is just Dr morecash spitting his dummy again and having a tantrum because he didn't get the vote to go his way.

 

McManus (and several of the other chairman) have said that they're not opposed to having a marquee player in the future, now isn't the right time for it as there's too many other more pressing issues in the game to sort out. All a marquee player rule will do is see large amounts of money disappear into the pocket of a few individual players (and their agents) instead of it being invested in other parts of the game.

 

McManus has said he wants to see all clubs spending the full cap, all clubs at least breaking even each year, all clubs investing heavily in their youth teams and having them be top rated by the RFL, He also wants to see the reintroduction of an U21's / U23's competition and greater exemptions from the cap for 'home grown' players.

When some of these things have been achieved then he says he will consider voting for the marquee player suggestion.

 

Morecash just wants a quick fix instead of working hard to achieve results

This is the same chairman who bailed saints out for years in the old ground when they spent big on marquee players from all over to gain success, yet now he gets these morals from the position of having a new stadium that will help the club self finance.

He can give the good doctor tips on how to breach the cap as well?

I think Smith has taken Wire as far as he can go and they would need a new coach to take them the last step. I think last Year's GF defeat broke them in a way that would take Smith longer to mend than a new coach. Wigan's players now fundamentally know that following Wane's methods will lead them to be champions, as do Leeds under McD. In an era without the giants of the epic Saints and Bradford line ups, organisation, tactical acumen, motivation and great youth development are the keys to success. Smith's approach was a sensible one and nearly paid off - trust great players wherever they came from. He cannot now switch to growing his own team and improve on what he has already achieved without years of patience.
He is a brilliant club builder, and a decent tactician, but Wire would be better off with a new coach, if Moran's money can persuade a top Aussie to take it on. Of course, if it's Agar they'll have their own Moyes season.

Some wishful thinking going on here, he has been developing good youngsters who are starting to come through, he has top quality youngsters (Clarke) replacing M Monas next season and is in he middle of a 3 year plan with the present squad. And last years GF was not won by tactical genius just taking advantage of another teams critical injuries.

Cheers, couldn't see anything on the RFL at a quick glance.

Ratchford did wrong IMHO, certainly held on too long

talking to a few local players who all thought Ratchford was lucky and certainly meant it, I was convinced he wold lose his EGP to not pick up a ban. How does each grade work with regards to possible bans.

On match day marketing or any marketing Warrington are slowly realising they need to develop one to attract and keep fans, a winning team is only a small part, from what I see Wigan have an aggressive marketing outlook because with the ground not being theirs they need to maximise match day revenues.

The clubs need to be more proactive in encouraging non rugby fans to games as well as looking at ways to keep existing ones, maybe they need develop games as events not just a game.

If he had been a league player he would have been a success, he had the qualities to become a world class centre. He also could have had the chance to test himself at the highest club level comp in any code in the NRL.