England Squad

[MatthewWoody]

3 minutes ago, Spidey said:

Difference is if he excels for England and the Aussies like him they'll pick him again. Same doesn't happen in soccer as you can't switch 

Not sure about it.
Australia are 'arrogant' enough not to pick a player that's already played for England.

I repeat, it's curious how people don't see the irony of refusing heritage/residency players and then playing SAMOA. Don't watch the game and don't watch RLWC if it's so, 'cause it'll be full of players playing for heritage/residency often after switching their Int choice. 

'Stealing' Australia a player would something I'd be happy, too, when/if he proves good. 

[wackojacko]

1 hour ago, MatthewWoody said:

Not sure about it.
Australia are 'arrogant' enough not to pick a player that's already played for England.

I repeat, it's curious how people don't see the irony of refusing heritage/residency players and then playing SAMOA. Don't watch the game and don't watch RLWC if it's so, 'cause it'll be full of players playing for heritage/residency often after switching their Int choice. 

'Stealing' Australia a player would something I'd be happy, too, when/if he proves good. 

Can you not see the difference between your team and someone else's team? Unsurprisingly, people here care a lot more about England's selection policy.

[MatthewWoody]

Just now, wackojacko said:

Can you not see the difference between your team and someone else's team? Unsurprisingly, people here care a lot more about England's selection policy.

The problem is that it's hypocrite not to want heritage player and then bothering playing a test against a team that is full of them. And that wouln't be competitive without. 
Don't you see the double standard, here? 
A person with Engish FAMILY is Australian and English. 
People need to accept it. 

Otherwise, I'd refuse playing a team like Samoa or watching this game. 

[wackojacko]

1 hour ago, MatthewWoody said:

The problem is that it's hypocrite not to want heritage player and then bothering playing a test against a team that is full of them. And that wouln't be competitive without. 
Don't you see the double standard, here? 
A person with Engish FAMILY is Australian and English. 
People need to accept it. 

Otherwise, I'd refuse playing a team like Samoa or watching this game. 

Not really, no. Pretty clear that English people don't want mediocre heritage players who'd much prefer to play for Australia. International sport doesn't work if you can play for everyone. 

[MatthewWoody]

Just now, wackojacko said:

Not really, no. Pretty clear that English people don't want mediocre heritage players who'd much prefer to play for Australia. International sport doesn't work if you can play for everyone. 

In fact they're playing for England and they fully qualify for it. 
Don't bother watching the game, by the way, as the main part of the Samoan team would prefer to play for Oz/NZ, if picked. 

[Hvy wg]

The problem is that you can switch nations. You should not be able to. 

McQueen : Queensland, England, could still get picked by Australia.
Hayne : NSW, Australia, Fiji, could still get picked by Australia.
Uate : Fiji, NSW, Australia, Fiji, could still get picked by Australia.

To be honest, applying my own logic Baitieri shouldn't play for France as he representend Australia when young. Pick one, stay with one. 

 

[Spidey]

7 minutes ago, MatthewWoody said:

In fact they're playing for England and they fully qualify for it. 
Don't bother watching the game, by the way, as the main part of the Samoan team would prefer to play for Oz/NZ, if picked. 

The fact that the game isn't taking place in England or Samoa just shows where we are at for International RL

[MatthewWoody]

2 minutes ago, Hvy wg said:

The problem is that you can switch nations. You should not be able to. 

McQueen : Queensland, England, could still get picked by Australia.
Hayne : NSW, Australia, Fiji, could still get picked by Australia.
Uate : Fiji, NSW, Australia, Fiji, could still get picked by Australia.

To be honest, applying my own logic Baitieri shouldn't play for France as he representend Australia when young. Pick one, stay with one. 

 

This would kill rugby league, at the moment. 
Samoa themselves, that is now credited as the new deal and the 4th force, wouln't be so strong without the possibility for players to switch nations. 
This, if we want to be realistic enough. 

+

NSW /QLD are not national teams. 

+

Didn't they decide you can't switch from tier 1 to another tier 1? 

[MatthewWoody]

Just now, Spidey said:

The fact that the game isn't taking place in England or Samoa just shows where we are at for International RL

So don't bother commenting the squad, I'd say. 
Back seriously, would we be better with a 5 teams' World Cup, or a WC full of cricket scores? 

[wackojacko]

1 hour ago, MatthewWoody said:

In fact they're playing for England and they fully qualify for it. 
Don't bother watching the game, by the way, as the main part of the Samoan team would prefer to play for Oz/NZ, if picked. 

Again, quite clearly, just talking about my team, England.

[MatthewWoody]

Just now, wackojacko said:

Again, quite clearly, just talking about my team, England.

The problem is that, for coherence, if McQueen is not English according to your standard, than this is not an International, given Samoan are not really Samoan (still, according to your paradigm of thought).
Then why do you care commenting the squad for a match that shouln't take place (still, using your standard)? 

[Spidey]

2 minutes ago, MatthewWoody said:

So don't bother commenting the squad, I'd say. 
Back seriously, would we be better with a 5 teams' World Cup, or a WC full of cricket scores? 

This is just about an England squad announcement. If you want to debate heritage/World Cup etc please feel free to open a threead

my point still stands England have enough players without needing to pick other countries cast offs especially in the back row

Just now, MatthewWoody said:

The problem is that, for coherence, if McQueen is not English according to your standard, than this is not an International, given Samoan are not really Samoan (still, according to your paradigm of thought).
Then why do you care commenting the squad for a match that shouln't take place (still, using your standard)? 

Start a thread about the Samoan squad when it's announced if it's of that much interest to you

[Hvy wg]

Just now, MatthewWoody said:

This would kill rugby league, at the moment. 
Samoa themselves, that is now credited as the new deal and the 4th force, wouln't be so strong without the possibility for players to switch nations. 
This, if we want to be realistic enough. 

+

NSW /QLD are not national teams. 

+

Didn't they decide you can't switch from tier 1 to another tier 1? 

International rugby league is already killed by those decisions as it is way too easy for heritage teams to be better than countries that actually try. Those rules are a short term fix for the next world cup so we don't appear like we really are. 

Samoa shouldn't be strong, they have nothing. All they have are Australian and New Zealanders of Samoan heritage. What is Samoa doing for the game? Nothing. They're an empty team. 

If the Australians need to change the rules to pick someone, they will, like they did for Radradra. Radradra is the perfect example, he was born and bred in Fiji, spent his life in Fiji and should have been playing for Fiji only. The Australians saw an excellent player, changed the rules, boom Radradra plays for Australia now! 

If McQueen plays for England and nails it, we will see another change of rules and boom, McQueen plays for Australia now! 

[wackojacko]

1 hour ago, MatthewWoody said:

The problem is that, for coherence, if McQueen is not English according to your standard, than this is not an International, given Samoan are not really Samoan (still, according to your paradigm of thought).
Then why do you care commenting the squad for a match that shouln't take place (still, using your standard)? 

It's not incoherent to care about your team more than the opposition. It represents you to some extent.

I don't think it's unfair of anyone to want people in their squad who genuinely care about representing them, this isn't the business of the club game.

[MatthewWoody]

Just now, Spidey said:

This is just about an England squad announcement. If you want to debate heritage/World Cup etc please feel free to open a threead

my point still stands England have enough players without needing to pick other countries cast offs especially in the back row

Start a thread about the Samoan squad when it's announced if it's of that much interest to you

It's not and I consider those player legitimately Samoan.
I don't have the incoherence to evaluate situation and picks with a double standard.
If McQueen is not an English for you, then the whole (almost all) Samoan squad is not an International team and you shouln't be watching the test.
Abouot England having enough players ... I don't know. For sure, we're talking about players that are used to play in the best competition in the world and to play vs the best players week after week.
How can you not see the contradiction in not wanting players with English family roots and then play SAMOA is beyond me.  

[MatthewWoody]

4 minutes ago, Hvy wg said:

International rugby league is already killed by those decisions as it is way too easy for heritage teams to be better than countries that actually try. Those rules are a short term fix for the next world cup so we don't appear like we really are. 

Samoa shouldn't be strong, they have nothing. All they have are Australian and New Zealanders of Samoan heritage. What is Samoa doing for the game? Nothing. They're an empty team. 

If the Australians need to change the rules to pick someone, they will, like they did for Radradra. Radradra is the perfect example, he was born and bred in Fiji, spent his life in Fiji and should have been playing for Fiji only. The Australians saw an excellent player, changed the rules, boom Radradra plays for Australia now! 

If McQueen plays for England and nails it, we will see another change of rules and boom, McQueen plays for Australia now! 

Are Fijy tier 1? 

[Hvy wg]

Just now, MatthewWoody said:

Are Fijy tier 1? 

They're not, it doesn't change a thing. As said, Australia will change the rules if they want to. 

[MatthewWoody]

2 minutes ago, wackojacko said:

It's not incoherent to care about your team more than the opposition. It represents you to some extent.

I don't think it's unfair of anyone to want people in their squad who genuinely care about representing them, this isn't the business of the club game.

While you think it's fair to deny people with English family roots can be Australian and English at the same time.
18th century mentality. 

[MatthewWoody]

Just now, Hvy wg said:

They're not, it doesn't change a thing. As said, Australia will change the rules if they want to. 

1) Yes it does. 
2) Fantasy. 

[wackojacko]

1 hour ago, MatthewWoody said:

While you think it's fair to deny people with English family roots can be Australian and English at the same time.
18th century mentality. 

I actually don't really mind that, as I said if they were any good then it wouldn't really bother me. But choose one, don't come play for England as a last-minute option. What I mostly took issue with is that you think English fans have no right to care who plays for their team and to hold them to a higher standard than the opposition. It's their team. Of course they care more.

[Hvy wg]

Just now, MatthewWoody said:

1) Yes it does. 
2) Fantasy. 

Dude they already did it for Radradra. They will do it again if they see a player they could use. 

Most of the English here don't want McQueen in the national team because he's only there as Australia won't pick him.

[MatthewWoody]

Just now, wackojacko said:

I actually don't really mind that, as I said if they were any good then it wouldn't really bother me. But choose one, don't come play for England as a last-minute option. What I mostly took issue with is that you think English fans have no right to care who plays for their team and to hold them to a higher standard than the opposition. It's their team. Of course they care more.

So I'm not English and can't have an opinion about it? An opinion different than yours? 
Remember me this rule when it comes to talk about Italian rl. 
Still, I find it odd not considering English a player with English family roots, but it must be me.
You know, I'm not English and can't say my thought. 

[wackojacko]

1 hour ago, MatthewWoody said:

So I'm not English and can't have an opinion about it? An opinion different than yours? 
Remember me this rule when it comes to talk about Italian rl. 
Still, I find it odd not considering English a player with English family roots, but it must be me.
You know, I'm not English and can't say my thought. 

Yeah but your opinion is "DON'T WATCH IT' because some people don't want Aussie cast-offs. You can say it all you like but it's that that I disagree with.

[Hvy wg]

As a binational myself, I whined when my second country picked 6 players from my first country. I can understand the English on this one.

[MatthewWoody]

Just now, wackojacko said:

Yeah but your opinion is "DON'T WATCH IT' because some people don't want Aussie cast-offs. You can say it all you like but it's that that I disagree with.

My opinion is don't watch it because, according to your standard, Samoa are not an International team. 
Why bother, if so?