Exiled Wiganer

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About Exiled Wiganer

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    Surrey - South London Sharks land

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  1. I am sorry for the scope creep. It's like a new ride in Parkyland - you can fall off as many times you like and never get hurt! Back on track - the only time in the last few years I can recall a centrally generated buzz about the game was the last World Cup - so the RFL can build the game up when they try. Why don't they seem to try? How hard is it in this internet world we live in for them to put together clips to go "viral"? As a Wigan fan they have tweets, probably a Facebook page, they e mail me regularly - and it is interesting stuff they put out which does pique my interest. I assume that other leading clubs such as Lesss and Wire do the same - Does the RFL do anything? Given how many tickets I have bought from them over the years they must surely have my details...
  2. It is very annoying - I don't care deeply about it but I find the combination of victimhood and avoidance of responsibility inherent in the concept to be personally annoying. As for substantiating this, well it is a rule that we have in place, put i place by the RFL with some degree of acceptance by the clubs - either approval or acquiescence. It is a rule so lacking in controversy as to have attracted precisely no threads criticising it until it has been applied to a particular club. So, we have at least tacit acceptance and no objection until recently. Which is suggestive that it is at best reasonable and at worst not irrational. It is a genuine attempt to give pause for thought and to encourage clubs to live within their means and ensure a level playing field. As we do not live in Philip K Dick time travel times, in common with most penalties the approach is 1 - identify the undesirable behaviour 2 - agree sanction 3 - apply sanction. Of course it is possible to have a range of views on crime and punishment - criminology is a fascinating area - here we have an approach that satisfies the rubriicks set out above, which has been accepted by the game.
  3. That was one of and the least significant of the points I was looking to make. I have read many points in favour of clean slates and am not convinced by any of them. If we could come up with incentives in that genuinely prevented behaviour we don't like we could turn our prisons into coffee shops. I think it has no merit as an argument but accept that is only my view. Meanwhile - is it Draper's job to get us enthused? Maybe he has some tricks for the next couple of weeks. I wonder whether Sky will produce new ad for the new season - Wiggo and Sam was wonderful...
  4. Sins of the father boo hoo is the single most annoying concept I can recall in discussions on our game since Gutter's "contributions". We exist in a league system in which the vast majority deserve to be protected from the small proportion who can't or refuse to count. As for the rest of the piece it's ok. I think the BBC have upped their game in the quality (though not the quantity) of coverage they give us. I agree entirely with JB's analysis - one area where we seem woefully weak is centrally creating a buzz around the game. Look at the spread of clubs in our top 3 tiers - 4 countries, every part of England covered. Surely it is not beyond the wit of man to sell that... maybe Draper (assuming it is his job?) has something up his sleeve. Personally I am so excited about the Cronulla games I am counting the days. They just need to be much weaker than Leigh and we'll be fine. Oh and having watched Deadpool am sort of looking forward fto more ninja tackles...
  5. I think it's 3 years for France, and 5 for England, Oz and NZ. Minga the winger - I like it!
  6. May I suggest as a compromise that we all try and live in the present?
  7. Both teams' seasons went pretty well last year. As it was a testimonial, credit to both sets of fans for getting nearly 6k there.
  8. And there are others at Saints as well. 1 if you are saying that clubs need rich backers when they fall on hard times, that is precisely my point. A lot of the examples you give are arguable at best, but that's fine. 2 and well done them, but see 1 above, they could not sustain it when things went wrong. 3 CLEARLY it's not as the vast majority of other clubs in this system survive without going bust 3 times. 4 not rich enough, or dedicated enough to the Bulls, so see 1 above. The rest is supposition at best, but irrelevant. 5 I think you mean here that indirectly Bradford may have now got a money man. If so, great. Happy days. Still, no acknowledgement that the RFL are not to blame, though that is implicit in 1. Tbh, it seems so self evident that the RFL have gone the extra yard on this, that I am beginning to wonder whether I am on everyone's ignored list, or else am like Bruce Willis in the 6th Sense...
  9. No, I am not looking to blame the RFL that one particular club has managed to go bust 3 times. I am indeed not doing so. The vast majority of the other clubs in this system have avoided that - which strongly suggests it is specific rather than systemic. If this fails though it will be because there aren't enough Bradfordians prepared to continue to follow the club, and there is no one with sufficiently deep pockets prepared to bridge the gap. Sorting Bradford out is not the RFL's primary or even secondary purpose - it is something that has been forced upon them by others' failings. I am not suggesting that this process was perfect. Or that the outcome will lead to the level of investment that will see Bradford being another club getting 5 figure crowds regularly again. Maybe it will, maybe it won't. Happily, we have a lot of other clubs for whom that is a reality. Which strongly suggests this system works.
  10. Been a while since I checked this thread, but I see that the RFL continues to get it in the neck from all sides. I would again posit a counter view that they have had to spend massive amounts of time (for which they will not charge) dealing with problems not of their own making, and seemingly steering Bradford towards a position in which they have a world class coach, a squad and a future in 2017. I know I am a lone voice, but I think that is a very creditable effort.
  11. Bless. Out-supported as well.
  12. I agree. There is arguably far more "head in the sand" refusal from fans to look at the wider context and the slow but real strides the sport is taking. Thus, some unquantified but seemingly statistically minor decline on one measure becomes a dying game and made up figures thrown out of context becomes a financial black hole. Oh and "transparency" - presumably more tweets? As on other threads there is a complete refusal in some parts of the game to acknowledge anything positive. The RFL could do lots of things better and I would hold a street party if Wood and Rimmer stood down, but the game is doing just fine.
  13. I agree with you entirely Dave. I think the RFL does some things pretty well - insolvencies, disciplinary, development at semi pro level - which are the sorts of things administrators should be good at. They are not good at the international side save when they set aside enough resources to do it property. I think that this flaw can only be properly sorted by a fully functioning RLIF who could be charged with the vision and coordination that is an RFL weak point. I wish we had a Maurice type character to sell our game and challenge us to make the most of what we have. Maybe the chairmen should break away - as Marwan I think has hinted... i still love our game as much as ever and am hugely looking forward to the 2 Aussie clubs coming over, seeing our young players develop, watching London regularly again, seeing WA possibly New Zealand for the World Cup. There is still so much to like. - one thing that strikes me is that our view of the present is heavily influenced by our memories of the past - I was very fortunate to start watching Wigan in our relegation season, when the game generally was at a very low point - so that may make me more appreciative of what we see today...
  14. I am confused as to the scope of this discussion. I was wondering earlier whether my suspicion that Bradford had only been a big club for the period immediately after SL started was borne out by the facts. So I had a quick look at attendances for the last 40 years and was astonished by what I saw. Last year we had 6 clubs averaging upwards (or very close indeed to) 5 figure crowds. We take that for granted but it is a hell of an achievement for the game. Leaving aside sell outs (which is an odd measure in some ways as it depends on the size of the ground), taking that stat and/or the number of 5 figure crowds, or the average attendances, we are demonstrably in a golden age. That might be down to wonderful people like Moran and McManus but it is an achievement. Then again, there is geographic spread. Our 3 pro leagues will have teams from 4 countries and from pretty much all corners of England playing in them this year. Take a step back and consider that for an achievement. Again, great people like Perez and Guasch may deserve the lion's share of the game. The RFL have pretty much saved Bradford after they went bust again, running a competitive process, and concluding a deal at lightning speed... On the international side, we had by far the most successful World Cup we have ever had in 2013 with crowds and a range of competitive teams which would have been unheard of 20 years ago. On that basis a very strong case could be made for the RFL knowing its elbow from its behind...
  15. It depends who says it. It is classic Graham Lowe - let others worry about the money and he will sell you a vision and enthusiasm. He has been at we'll run clubs before and said similar things. He is a great man, who loves and believes in our great game. His role should be front office while the money men deal with budgets. incidentally, something that had been nagging away from me was whether Bradford were a big club. So I went back to look at a couple of my old rothmans. The first covered late 70s to mid 80s and the second early to late 90s. Essentially, in the 20 years prior to SL we had crowds far far smaller than we have today across the board. In '17 we may well see 6 clubs with 5 figure averages. 6! That level of popularity spread across the competition would have been completely unheard of in those days. If we consider a club as big because if it could attract 5 figure attendances at least a few times a season, then Hull, Wigan, Leeds and Saints could point to periods between the late 70s and SL when they either did or got close. No other club did, including Bradford. Since then, we have seen Catalans (a special case) and Warrington added to that list. Warrington are a great success story - off the back of a new ground. For a time, Bradford were in that company. A number of things strike me about the 6 success stories: - the 4 (inc Cats) really long term successes have very deep roots in their communities with schools and clubs, and a deep local identity; - Hull drew on those factors and had the gift of a modern stadium to drive up attendances. They were arguably a sleeping giant as the early 80s showed they could get relatively vast crowds; - Warrington are something of an outlier, with historically fewer clubs and juniors, but are a model of how to build a club. You only need to look at the local paper to see how significant their league club is to them. Their fans are a credit to the game, supporting international games, and travelling in universally good natured large numbers. I don't know enough about Bradford to predict whether they will ever be as big a club as these 6. But the Bulls are only part of the picture - how deep are the roots of the game in schools and clubs? They produce wonderful players, and still have a good academy. Do the people of Bradford care enough about the club and its team to follow them in enough numbers to make a difference? Aside from the period in which everything went in their favour they would seem to be no bigger or smaller than HKR or Cas - great clubs both but not one of the big 6. It will be fascinating to see where they go from here. If I were a betting man I think they will be in the top league again within the next decade but will never enjoy again the boom times they enjoyed at the advent of SL. Which is the lot of the vast majority of clubs.