Chris22

I'm optimistic about that too. Leigh are taking a good following to Salford and hopefully the home fans turn up in numbers. Warrington's crowds have been a touch disappointing this year, so I hope for an uplift too (and hopefully a general uplift next year after a strong 2023). I used to prefer the top 5 system as it gave a distinct advantage to each side, the higher you finished. But it led to too many repeat line ups, which this system avoids. I wasn't too keen this system at first but I have changed my view lately. Only point I would disagree with is the optimistic away followings. This Saints fan who will be attending on Saturday is certainly far from that!

There is a misconception that play off crowds are lower than regular season ones, at least recently. Since 2022, when we introduced the current top 6 system, every single crowd has been higher than the home teams average over the course of the season. There has been an uplift compared to the regular season. Yes, play off crowds have struggled in the past but for the last two seasons that has not been the case.

Hard one to call this. We were far improved last week (yes, it was only Castleford but our attack had more speed and options that I have seen for most of the season). I would like to think we would have motivation to get a home play off tie and to make up for embarrassing display at Leigh last time. With Catalans playing Hull, Leigh are essentially starting the play offs a week earlier, win or bust. I think we are in for a brilliant game. IF Saints can win, I would feel a lot more confident about the play offs than I do now!

Are the BBC not showing Hull FC v Catalans on Saturday? It got moved last week?

Dreadful. Firstly, for Wigan and Salford fans who get their match shifted with 6 days notice. If Wigan lose, their fans leave the ground not knowing if they win the League Leaders' Shield or not. If both Wigan and Hull KR lose, Wigan then do not get a trophy presentation. In the likely event that Wigan win, it removes most of the jeopardy and excitement from the Hull KR v Leeds game on the Friday. If Salford have not guaranteed a play off spot, it also means Leeds and Leigh know exactly what is needed to get a play off spot, giving an unfair advantage. We have also moved Hull FC v Catalans. That means if Catalans have a shot of a play off spot by then, again, they know exactly what they have to achieve, giving an unfair advantage. And it kills most of the drama of the final round. I can't see how that is in Sky's interest? Last year's three way race for the League Leaders' Shield was great, so was the last day relegation battle in 2019. Why would we not want that again?

Match is being shown on BBC iPlayer tonight.

If you start sending players for an automatic HIA when the defender is a card, that is no deterrent. Player goes off, passes HIA immediately, team gains an extra sub.

I think the best summary of the quality of this match is that around 1 page of it was talking about London v Leeds!

3,877 (probably between 600 and 700 Saints fans).

We tend to, yes. It's the lowest I can recall this season.

Jeez that's a poor following from us.

Salford certainly trying!

The Saints Heritage Society (click here) has some further information about that match. Doesn't go into detail about sending offs or similar but does contain our line up.

Call me old fashioned, but I preferred when winning rugby league matches decided your fate rather than debating what does or does not constitute a director's loan.

Looks like we're having a reshuffle with Whitby making his debut. Expected team is Robertson, Makinson, Blake, Vaughan, Ritson, Lomax, Whitby, Delaney, Mbye, Lees, Batchelor, Whitley Matautai Paasi, Stephens, Burns, Davies

London are going to be relegated this year and I see no route for them to return under any system aside from promotion and relegation. With the exception of football, interest in the second tier of any sport in this country is minute. For rugby league to have a TV deal for its second tier for so long was remarkable (and to turn it down was foolhardy in the extreme). In a city like London, it's hard to attract attention. A part time club playing part time players for clubs who very few in London have ever heard of is a tough sell. I see the IMG system doing one of two things and I'm not sure which. The first is it will eventually create a closed shop. Or, there will be a number of clubs who are so close in the rankings that there will be so much chopping and changing of clubs for such factitious factors that stability becomes impossible. Remember, teams will only learn that they are in Super League for the next season several weeks after the season has ended. So if you're an at risk club, recruitment becomes a lot tougher. And therefore so does competing. Back to London, before we do anything, we need to figure out what we want. Do we want a professional club? If so, you have to make them a special case. Guarantee them a place in Super League, give them salary cap exemptions and essentially centrally fund them. Problem is we can't afford that. I'm not sure a part time club bumbling around in the Championship does much more than not existing as eventually the player pool will run dry with a route to the top cut off. Or do we see London as an 'event' place. Don't bother with a team at all and target all of our resources into things like a Magic Weekend, the Challenge Cup or internationals. I'd suggest the London market would be more tuned in to international competition rather than events with clubs from northern towns that they haven't even heard of.

That squad should be good enough to compete and any injury excuse would be flimsy, in my view. I expect Hull KR to win but would be disappointed if we don't push Hull KR pretty strongly.

According to RL on TV, BBC will be showing a match every week from this weekend until and including the play off semi finals.

Maybe it's our fault for having loads of stadiums with thousands of empty seats rather than the BBC's fault for broadcasting the sport?

Thought we tried hard. Wigan took their chances and we didn't make anything of those we had. The reality is that without your first choice full back, stand off, scrum half, hooker, loose forward, both centres, a prop forward and your best second row leaving the field after 10 minutes, you won't beat a side like Wigan. We weren't helped by poor selection of Bell at hooker, which Wellens quickly realised and corrected. Hull KR next week will be tough too! The aim for us now is just to get players back before the play offs and give it a go, with nothing to lose! That place isn't secure yet but I'm not worried about that, I think we've got the couple more wins needed to get there.

Referees and players alike make mistakes, often quite minor. But, there are occasions where referees and players make huge blunders. This refereeing error is the equivalent of slipping over the dead ball line instead of putting down the ball to score a match-winning try. It's a shocker. We can't replay the game, that would be absurd. Where would you draw the line? How bad does a mistake have to be justify a replay? The only thing that we can do is reinforce the rules and avoid it happening again. As unsatisfactory as that is going to be for Barrow.

Earlier this year, the BBC said they were showing Saints v Hull KR on Saturday 24th August and Leigh v Warrington on Saturday 31st August. But on the BBC, Sky all all team websites, those fixtures are listed as being on Friday night, so not too sure what is happening!

Being a Saints fan, it's obvious where my focus is going to lie but even with that you cannot post about that game without acknowledging that Leigh were outstanding. We were blown to pieces and our usually solid defence turned to headless chickens. The positives tonight were Harry Robertson and Tommy Makinson. I think we are putting far too much pressure on Robertson to play in a pivotal position, with injured players in our biggest matches of the season. He has made a couple of mistakes but should face no criticism for that because he has done so well since he came into the team. You could forgive Makinson for having one eye on next year but he ran his blood to water. As for the performance as a whole. Errors galore, terrible discipline, woeful tackling and baffling selections once again from Wellens. When you get in a hole, it's hard to know how to get out. A loss to Hull next week and panic will really set in, if it hasn't already. But, as a fanbase, we have experienced more good times since 2019 than many established clubs have had since 1895. And whilst that shouldn't be used to excuse our worst run of form since the mid 1980's, it shouldn't be forgotten either. It's a relatively tough time for us but we'll be alright. Probably not this season mind.

I'm not sure of the benefit of the referee having an option of saying unsure. If they weren't unsure, they wouldn't be going to the video ref in the first place?

Yes, I agree. And that is reflected by how crowd figures always dip at this time of year, maybe it's something to do with the summer holidays (by comparison, they are at their best in February or March). That's why I think moving the Challenge Cup earlier is a good move because it capitalises on early season enthusiasm of fans. On the point earlier in the thread, there is a big incentive to finish top 2. Since this play off system was introduced, the Grand Final has been the top two in three of the four seasons. But it is hard to convert that into a real feeling of excitement when top spot and the teams competing in the play offs feel settled and we have no relegation. It just feels like we are waiting for October now before another meaningful match.