Broken Time Payment Question

[RP London]

32 minutes ago, OriginalMrC said:

They certainly do gloss over it. This is what it says on their website:

'Early in the century, the Butts was lost when the professional Northern Union game took a brief hold in the city. By the end of World War I, the Butts had been taken over by a local firm and a temporary home was found at the Coventry and North Warwickshire Cricket Ground in Binley Road. '

 

yeah thats the sort of thing I remembered reading.. Absolutely ridiculous, plenty of sports clubs played other sports and they have it in their history becuase it is their, you know, history... 

[Hopie]

Paying players being forbidden was a rule that was enforced in some circumstances but not others. I recall reading in Mike Rylance's book The Forbidden Game, that the French team were kicked out of the the Five Nations in the 1930s for paying players but were later let back in, probably not because they stopped paying, but because Rugby League was taking over in terms of popularity when French Rugby Union was without high quality internationals (might be a lesson there).

Edited April 16 by Hopie

[Griff]

24 minutes ago, Hopie said:

Playing players being forbidden was a rule that was enforced in some circumstances but not others. I recall reading in Mike Rylance's book The Forbidden Game, that the French team were kicked out of the the Five Nations in the 1930s for paying players but were later let back in, probably not because they stopped paying, but because Rugby League was taking over in terms of popularity when French Rugby Union was without high quality internationals (might be a lesson there).

Arthur Gould.   Received a house in 1900 (or thereabouts).   Overlooked by the RFU as they reckoned if Wales turned to NU, the floodgates would open down in the West of England.

[RP London]

13 hours ago, Hopie said:

Paying players being forbidden was a rule that was enforced in some circumstances but not others. I recall reading in Mike Rylance's book The Forbidden Game, that the French team were kicked out of the the Five Nations in the 1930s for paying players but were later let back in, probably not because they stopped paying, but because Rugby League was taking over in terms of popularity when French Rugby Union was without high quality internationals (might be a lesson there).

While there was quite a bit around paying it was a general "not playing to the spirit of the game" issue as they were quite violent and aggressive too. 

But yes the readmittance was definitely due to the threat of league.. same reasoning for not dealing with the professionalism in Welsh rugby but they knew the threat posed by league in Wales, the threat in France was relatively surprising.

Edited April 17 by RP London

[SouthBedfordshireFan]

On 16/04/2024 at 07:48, JohnM said:

Ask or read Tony Collins, who I believe is now emeritus professor of history at De Montfort University.

I have intentions of reading his works. I have started on his podcast though which has been quite riveting. 

I did email him regarding social class a few months back. 

[SouthBedfordshireFan]

On 15/04/2024 at 23:52, burnleywelsh said:

Fascinating article from Tony Collins about Leicester Tigers. From page 33. Follow the links.

https://tony-collins.squarespace.com/rugbyreloaded/2021/5/24/rugby-reloaded-167-how-leicester-tigers-saved-english-rugby-union

Thank you. It was an excellent read.

[SouthBedfordshireFan]

On 16/04/2024 at 09:14, Wiltshire Warrior Dragon said:

Accusations of making broken time payments may have been primarily made against northern RFU members, but not exclusively so.  As I recall, other rugby clubs that faced investigation - albeit they were cleared in each instance - included Leicester, Gloucester and, perhaps from today's perspective a little implausibly, Torquay and Weston-super-Mare.

Two reasons for the predominance of such accusations in the industrial north were probably the zealousness of the Yorkshire RFU, and especially the Revd Frank Marshall, one of its leading figures, and the fact that many of the accusations were almost certainly true!

If, like me, you find this element of social history very interesting, South Beds Fan, you should work your way through the many excellent books by Prof Tony Collins, of which, in this particular context, Rugby's great split is the most relevant.

I have his books on my reading list. Just need to collate it my reading list in full so I can send off to my librarian friend.

[DI Keith Fowler]

1 hour ago, SouthBedfordshireFan said:

I have his books on my reading list. Just need to collate it my reading list in full so I can send off to my librarian friend.

Well aren't you Mr La-de-dah with your books and your friends and your friends who deal in books. 

[DI Keith Fowler]

1 hour ago, SouthBedfordshireFan said:

I have intentions of reading his works. I have started on his podcast though which has been quite riveting. 

I did email him regarding social class a few months back. 

Oh did he get back you you? I've darkened his inbox a few times he's been very good for getting back typically. 

Edited April 23 by DI Keith Fowler

[SouthBedfordshireFan]

1 minute ago, DI Keith Fowler said:

Oh did he get back you you? I've darkened his inbox a few times he's been very good for getting back typically. 

Not yet. 

[fieldofclothofgold]

I wonder if " rugby" had gone down the road of broken time payments leading to professionalism would it be competing with association football as the most popular sport ? The class system in 19th century Britain wouldn't have allowed that I dont think .the ruling classes didn't want working men on their level especially on the sporting field . Take Cricket " Gentlemen and Players "