NRL Laying Groundwork For NZ Expansion With New SKY NZ Broadcast Deal.

[The Rocket]

1 hour ago, kiwis 13 6 said:

Personally i believe that before NZ get a second NRL side, NZ needs a Semi pro National Competition, to create pathways to the NRL from within NZ and reestablish Semi professional Rugby League outside of the Auckland Region. 

Great to get a Kiwi perspective, and the word is that there has been a substantial increase in funding for football programmes outside of the Warriors NRL grant, hence the u20`s and proposed u18`s comp`s.

But the constant call from NZRL is that they want there own source of funding. I gather the split deal with SKY NZ, one with NRL, one with NZRL, is the beginning of that.

You`re a Kiwi mate, so you probably have a better handle on this than me, but I see League in NZ being in a similar situation to union in Oz. League will not threaten union in your country but there will be room for two possibly three(I say three with uncertainty), NRL sides over the next 10-20 years. There is a soft spot for League in your country, Christ I`ve heard All-Blacks saying they all watch it, that would make me think your country could accommodate more teams, recognising of course that union is the biggest show in town.

I suppose the issue in saying that is that it costs about $30m to run an NRL club, even if the NRL grant covered $13m or so, how do you raise the other $17-20m in a market of 5.5m people, that is already the home of 5 large professional union franchises and an existing NRL team. Were almost back to the situation of Sydney, numerous professional teams in a crowded market.

 I suppose one advantage that another Kiwi franchise would have is that most of their games would be played in front of the the much larger Oz market. But I`m not sure whether that would help with the multitude of small and medium local sponsors that get a club up to the necessary amounts to fund an NRL team. This will be the challenge facing the NRL in getting other teams into NZ. I have to admit I`m always wary of rich owners, they can disappear. I prefer consortiums of business people.

I do think that the viewing figures show that there is potential, and if it rates, it will attract sponsors, even possibly at unions expense, up to a point.

 

 

 

[unapologetic pedant]

3 hours ago, Pulga said:

Get Kayo. I pay $5 a month being a Telstra customer.

 

Terms and conditions apply.

[unapologetic pedant]

1 hour ago, kiwis 13 6 said:

 Personally i believe that before NZ get a second NRL side, NZ needs a Semi pro National Competition, to create pathways to the NRL from within NZ and reestablish Semi professional Rugby League outside of the Auckland Region. 

The history of attempts to establish semi-pro RL nationally in NZ isn`t encouraging, but I agree with you that whatever the difficulties it should still be a priority.

Probably wouldn`t get much crowd support, but a small competition, about the same size as this year`s National 20s, could be viable if funded through TV and sponsorship.

In relation to where the teams would be based, Tauranga is now the fifth most populous city in NZ and rapidly growing, bigger than Dunedin. 

[The Rocket]

21 hours ago, Cumbrian Mackem said:

Very encouraging. Would be interesting to know the geographical spread of these viewers i.e. Auckland, Wellington, Christchurch and Hamilton etc.

That`s a very good point, because the potential to increase the value of the broadcast deal if another team was brought in would of course be increased if Sky knew it was going to get a significant bump in subscriptions from the new team.

Statistics on current viewer distribution, especially if it correlates with the Warriors catchment, may indicate that a new team may be able to replicate that in their market.

You would think however if viewing was more or less distributed evenly over NZ, the potential for a new team to increase subscriptions would be less likely. Interesting.

[The Rocket]

2 hours ago, kiwis 13 6 said:

Personally i believe that before NZ get a second NRL side, NZ needs a Semi pro National Competition, to create pathways to the NRL from within NZ and reestablish Semi professional Rugby League outside of the Auckland Region. 

 

30 minutes ago, unapologetic pedant said:

The history of attempts to establish semi-pro RL nationally in NZ isn`t encouraging, but I agree with you that whatever the difficulties it should still be a priority.

 

I agree it`s a great idea but not essential. I don`t see the point in waiting. 

The history of League is one of missed opportunities, given those TV figures you both quoted we should have been running two teams out of NZ for twenty years, just like Perth.

I think the competitions you both mentioned could be developed in conjunction with a new team. And let`s face it, if the moneys there, there`s no shortage of junior union talent that could be brought over.

[kiwis 13 6]

25 minutes ago, unapologetic pedant said:

The history of attempts to establish semi-pro RL nationally in NZ isn`t encouraging, but I agree with you that whatever the difficulties it should still be a priority.

Probably wouldn`t get much crowd support, but a small competition, about the same size as this year`s National 20s, could be viable if funded through TV and sponsorship.

I Agree, Lion red cup in the 1990's and Bartercard cup in 2000's cup both folding are not encouraging. If we learn from mistakes of the past I think a modest semi professional 8 team competition can be done. 

[Cumbrian Mackem]

Wasn’t there supposed to be a Auckland and surrounding areas based semi-professional league setup using money from the sale or rent of carlaw park?

[kiwis 13 6]

On 25/06/2021 at 00:24, Cumbrian Mackem said:

Wasn’t there supposed to be a Auckland and surrounding areas based semi-professional league setup using money from the sale or rent of carlaw park?

When Carlaw Park Heritage Trust owned the NZ Warriors, it was proposed that they were going to fund Aucklands Fox Memorial competition to make it a semi professional. But a year later the Trust sold the Warriors making a $2.5 million dollar loss on the original price they paid to purchase the NZ Warriors.

[Sports Prophet]

I have long believed that while we should not ignore international RL, the sport’s strength is club footy. While comments that Union will always be the big dog in NZ, I expect the Warriors to swiftly resume their position as the biggest sports club in NZ upon their return to home fixtures.

As such, I always thought, and still think that RL can best make gains in NZ through extra presence in the NRL. Whilst the All Blacks are a behemoth, the pacific (including NZ) is ripe for the picking as a RL dominated region. Especially after an exceptionally underwhelming “Super” Rugby season.

[Spidey]

19 minutes ago, Sports Prophet said:

I have long believed that while we should not ignore international RL, the sport’s strength is club footy. While comments that Union will always be the big dog in NZ, I expect the Warriors to swiftly resume their position as the biggest sports club in NZ upon their return to home fixtures.

As such, I always thought, and still think that RL can best make gains in NZ through extra presence in the NRL. Whilst the All Blacks are a behemoth, the pacific (including NZ) is ripe for the picking as a RL dominated region. Especially after an exceptionally underwhelming “Super” Rugby season.

Gladly you’re not a decision maker

[Sports Prophet]

24 minutes ago, Spidey said:

Gladly you’re not a decision maker

Indeed. The mere suggestion of expansion sends shivers through Rugby League relics Spidey and whilst I do dream of a better RL world, I pray, Heaven forbid my dreams ever be realised at the expense of those that feel the status quo for RL can prosper for centuries more.

[RayCee]

If a semi-pro comp was to be established in NZ, it would have to be accepted as a loss maker as the public interest in attending is minimal. A second RL team in NZ would be a better way forward IMO. The pathway to the NRL is already there. It's called schoolboy RL. That's where the scouts go. The NRL clubs take them young and put them through their systems.

[Cumbrian Mackem]

32 minutes ago, RayCee said:

If a semi-pro comp was to be established in NZ, it would have to be accepted as a loss maker as the public interest in attending is minimal. A second RL team in NZ would be a better way forward IMO. The pathway to the NRL is already there. It's called schoolboy RL. That's where the scouts go. The NRL clubs take them young and put them through their systems.

It’s also called schoolboy RU. 
 

RL in NZ could be headed towards a golden age if only the NRL and NZRL actually grew a pair and backed the sport and believed in the product a little more.

[kiwis 13 6]

There seems to be a perception overseas that most NZ Rugby League players come from NZ Schoolboy Rugby Union. The only recent players to play NRL from NZ Schoolboy rugby union scene are Konrad Hurrell. Solomone Kata & Suliasi Vunivalu all of who came to NZ from Pacific Islands on Rugby Union Scholarships at wealthy schools and then signed to NRL clubs. Rocco Berry from St Patrick Silverstream college in Wellington, made his NRL debut this year for the NZ Warriors after only playing a handful of games of Rugby League. Almost every other current player signed from NZ played Rugby League in NZ before being signed to to an NRL contract. They may also played rugby union as well as Touch Rugby but believe it or not there are people in NZ who play rugby league and have never played a game of rugby union in there lives.

 

  

[Cumbrian Mackem]

7 minutes ago, kiwis 13 6 said:

There seems to be a perception overseas that most NZ Rugby League players come from NZ Schoolboy Rugby Union is not true. The only recent players to play NRL who came directly from NZ Schoolboy rugby union scene are Konrad Hurrell. Solomone Kata & Suliasi Vunivalu all of who came to NZ from Pacific Islands on Rugby Union Scholarships at wealthy schools and then signed to NRL clubs. Rocco Berry was signed from St Patrick Silverstream college in Wellington, he never played Rugby League before and made his NRL debut this year for the NZ Warriors after only playing a handful of games of Rugby League. Almost every other current player signed from NZ played Rugby League in NZ before being signed to to an NRL contract. They may also played rugby union as well as Touch Rugby but believe it or not there are people in NZ who play rugby league and have never played a game of rugby union in there lives.

 

  

Nothing wrong with mixing it up to get the best talent available l

[kiwis 13 6]

3 hours ago, RayCee said:

If a semi-pro comp was to be established in NZ, it would have to be accepted as a loss maker as the public interest in attending is minimal. A second RL team in NZ would be a better way forward IMO. The pathway to the NRL is already there. It's called schoolboy RL. That's where the scouts go. The NRL clubs take them young and put them through their systems.

Yeah no doubt financially setting up a semi pro NZ competition is a tough one. NZ Basketball, Netball and Cricket all have long running National Semi pro competitions. NZ soccer competition has changed shape and gone in hiatus at times but they still run a semi pro national competition.

[Cumbrian Mackem]

1 hour ago, kiwis 13 6 said:

Yeah no doubt financially setting up a semi pro NZ competition is a tough one. NZ Basketball, Netball and Cricket all have long running National Semi pro competitions. NZ soccer competition has changed shape and gone in hiatus at times but they still run a semi pro national competition.

Waste of time and money in my opinion.

now a National u16’s&u18’s competition is better value for money and more productive.

[kiwis 13 6]

5 minutes ago, Cumbrian Mackem said:

Waste of time and money in my opinion.

now a National u16’s&u18’s competition is better value for money and more productive.

Any nationwide under 18 comp or Semi pro comp are both only hypothetical ideas. There's is currently no offer to fund either idea on the table from any party. So i am not sure what money you are talking about wasting...unless your involved in funding NZ Rugby League? Do you even live in New Zealand?

My personal opinion is that an NZ semi pro comp could happen and be formed from the existing top Fox memorial clubs, Auckland Warriors under 20's side, and Regional side Based in Wellington, Canterbury and Waikato.

[Cumbrian Mackem]

1 minute ago, kiwis 13 6 said:

Any nationwide under 18 comp or Semi pro comp are both only hypothetical ideas. There's is currently no offer to fund either idea on the table from any party. So i am not sure what money you are talking about wasting...unless your involved in funding NZ Rugby League? Do you even live in New Zealand?

My personal opinion is that an NZ semi pro comp could happen and be formed from the existing top Fox memorial clubs, Auckland Warriors under 20's side, and Regional side Based in Wellington, Canterbury and Waikato.

I’m basing my opinions hypothetically like everyone else.

im not in NZ and I don’t have anything to do with the NZRL(their loss).

[Pulga]

$160m is the new NZ NRL deal. 70% increase. Amazing really.

https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sport/nrl/opinion/phil-rothfield/saint-sinner-shoosh-phil-gould-v-peter-fitzsimons-feud-rears-its-ugly-head/news-story/c1d2e296642039f0fc89782a7da0cac9

[Cumbrian Mackem]

44 minutes ago, Pulga said:

$160m is the new NZ NRL deal. 70% increase. Amazing really.

https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sport/nrl/opinion/phil-rothfield/saint-sinner-shoosh-phil-gould-v-peter-fitzsimons-feud-rears-its-ugly-head/news-story/c1d2e296642039f0fc89782a7da0cac9

Amazing indeed. About time that the NRL give NZRL some more support by way of taking more NRL games to NZ and internationals in the short-term and in the long -term awarding NZ with another NRL franchise by the end of the decade.

[The Rocket]

1 hour ago, Pulga said:

$160m is the new NZ NRL deal. 70% increase. Amazing really.

https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sport/nrl/opinion/phil-rothfield/saint-sinner-shoosh-phil-gould-v-peter-fitzsimons-feud-rears-its-ugly-head/news-story/c1d2e296642039f0fc89782a7da0cac9

Fantastic news and very exciting. Hopefully might flush a few bidders out for the 18th franchise if they see how serious Sky, NZRL and the NRL are about growing the game in NZ.

I couldn`t open the article but the Gould v fitzsmmns fued is intriguing, love to see a few barbs being exchanged. I`d back Gould every day of the week, his hide is as impenetrable as his ego is big, he could really get under ftzsmmns skin, especially since the latter is really running scared of the League. This TV deal ain`t going to help.

[Cumbrian Mackem]

1 minute ago, The Rocket said:

Fantastic news and very exciting. Hopefully might flush a few bidders out for the 18th franchise if they see how serious Sky, NZRL and the NRL are about growing the game in NZ.

I couldn`t open the article but the Gould v fitzsmmns fued is intriguing, love to see a few barbs being exchanged. I`d back Gould every day of the week, his hide is as impenetrable as his ego is big, he could really get under ftzsmmns skin, especially since the latter is really running scared of the League. This TV deal ain`t going to help.

There’s never been a better time for the NRL&NZRL to exploit the state of flux that the NZRU domestic scene is currently facing.

[The Rocket]

2 minutes ago, Cumbrian Mackem said:

There’s never been a better time for the NRL&NZRL to exploit the state of flux that the NZRU domestic scene is currently facing.

There was an article in the paper today saying that the two rugby competitions are likely to remain initially separate next year due to the Australians fears of a repetition of the drubbings they got at the hands of the Kiwi sides. i.e. it didn`t rate.

Apparently the Kiwis want the comp to be united from the off, due to the fact that crowds and interest had really started to trail off in their domestic comp this year by the time teams came round to playing each other for the umpteenth time. i.e. it didn`t rate either.

 You`re dead right they`ve got real problems, sort of like being stuck between a rock and a hard place.

Great news about the Broadcast deal amount though, $32 million a year, that will put a real spring in the step of the NRL with their expansion plans, both domestically and NZ, and be a nice boost for our domestic FTA negotiations as well.

[Cumbrian Mackem]

8 minutes ago, The Rocket said:

There was an article in the paper today saying that the two rugby competitions are likely to remain initially separate next year due to the Australians fears of a repetition of the drubbings they got at the hands of the Kiwi sides. i.e. it didn`t rate.

Apparently the Kiwis want the comp to be united from the off, due to the fact that crowds and interest had really started to trail off in their domestic comp this year by the time teams came round to playing each other for the umpteenth time. i.e. it didn`t rate either.

 You`re dead right they`ve got real problems, sort of like being stuck between a rock and a hard place.

Great news about the Broadcast deal amount though, $32 million a year, that will put a real spring in the step of the NRL with their expansion plans, both domestically and NZ, and be a nice boost for our domestic FTA negotiations as well.

I’ve said it before and I’ll keep saying it until I’m blue in the face but the decision to boot the South African sides from the super rugby competition was a gigantic strategic blunder which has only been exacerbated by the demise of rugby union in Australia.

Its the perfect storm scenario for RL in NZ to exploit and make headway on the domestic front thanks to the strength of RL in Australia with the NRL being such a strong and powerful competition both financially and popularity.