GAA

[OnStrike]

Any other followers of the GAA sports on here. Championship in full swing now. Some good games this weekend.

Edited April 23, 2023 by OnStrike

[Futtocks]

2 minutes ago, OnStrike said:

Any other followers of the GAA sports on here. Championship in full swing now. Some good games this weekend.

Never got into it. In my part of North London, I sometimes see lads at the bus-stop in sports gear with Hurling sticks, but I don't know where they play locally (most likely somewhere in Kilburn/Cricklewood).

I know the BBC have live-streamed some matches in the past - it that still the case?

[OnStrike]

4 minutes ago, Futtocks said:

Never got into it. In my part of North London, I sometimes see lads at the bus-stop in sports gear with Hurling sticks, but I don't know where they play locally (most likely somewhere in Kilburn/Cricklewood).

I know the BBC have live-streamed some matches in the past - it that still the case?

Yeah BBC show the Ulster Championship games in the Gaelic Football. Each of the four provinces has a Championship that feeds into an All Ireland.

Yeah good few hurling and football clubs sprinkled throughout North West London. All over London to be fair, but mainly North and West.

[Griff]

Been watching it since goalkeepers wore the same colour shirts as everyone else.

[Griff]

Not sure what's amusing you there, OnStrike lad.

[OnStrike]

7 hours ago, Griff said:

Not sure what's amusing you there, OnStrike lad.

It amused me that that used to happen...bit before my time mind

[Griff]

You'll be laughing your head off at rugby league, union, NFL, CFL and AFL, then.

You only need to identify the goalkeeper if he can do something that the other players can't. In this case, pick the ball.

[OnStrike]

46 minutes ago, Griff said:

You'll be laughing your head off at rugby league, union, NFL, CFL and AFL, then.

You only need to identify the goalkeeper if he can do something that the other players can't. In this case, pick the ball.

Ok, so you've been following the GAA since the 70s and are a bit salty because since then, the goalkeeper is easily identifiable. Got it. 

[Griff]

36 minutes ago, OnStrike said:

Ok, so you've been following the GAA since the 70s and are a bit salty because since then, the goalkeeper is easily identifiable. Got it. 

I give up.

[OnStrike]

9 hours ago, Griff said:

I give up.

Yeah probably best. If there was a joke there I've obviously missed it, if not you're just coming across pointlessly antagonistic. Good luck

[Griff]

54 minutes ago, OnStrike said:

Yeah probably best. If there was a joke there I've obviously missed it, if not you're just coming across pointlessly antagonistic. Good luck

There was no joke. I started by implying that I'd been watching GAA for a long time. I went on to explain that goalkeepers only need to be distinguished in certain circumstances. I would have enjoyed a discussion of prospects for the 2023 championships but now I'll give it a miss.

I'd suggest you try a more targeted forum, such as Hogan Stand.

[graveyard johnny]

last time i looked for some gae-lic action online i must have got the spelling wrong- not what i was expecting to see

[Futtocks]

47 minutes ago, graveyard johnny said:

last time i looked for some gae-lic action online i must have got the spelling wrong- not what i was expecting to see

No wonder you were disappointed!

 

[Wiltshire Warrior Dragon]

On 23/04/2023 at 18:26, OnStrike said:

Any other followers of the GAA sports on here. Championship in full swing now. Some good games this weekend.

I would like to be, but I think the only way to watch it nowadays in the UK is via GAAGO, unless you can get BBC NI TV, in which case you might be able to see some championship action, but mostly football (whereas I refer hurling)

Do you use GAAGO, OnStrike?  If so, what is it like nowadays?  I have seen some really diabolical reviews of its quality and reliability.  Therefore, for now, I am going without my GAA 'fix'!

[OnStrike]

7 hours ago, Wiltshire Warrior Dragon said:

I would like to be, but I think the only way to watch it nowadays in the UK is via GAAGO, unless you can get BBC NI TV, in which case you might be able to see some championship action, but mostly football (whereas I refer hurling)

Do you use GAAGO, OnStrike?  If so, what is it like nowadays?  I have seen some really diabolical reviews of its quality and reliability.  Therefore, for now, I am going without my GAA 'fix'!

I do use GAAGO and have no problem with it to be honest. You get loads of games and the quality is good, for the big games you're just watching the RTE or TG4 coverage that they put onto GAAGO.

For some of the smaller league games that wouldn't be on RTE, there might be just two cameras or something but for  any big game game of hurling, you can't go wrong. This weekend I think there is two games from the Munster Hurling Championship and two from the Leinster.

As I'm not in London anymore, finding a pub that shows the hurling (or even knows what it is!) isn't always easy so GAAGO the best money I spend TV wise to be honest.

Yeah BBC only show Ulster Championship Football (their coverage is decent to be fair and tou can get it on the iPlayer) although I think I may have read somewhere they will be showing a bit more from this year.

[EggFace]

I often wonder why GAA Football and Hurling play the same season and thought it be better if Football was played in Autumn, Winter early Spring and Hurling like the Cricket season.

[OnStrike]

6 hours ago, EggFace said:

I often wonder why GAA Football and Hurling play the same season and thought it be better if Football was played in Autumn, Winter early Spring and Hurling like the Cricket season.

Yeah would seem to make sense wouldn't it. I assume it's summer because it just always has been! I suppose in the early years the pitches in rural Ireland would have been unplayable in winter. Even now, trying to bounce the ball on a sodden pitch doesn't really work. Probably a big part of it now is there is no premier league in the summer so it gives the GAA that window to dominate the sporting landscape in Ireland from May-August

[EggFace]

On 07/05/2023 at 19:36, OnStrike said:

Yeah would seem to make sense wouldn't it. I assume it's summer because it just always has been! I suppose in the early years the pitches in rural Ireland would have been unplayable in winter. Even now, trying to bounce the ball on a sodden pitch doesn't really work. Probably a big part of it now is there is no premier league in the summer so it gives the GAA that window to dominate the sporting landscape in Ireland from May-August

Saying that doesn't GAA play a long season like starting February.

[Wiltshire Warrior Dragon]

On 07/05/2023 at 13:12, EggFace said:

I often wonder why GAA Football and Hurling play the same season and thought it be better if Football was played in Autumn, Winter early Spring and Hurling like the Cricket season.

 

On 07/05/2023 at 19:36, OnStrike said:

Yeah would seem to make sense wouldn't it. I assume it's summer because it just always has been! I suppose in the early years the pitches in rural Ireland would have been unplayable in winter. Even now, trying to bounce the ball on a sodden pitch doesn't really work. Probably a big part of it now is there is no premier league in the summer so it gives the GAA that window to dominate the sporting landscape in Ireland from May-August

It is an interesting suggestion that you make, EggFace, but let me suggest some reasons why i don't think it would work.

Although both football and hurling are played in all counties, the spread is uneven.  A minority of the historical 32 counties in the island of Ireland are traditionally strong at hurling; that minority includes Kilkenny and Wexford in Leinster and Clare, Limerick, Tipperaray and Waterford in Munster.  So hurling, as the predominant code, is very much in the southernmost third of the island.  There are exceptions of course; Galway, in Connacht, has a good hurling tradition in parts of the county and in Antrim (which is in Ulster), the rural glens are historically a hurling stronghold.

Football has a more widespread level of high profile interest, although, perhaps unsurprisingly, the strong hurling counties in the south rarely achieve much on the football field. 

Kerry, one of Munster's six counties, is intriguing; it is a football stronghold, which has achieved success at All-Ireland level frequently over the decades, but, almost uiniquely for Munster, has no particularly strong tradition in hurling.  Indeed, as far as I know, there is just one county which, with any regularity and justification, hopes for success on both the football and hurling fields; that is Kerry's neighbour, Cork, also in Munster.

So, in large parts of the country, there is a strong degree of interest really in just one of the two codes.

Second, both sports have a fairly similar competition structure.  In the GAA sporting psyche, the importance of the leading knock-out form of competition has remained paramount (like shinty in Scotland, but - apparently - unlike English soccer and rugby league); by that I mean, in GAA, provincial championships leading to a tilt at the All-Ireland title.  At a practical level, this has at least two flaws.  First, the provinces are of uneven size; Leinster has 12 counties, Ulster 9, Munster 6 and Connacht just 5.  So, it's far easier to be Connacht football champions than it is to win the equivalent crown in Leinster.  Second, how do you prepare counties for provincial championship competition?

The solution to these dilemmas has been twofold.  First - and many decades ago - it was decided to run a National League in each sport.  You are right, EggFace, as far as I know that starts pretty early in the year - around February, as you suggest.  I don't think anybody seriously believes the league has the same status as the All-Ireland Championship.  In some ways, it gives a chance for selectors to experiment with tactics and team selections in advance of the championships, but to do so in matches that have at least some competitive status.  Second - in an attempt to stop some teams having just one championship game, some provincial championships no longer have a simple knock-out structure.  That is certainly true of the Munster hulrling championship and possibly others (my more recent and current knowledge of GAA is a little bit sketchy!)

So, you simply couldn't fit hurling into a summer-only time slot a la cricket.

All the above needs to be seen in another context.  All the sides I mention above are not clubs; they are county select teams.  Yet the vast majoirity of activity, week-in-week-out, in GAA is, of course, concentrated on clubs.  So you have to allow time for club competitions.

I am not certain, but I think the GAA has probably coped quite well with this tension in recent years, by allocating periods in the year when clubs can field their strongest sides (ie there is no competition for players due to county selection) and times when they cannot.  That way, club players get regular games in competitions within their county even when their most talented team-mates are unavailable due to county team commitments.

There has been another trend in club competition over the last half-century.  At one time, if your club won the county title, that was that for the season, but not any more.  Nowadays, there are provincial club championships leading to an All-Ireland club series, which culminates in a hurling and football double-header at Croke Park, Dublin, on St Patrick's Day.

Interestingly, when I first developed an interest in GAA in the 1960s, the St Patrick's Day games in Croke Park were the inter-provincial finals, for the Railway Cup titles - automatically Munster v Leinster at hurling, with a pre-March 17th play off to decide who contested the football final.  However, enthusiasm for this higher level of representational game seemed to wane, and the club series filled the potential void.

To be honest, OnStrike, I don't think the Premier League has much to do with it.  Late spring and summer have always seen the GAA provincial and then All-Ireland championships hit the headlines, as the tension and interest mounts.  Traditionally, the All-Ireland Minor and Senior hurling finals took place at Croke Park on the first Sunday in September, with their football equivalents on the fourth Sunday.  You are right to suggest that is how it has always been.

Sorry, I have gone on a bit, but I hope the above is of interest and helps to answer your suggestions.

[Irish Saint]

21 minutes ago, Wiltshire Warrior Dragon said:

 First, the provinces are of uneven size; Leinster has 12 counties, Ulster 9, Munster 6 and Connacht just 5.  So, it's far easier to be Connacht football champions than it is to win the equivalent crown in Leinster.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

Leinster championship a lot harder to win than Connacht really?

Leinster championship for many years has been by how many points do Dublin win.

[OnStrike]

What a great answer, enjoyed reading that.

The club and county seasons have been 'split' now to give certainty to club players as they used to be all over the place schedule wise to fit around the county season. This has resulted in a very condensed format (11 weeks from start of the hurling championship to the end) which is not popular with some.

I suppose I only mentioned the Premier League as the summer is a kind of window the GAA can often have to itself. A big complaint in moving the All Ireland finals into August (I think Limerick v Cork 2021 was July, I was at it) is that it gives up that time in the year the GAA can have to itself. When, as you say, the tension and build up should be mounting, the games are done and dusted too quickly.

You're right, the Munster Championship is now a group stage with a final. The provincial football championships are still knock out but the counties get another crack at the All Ireland series.

I hadn't realised St Patrick's Day was the old Railway Cup finals day, very interesting.

I'd add Galway to the very short list of counties that could win both. In fact Cork have fallen so far from grace football wise, I'd probably say Galway are only county where that could happen. And I'd add there is a very strong hurling tradition in a pocket of north Kerry, but it's far too small to allow them to compete in Munster. They're currently a decent second tier side playing the likes of Laois, Carlow and few others of that stature.

Spot on re the league, coaches give players a run out, experiment etc. Interestingly, there are growing calls to flip the whole thing on its head. Play the provincials in Feb and March and play the league as the main championship. As the gulf between the top tier counties and the rest grows, these calls will get louder I think. Dublin have won the Leinster Championship about 20 times in a row and Kerry stroll to the Munster championship nearly every year. They are becoming irrelevant. Only Ulster is still a highly sought after title (and of course Munster in the hurling).

Anyway enjoyed reading your post

[OnStrike]

2 minutes ago, Irish Saint said:

Leinster championship a lot harder to win than Connacht really?

Leinster championship for many years has been by how many points do Dublin win.

If Dublin weren't in it, it would be a great championship! Got a bit of life there didn't it in the early 2000s but it's finished now.

[OnStrike]

38 minutes ago, Wiltshire Warrior Dragon said:

 

It is an interesting suggestion that you make, EggFace, but let me suggest some reasons why i don't think it would work.

Although both football and hurling are played in all counties, the spread is uneven.  A minority of the historical 32 counties in the island of Ireland are traditionally strong at hurling; that minority includes Kilkenny and Wexford in Leinster and Clare, Limerick, Tipperaray and Waterford in Munster.  So hurling, as the predominant code, is very much in the southernmost third of the island.  There are exceptions of course; Galway, in Connacht, has a good hurling tradition in parts of the county and in Antrim (which is in Ulster), the rural glens are historically a hurling stronghold.

Football has a more widespread level of high profile interest, although, perhaps unsurprisingly, the strong hurling counties in the south rarely achieve much on the football field. 

Kerry, one of Munster's six counties, is intriguing; it is a football stronghold, which has achieved success at All-Ireland level frequently over the decades, but, almost uiniquely for Munster, has no particularly strong tradition in hurling.  Indeed, as far as I know, there is just one county which, with any regularity and justification, hopes for success on both the football and hurling fields; that is Kerry's neighbour, Cork, also in Munster.

So, in large parts of the country, there is a strong degree of interest really in just one of the two codes.

Second, both sports have a fairly similar competition structure.  In the GAA sporting psyche, the importance of the leading knock-out form of competition has remained paramount (like shinty in Scotland, but - apparently - unlike English soccer and rugby league); by that I mean, in GAA, provincial championships leading to a tilt at the All-Ireland title.  At a practical level, this has at least two flaws.  First, the provinces are of uneven size; Leinster has 12 counties, Ulster 9, Munster 6 and Connacht just 5.  So, it's far easier to be Connacht football champions than it is to win the equivalent crown in Leinster.  Second, how do you prepare counties for provincial championship competition?

The solution to these dilemmas has been twofold.  First - and many decades ago - it was decided to run a National League in each sport.  You are right, EggFace, as far as I know that starts pretty early in the year - around February, as you suggest.  I don't think anybody seriously believes the league has the same status as the All-Ireland Championship.  In some ways, it gives a chance for selectors to experiment with tactics and team selections in advance of the championships, but to do so in matches that have at least some competitive status.  Second - in an attempt to stop some teams having just one championship game, some provincial championships no longer have a simple knock-out structure.  That is certainly true of the Munster hulrling championship and possibly others (my more recent and current knowledge of GAA is a little bit sketchy!)

So, you simply couldn't fit hurling into a summer-only time slot a la cricket.

All the above needs to be seen in another context.  All the sides I mention above are not clubs; they are county select teams.  Yet the vast majoirity of activity, week-in-week-out, in GAA is, of course, concentrated on clubs.  So you have to allow time for club competitions.

I am not certain, but I think the GAA has probably coped quite well with this tension in recent years, by allocating periods in the year when clubs can field their strongest sides (ie there is no competition for players due to county selection) and times when they cannot.  That way, club players get regular games in competitions within their county even when their most talented team-mates are unavailable due to county team commitments.

There has been another trend in club competition over the last half-century.  At one time, if your club won the county title, that was that for the season, but not any more.  Nowadays, there are provincial club championships leading to an All-Ireland club series, which culminates in a hurling and football double-header at Croke Park, Dublin, on St Patrick's Day.

Interestingly, when I first developed an interest in GAA in the 1960s, the St Patrick's Day games in Croke Park were the inter-provincial finals, for the Railway Cup titles - automatically Munster v Leinster at hurling, with a pre-March 17th play off to decide who contested the football final.  However, enthusiasm for this higher level of representational game seemed to wane, and the club series filled the potential void.

To be honest, OnStrike, I don't think the Premier League has much to do with it.  Late spring and summer have always seen the GAA provincial and then All-Ireland championships hit the headlines, as the tension and interest mounts.  Traditionally, the All-Ireland Minor and Senior hurling finals took place at Croke Park on the first Sunday in September, with their football equivalents on the fourth Sunday.  You are right to suggest that is how it has always been.

Sorry, I have gone on a bit, but I hope the above is of interest and helps to answer your suggestions.

What a great answer, enjoyed reading that.

The club and county seasons have been 'split' now to give certainty to club players as they used to be all over the place schedule wise to fit around the county season. This has resulted in a very condensed format (11 weeks from start of the hurling championship to the end) which is not popular with some.

I suppose I only mentioned the Premier League as the summer is a kind of window the GAA can often have to itself. A big complaint in moving the All Ireland finals into August (I think Limerick v Cork 2021 was July, I was at it) is that it gives up that time in the year the GAA can have to itself. When, as you say, the tension and build up should be mounting, the games are done and dusted too quickly.

You're right, the Munster Championship is now a group stage with a final. The provincial football championships are still knock out but the counties get another crack at the All Ireland series.

I hadn't realised St Patrick's Day was the old Railway Cup finals day, very interesting.

I'd add Galway to the very short list of counties that could win both. In fact Cork have fallen so far from grace football wise, I'd probably say Galway are only county where that could happen. And I'd add there is a very strong hurling tradition in a pocket of north Kerry, but it's far too small to allow them to compete in Munster. They're currently a decent second tier side playing the likes of Laois, Carlow and few others of that stature.

Spot on re the league, coaches give players a run out, experiment etc. Interestingly, there are growing calls to flip the whole thing on its head. Play the provincials in Feb and March and play the league as the main championship. As the gulf between the top tier counties and the rest grows, these calls will get louder I think. Dublin have won the Leinster Championship about 20 times in a row and Kerry stroll to the Munster championship nearly every year. They are becoming irrelevant. Only Ulster is still a highly sought after title (and of course Munster in the hurling).

Anyway enjoyed reading your post

[EggFace]

11 hours ago, Wiltshire Warrior Dragon said:

 

It is an interesting suggestion that you make, EggFace, but let me suggest some reasons why i don't think it would work.

Although both football and hurling are played in all counties, the spread is uneven.  A minority of the historical 32 counties in the island of Ireland are traditionally strong at hurling; that minority includes Kilkenny and Wexford in Leinster and Clare, Limerick, Tipperaray and Waterford in Munster.  So hurling, as the predominant code, is very much in the southernmost third of the island.  There are exceptions of course; Galway, in Connacht, has a good hurling tradition in parts of the county and in Antrim (which is in Ulster), the rural glens are historically a hurling stronghold.

Football has a more widespread level of high profile interest, although, perhaps unsurprisingly, the strong hurling counties in the south rarely achieve much on the football field. 

Kerry, one of Munster's six counties, is intriguing; it is a football stronghold, which has achieved success at All-Ireland level frequently over the decades, but, almost uiniquely for Munster, has no particularly strong tradition in hurling.  Indeed, as far as I know, there is just one county which, with any regularity and justification, hopes for success on both the football and hurling fields; that is Kerry's neighbour, Cork, also in Munster.

So, in large parts of the country, there is a strong degree of interest really in just one of the two codes.

Second, both sports have a fairly similar competition structure.  In the GAA sporting psyche, the importance of the leading knock-out form of competition has remained paramount (like shinty in Scotland, but - apparently - unlike English soccer and rugby league); by that I mean, in GAA, provincial championships leading to a tilt at the All-Ireland title.  At a practical level, this has at least two flaws.  First, the provinces are of uneven size; Leinster has 12 counties, Ulster 9, Munster 6 and Connacht just 5.  So, it's far easier to be Connacht football champions than it is to win the equivalent crown in Leinster.  Second, how do you prepare counties for provincial championship competition?

The solution to these dilemmas has been twofold.  First - and many decades ago - it was decided to run a National League in each sport.  You are right, EggFace, as far as I know that starts pretty early in the year - around February, as you suggest.  I don't think anybody seriously believes the league has the same status as the All-Ireland Championship.  In some ways, it gives a chance for selectors to experiment with tactics and team selections in advance of the championships, but to do so in matches that have at least some competitive status.  Second - in an attempt to stop some teams having just one championship game, some provincial championships no longer have a simple knock-out structure.  That is certainly true of the Munster hulrling championship and possibly others (my more recent and current knowledge of GAA is a little bit sketchy!)

So, you simply couldn't fit hurling into a summer-only time slot a la cricket.

All the above needs to be seen in another context.  All the sides I mention above are not clubs; they are county select teams.  Yet the vast majoirity of activity, week-in-week-out, in GAA is, of course, concentrated on clubs.  So you have to allow time for club competitions.

I am not certain, but I think the GAA has probably coped quite well with this tension in recent years, by allocating periods in the year when clubs can field their strongest sides (ie there is no competition for players due to county selection) and times when they cannot.  That way, club players get regular games in competitions within their county even when their most talented team-mates are unavailable due to county team commitments.

There has been another trend in club competition over the last half-century.  At one time, if your club won the county title, that was that for the season, but not any more.  Nowadays, there are provincial club championships leading to an All-Ireland club series, which culminates in a hurling and football double-header at Croke Park, Dublin, on St Patrick's Day.

Interestingly, when I first developed an interest in GAA in the 1960s, the St Patrick's Day games in Croke Park were the inter-provincial finals, for the Railway Cup titles - automatically Munster v Leinster at hurling, with a pre-March 17th play off to decide who contested the football final.  However, enthusiasm for this higher level of representational game seemed to wane, and the club series filled the potential void.

To be honest, OnStrike, I don't think the Premier League has much to do with it.  Late spring and summer have always seen the GAA provincial and then All-Ireland championships hit the headlines, as the tension and interest mounts.  Traditionally, the All-Ireland Minor and Senior hurling finals took place at Croke Park on the first Sunday in September, with their football equivalents on the fourth Sunday.  You are right to suggest that is how it has always been.

Sorry, I have gone on a bit, but I hope the above is of interest and helps to answer your suggestions.

Damm good pots

I always get confused reading on the inter Pro/Club and County and wonder who gets the best support is it like the old days of Rugby Union/Cricket with club and county ?

[OnStrike]

Limerick brushed aside Kilkenny on Sunday to win their 4th All Ireland Hurling Championship in a row. Only Kilkenny (2006-2009) and Cork (during the 2nd World War) had previously won 4 Championships in a row. Winning one in 2018 means they have won an incredible 5 All Irelands in 6 years. This from a county that had previously only won a handful of Championships, their last coming in 1973. Along the way they have also won 5 Munster Championships in a row (2019-2023). It's a true sporting dynasty, the panel of players and backroom team being more or less the same since 2017. It's an incredible story

Edited July 25, 2023 by OnStrike