Premier Sports appear to have binned Pacific Tests - Gutted?

[Dave T]

As an example, look at the locations for the last few Fiji games:

 

Gold Coast

London

Warrington

Hull

St Helens

Rochdale

Port Moresby

Port Moresby

Sydney

Gold Coast

Gosford

Wollongong

Sydney

Sydney

Campbelltown

Leeds

Gateshead

Hull

 

and so on....

 

Does anybody notice anything strange about this list?

 

I could do a similar list for quite a few other nations.

[Farmduck]

Does anybody notice anything strange about this list?

 

 

They spend more time in Hull than any human should have to?

[Copa]

As an example, look at the locations for the last few Fiji games:

 

Gold Coast

London

Warrington

Hull

St Helens

Rochdale

Port Moresby

Port Moresby

Sydney

Gold Coast

Gosford

Wollongong

Sydney

Sydney

Campbelltown

Leeds

Gateshead

Hull

 

and so on....

 

Does anybody notice anything strange about this list?

 

I could do a similar list for quite a few other nations.

 

There's nothing strange at all about that list if you consider the finances and other resources available in Fiji and the costs of broadcasting live games from there at the standard required by international broadcasters.

 

Born and bred Fijians are all through rugby league in Australia..

[Dave T]

F

 

There's nothing strange at all about that list if you consider the finances and other resources available in Fiji and the costs of broadcasting live games from there at the standard required by international broadcasters.

 

Born and bred Fijians are all through rugby league in Australia..

Fiji have made the last 2 World Cup semi finals - we are papering over huge cracks with stuff like this.

[Copa]

F

 

Fiji have made the last 2 World Cup semi finals - we are papering over huge cracks with stuff like this.

 

We can now afford paper for the cracks.

 

Where is the money tree that can pay to heavily subsidise matches in Fiji?

 

How would you propose all the test matches in Fiji be paid for?

[Dave T]

We can now afford paper for the cracks.

 

Where is the money tree that can pay to heavily subsidise matches in Fiji?

 

How would you propose all the test matches in Fiji be paid for?

I'm on board with being sensible and understanding our limitations, but there wasn't a single game in Fiji. I assume the list would be the same for Tonga and Samoa - these are all top 10 teams in international RL, and they haven't played home games for years and years. 

 

We are happy to just keep picking teams from the NRL to play in Oz though and call that progress. It really isn't.

[Copa]

I'm on board with being sensible and understanding our limitations, but there wasn't a single game in Fiji. I assume the list would be the same for Tonga and Samoa - these are all top 10 teams in international RL, and they haven't played home games for years and years. 

 

We are happy to just keep picking teams from the NRL to play in Oz though and call that progress. It really isn't.

 

Teams this weekend are most likely picked from the QLD and NSW Cup, the NRL and Super League.  Probably a few players from strong suburban /regional comps in Australia also.  So players who are based across 4 different countries and multiple competitions.

 

It's bizarre to think that a player in a Samoan domestic team could be good enough to play for Samoa.  If he was good enough he'd be playing in Australia for money at suburban (I know of suburban teams offering over $20k for a good player) , state or the NRL level or playing somewhere in Europe. 

 

So, yes, I'm happy for the best team to be picked.

[Farmduck]

I'm on board with being sensible and understanding our limitations, but there wasn't a single game in Fiji. I assume the list would be the same for Tonga and Samoa - these are all top 10 teams in international RL, and they haven't played home games for years and years. 

 

We are happy to just keep picking teams from the NRL to play in Oz though and call that progress. It really isn't.

 

You are assuming that the cash and/or exposure generated in these island countries could be used to drive the growth of the game. I'm not that optimistic. We are not allowed to say this (too neo-colonialist, patronising, racist, whatever) but these are (apart from PNG) tiny tinpot banana republics - actually Tonga is a banana monarchy. Fiji for the last 15 years has been an apartheid state and a military dictatorship and, because of the diplomatic situation, no official AUS or NZ team could have gone there.

 

Jobs like running sporting organisations are handed out to the President's (or King's) family and any cash derived is spread among the same limited pool.

 

The combined population of Tonga and Samoa and Cook Islands is less than the City of Wakefield. Wakefield can't even produce a home-grown SL team and, in the Pacific, RU is the big sport, not RL. How many truly international-class players do you think there are in these countries? If there were any good prospects, the NRL machine would have recruited them already.

 

PNG is a separate case and Fiji is big enough to produce a stream of players but still, most weeks there are only 4 or 5 Fiji-born players in first grade.

 

Perhaps there are no internationals played in Tonga, Fiji and Samoa because the local officials couldn't be bothered or don't know how to organise them. Sadly, I think this is highly probable.

 

Perhaps the problem isn't that we are making no progress. Perhaps the problem is that we have already reached the peak in Tonga and Samoa.

[Dave T]

Teams this weekend are most likely picked from the QLD and NSW Cup, the NRL and Super League.  Probably a few players from strong suburban /regional comps in Australia also.  So players who are based across 4 different countries and multiple competitions.

 

It's bizarre to think that a player in a Samoan domestic team could be good enough to play for Samoa.  If he was good enough he'd be playing in Australia for money at suburban (I know of suburban teams offering over $20k for a good player) , state or the NRL level or playing somewhere in Europe. 

 

So, yes, I'm happy for the best team to be picked.

If you are happy with an artificial team trotting out for people in Australia then that is good for you. My issue is not with the team selected.

 

I am perfectly ok with heritage being used, but surely there has to be even the tiniest footprint in these nations? 

 

If I ask the question why are we staging these games what is the answer you would give? I think the answer is that we keep these nations alive on life support so that we can pretend we have an international game and stage a big world cup. 

[Farmduck]

If I ask the question why are we staging these games what is the answer you would give? I think the answer is that we keep these nations alive on life support so that we can pretend we have an international game and stage a big world cup. 

 

I agree with you so the logical next question is: does this serve any useful purpose?

 

My answer is Yes, as long as it doesn't divert resources from the countries doing the grass roots domestic work. Remember that most of this model is funded by NRL clubs, not the RLIF, so it's not biting into the available development funds.

 

OR, yes it's OK as long as we see this as a transitional model and ensure there are pathways for the nations with strong domestic growth to qualify for big tournaments and tours.

[Dave T]

You are assuming that the cash and/or exposure generated in these island countries could be used to drive the growth of the game. I'm not that optimistic. We are not allowed to say this (too neo-colonialist, patronising, racist, whatever) but these are (apart from PNG) tiny tinpot banana republics - actually Tonga is a banana monarchy. Fiji for the last 15 years has been an apartheid state and a military dictatorship and, because of the diplomatic situation, no official AUS or NZ team could have gone there.

 

Jobs like running sporting organisations are handed out to the President's (or King's) family and any cash derived is spread among the same limited pool.

 

The combined population of Tonga and Samoa and Cook Islands is less than the City of Wakefield. Wakefield can't even produce a home-grown SL team and, in the Pacific, RU is the big sport, not RL. How many truly international-class players do you think there are in these countries? If there were any good prospects, the NRL machine would have recruited them already.

 

PNG is a separate case and Fiji is big enough to produce a stream of players but still, most weeks there are only 4 or 5 Fiji-born players in first grade.

 

Perhaps there are no internationals played in Tonga, Fiji and Samoa because the local officials couldn't be bothered or don't know how to organise them. Sadly, I think this is highly probable.

 

Perhaps the problem isn't that we are making no progress. Perhaps the problem is that we have already reached the peak in Tonga and Samoa.

I don't disagree with much there, but I ask again, why are we bothering. Why don't we invest every penny in places where we can actually play games if all of the above is true?

 

I think we need to be asking ourselves some tough questions about what we are trying to achieve with a lot of what we are doing, because tbh, I see no progress whatsoever in 20 years with any of these nations.

 

They are a shirt, that never features in the country it represents.

[Dave T]

I agree with you so the logical next question is: does this serve any useful purpose?

 

My answer is Yes, as long as it doesn't divert resources from the countries doing the grass roots domestic work. Remember that most of this model is funded by NRL clubs, not the RLIF, so it's not biting into the available development funds.

 

OR, yes it's OK as long as we see this as a transitional model and ensure there are pathways for the nations with strong domestic growth to qualify for big tournaments and tours.

My main issue, is that by having a team that doesn't play at home or tour, but makes a big noise at every world cup, it is clouding the fact that the game needs to get more serious with some nations. Should we focus more on PNG and France, maybe the USA, Canada, South Africa - whatever - but as long as we have these teams that are not really active in the world of RL doing well in front of the public every four years it disguises the issues we have imho.

[JoneslessBishop]

That a little unfair Dave. Let's judge that after the Confed Cup. Via that the RLIF are now organizing a competition every two years, with Confed Cup having 8 nations as opposed to ARL/ RFL organizing 4 Nations. Qualifiers will be needed prior year, like qualifiers needed for World Cup. So more interntional RL for more nations than ever before to my mind, with intention to sell to broadcasters. If broadcasters/ domestic federations are also establishing mid season fixtures then great. This Prem Sports issue is a blow, but they were only engaging a very small part of the UK sporting public. BBC have been very engaged with with last years test series and the last and this coming 4 Nations (with Sky airing the latter also), and the World Cup has got a record TV deal in Oz next year. Doesn't seem to be a better time to be flogging the additional interntional RL content the RLIF are creating.

[Scubby]

My main issue, is that by having a team that doesn't play at home or tour, but makes a big noise at every world cup, it is clouding the fact that the game needs to get more serious with some nations. Should we focus more on PNG and France, maybe the USA, Canada, South Africa - whatever - but as long as we have these teams that are not really active in the world of RL doing well in front of the public every four years it disguises the issues we have imho.

 

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/league/75482079/Fiji-offered-two-games-at-2017-Rugby-League-World-Cup

 

Fiji are in the mix to have 2 games at the RLWC

[Dave T]

That a little unfair Dave. Let's judge that after the Confed Cup. Via that the RLIF are now organizing a competition every two years, with Confed Cup having 8 nations as opposed to ARL/ RFL organizing 4 Nations. Qualifiers will be needed prior year, like qualifiers needed for World Cup. So more interntional RL for more nations than ever before to my mind, with intention to sell to broadcasters. If broadcasters/ domestic federations are also establishing mid season fixtures then great. This Prem Sports issue is a blow, but they were only engaging a very small part of the UK sporting public. BBC have been very engaged with with last years test series and the last and this coming 4 Nations (with Sky airing the latter also), and the World Cup has got a record TV deal in Oz next year. Doesn't seem to be a better time to be flogging the additional interntional RL content the RLIF are creating.

i did think about the confed cup so that is a fair point, but as it is no more than a bullet point on a powerpoint at the moment i can only judge on what we have seen since Fiji played in front of 26k at Central Park in 1995.

[Dave T]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/league/75482079/Fiji-offered-two-games-at-2017-Rugby-League-World-Cup

Fiji are in the mix to have 2 games at the RLWC

things like this would absolutely start to restore my faith in internationsl rl if it comes off. It needs to be part of a future plan too though.

[JoneslessBishop]

You make some very valid historical points Dave but re Fiji, they are getting a World Cup game and a hopefully a NSW Cup team (any news on that anyone - final assessment took place a few weeks back).

Mid season tests sit naturally in Oz, like hopefully an Eng NZ will in Auckland due to NRL presence of players. I hope in the future their game scan be played in Fiji. Vodaphone seem a pretty good sponsor.

At the moment, better that game played than not at all, and NSW Cup time will create a real indigenous pathways. Better to focus on future positive signs that are only a year or so away than in previous short comings.

[Scubby]

things like this would absolutely start to restore my faith in internationsl rl if it comes off. It needs to be part of a future plan too though.

 

Thought that might suva your concerns a little 

[terrywebbisgod]

Thought that might suva your concerns a little

I've got your coat for you.

[Scubby]

I've got your coat for you.

 

Cheers! I'm here all week

[roughyedspud]

Isn't the NRL an Australian Club Competition?

The nrl started the pacific tests as part of the "nrl pacific stratergy"...

It is what it is i guess

[Farmduck]

This site says they have the Kumuls v Bati  http://www.stream2watch.co/live-now/sport/rugby/fiji-vs-papua-new-guinea-live-stream-may-07

[roughyedspud]

Dunno why premier sports would show the jnr roos v jnr kiwis..featuring players very few people would of heard of...but not show the pacific tests featuring NRL & ESL stars??

Baffled

[Farmduck]

What are they showing instead? I know the East Mongolian Yak Punching Quarter Finals are on this weekend.

[roughyedspud]

a replay of the usa v russia ice hockey game from last night