Crowdwatch - RL Express declares

[Ackroman]

You haven't really posted anything this last few months that seriously engages with this discussion or any other come to that. We have a worry about paying crowds and a reduction in fans bothering to go to games. It's a further worry when the RFL fiddle the figures and announce tremendous improvements to attendances when they are not there.

 

I'm just letting people see the facts because too many of them just accept the lies and the PR machine Solly runs, now RLE journalists are swallowing it. I'm looking for people to debate what we can do positively and above all honestly to maximise the games paying crowds.

 

As above your record is just coming on here baiting me on the issue, I'd suspect you want me to have a go back at you and then the thread gets pulled by the Mods and you win your little battle. It's a debate that has gone on since the board started and will go on until the board closes down, please try to allow people to have this debate. Maybe even add a few genuine opinions of your own.

 

You've already made your mind up. You made your mind up months ago.

 

You also define the facts calling Blake Solly a liar, and others apologists. People like myself for that matter.

 

I really can't be bothered with the politics and the arguments designed to make your view the correct view. It is an opinion but your language says it's a fact.

 

It's ego-centric and this is an internet discussion board not a fiefdom so you're welcome to it. Don't expect me not to laugh at you though.

[shrek]

I really don't get it, Parky is big enough to fight his own battles, and I'm sure we've bored people to death as him and I seemingly rarely agree (and when we do I think both of us miss the fact!), but the thread couldn't be any more clearly labeled, I'll argue points on crowds and love seeing people's views on whats working and whats not so thats why I pop in to these threads, but if your just having a pop at the person (which is inevitably Parky) then I really don't see the point, just avoid the thread.

[Ackroman]

I really don't get it, Parky is big enough to fight his own battles, and I'm sure we've bored people to death as him and I seemingly rarely agree (and when we do I think both of us miss the fact!), but the thread couldn't be any more clearly labeled, I'll argue points on crowds and love seeing people's views on whats working and whats not so thats why I pop in to these threads, but if your just having a pop at the person (which is inevitably Parky) then I really don't see the point, just avoid the thread.

 

Firstly the thread title is not clear. Where in any of his comments are references to League Express?

 

Secondly, people react to Parky not the other way round. He's the one calling others warriors and apologists, liars and bully's.

 

If you think that's OK then you could get into discourse with him.

 

As he rightly notes, I rarely comment and there's a very good reason because when he's not getting his own way, he's the first to start spitting his dummy out. It's got nothing to do with my desire to avoid debate, it's to avoid trivial point scoring and high fiving imaginary friends.

[shrek]

Firstly the thread title is not clear.

Really?  There's been a crowdwatch thread every week of the season, I think anyone visiting would have twigged by now were its heading.  Clearly not, my bad!

[zorquif]

BBC website still showing 5000 for Catalan. As always happy to talk us down.

 

 

Where did they get this number from?

[Ackroman]

Really?  There's been a crowdwatch thread every week of the season, I think anyone visiting would have twigged by now were its heading.  Clearly not, my bad!

 

I expected more than a sly dig at Gareth Walker for having the temerity to offer a different opinion to Parky.

 

I'm also pretty angry at the lack of sensitivity on the part of both protagonists of these threads. They spend much time deriding others views and promoting an anti RFL agenda that they forget the game is bigger than them. Neither of them paused for breath in offering a condolence on the other thread, rather they would prefer stirring the pot. Continuously.

 

if my anger has spilled over a bit I apologise but I think it's down right disrespectful because some people give more than their opinions on the game, they give their lives.

[scotchy]

I expected more than a sly dig at Gareth Walker for having the temerity to offer a different opinion to Parky.

I'm also pretty angry at the lack of sensitivity on the part of both protagonists of these threads. They spend much time deriding others views and promoting an anti RFL agenda that they forget the game is bigger than them. Neither of them paused for breath in offering a condolence on the other thread, rather they would prefer stirring the pot. Continuously.

if my anger has spilled over a bit I apologise but I think it's down right disrespectful because some people give more than their opinions on the game, they give their lives.

probably not as disrespectful as invoking someones death to have a pop at someone. Absolutely pathetic and needless.

If you want to save yourself at least a little dignity and remove that comment I'll happily delete this.

If you don't, someone really needs to have a quiet word with you

[The Parksider]

The figures so far are

 

Superleague averages (12 clubs same games)

 

2014   9,198

2015   9,016

 

Championship averages (same games this year to last)

 

2014   1,442

2015   1,469

 

My reading is that generally crowds are the same this year in SL no massive rise as the RFL report. This week Wigans special effort wiped out by Salford fans increasing disenchantment.

 

In the Championship crowds only up a bit on average, with Leigh's gains largely wiped out by a reduction in interest at other clubs.

 

Of course Bradford whacks the overall average up but their crowds are also down from last year whatever the reasons for the numbers, so Leigh seem to be the only benefactors when Solly and Walker are telling us interest is up right across the game.

 

[JonM]

My reading is that generally crowds are the same this year in SL no massive rise as the RFL report.

 

My reading, too. I think the effect of league/fixture format etc. on attendance is pretty marginal. I suppose, though, that if the "every minute counts"/jeopardy stuff is true, then its effect on attendance is more likely to show up as we approach the top-8/middle-8 cutoff point? There will be a few "must win" games in rounds 22/23? 

 

My expectation is that the crowd figures for the top-8 and middle-8 play-offs will be slighty down compared to the equivalent regular season games, but I hope to be proved wrong. 

[Krytensmate]

The figures so far are

 

Superleague averages (12 clubs same games)

 

2014   9,198

2015   9,016

 

Championship averages (same games this year to last)

 

2014   1,442

2015   1,469

 

My reading is that generally crowds are the same this year in SL no massive rise as the RFL report. This week Wigans special effort wiped out by Salford fans increasing disenchantment.

 

In the Championship crowds only up a bit on average, with Leigh's gains largely wiped out by a reduction in interest at other clubs.

 

Of course Bradford whacks the overall average up but their crowds are also down from last year whatever the reasons for the numbers, so Leigh seem to be the only benefactors when Solly and Walker are telling us interest is up right across the game.

So the answer would be to try to get more clubs in Leigh's position of genuinely having/believing they have a chance to get promoted ?

[scotchy]

So the answer would be to try to get more clubs in Leigh's position of genuinely having/believing they have a chance to get promoted ?

Or more clubs like Wigan

[Krytensmate]

More ' Pie in the SKY ' , keep dreamin , one day you'll realise you aren't getting there

[scotchy]

More ' Pie in the SKY ' , keep dreamin , one day you'll realise you aren't getting there

It seems a very sad existence you have.

[Krytensmate]

It seems a very sad existence you have.

I'm happy with my reality , you it would seem aren't with yours

[scotchy]

I'm happy with my reality , you it would seem aren't with yours

Your reality is Leigh not being and never going to a sustainable SL club, even if your DoR fights the whole of Batley. You don't seem very happy with that reality.

[ParraEelsNRL]

Please talk about the game and join the debate or go follow another sport and continually have a go at people who support that sport, and not the point of debate because it makes you feel big to be a keyboard warrior from your bedroom HQ like the rest of them above.

 

Maybe you don't understand the point/debate or don't wan't to as your interest really isn't the game..

 

As per the excellent posts above the positive way forward for crowds and attendances is to accept the limited appeal our game has and try to maximise that appeal through hard work and careful thought and planning. Effective marketing ploys need to be shared and tried widespread, competitiveness has to be improved on a regular basis, and financial security for all SL clubs achieved. It's not a long list sadly and it's not an easy point of debate as to how to maximise the paying crowds in our game.

 

Maybe that's why you and fellow bedroom Warriors prefer to just bait people.

 

But there is no excuse for RFL, Blake Solly and his apologists to just fiddle the figures and then go round claiming crowds are well up so everything is great now. Well done to Wigan for ignoring that and getting on with making the best of their business.

 

Maybe other clubs aren't doing that because RFL/Solly has given them an excuse not to bother. Anyway I'll stop there as I suspect your not bothered about the debate and are plotting your next cyber attack big man.

Do you ever post anything positive about said game, no, so stfu hypocrite.

[The Parksider]

Do you ever post anything positive about said game, no, so stfu hypocrite.

 

Your warped idea of positive must be to lie about the game, and the realities.

 

Being honest about your sport and it's business is positive, doing honest things to help sustain it and maximise it's potential is positive.

 

Your warped idea of a "debate" is to stay hidden behind your keyboard in you bedroom cursing at anyone you don't agree with big man.

[jpmc]

More ' Pie in the SKY ' , keep dreamin , one day you'll realise you aren't getting there

LOL no he wont.

[Ackroman]

probably not as disrespectful as invoking someones death to have a pop at someone. Absolutely pathetic and needless.

If you want to save yourself at least a little dignity and remove that comment I'll happily delete this.

If you don't, someone really needs to have a quiet word with you

 

Can't face the truth can you. You don't give a and never will.

[scotchy]

Can't face the truth can you. You don't give a ###### and never will.

That you think the grief of Danny Jones death is yours to use as a stick to beat some one with says far more about you than it does the people you are talking about. It pretty much defines the word 'crass'.

 

frankly Im embarrassed for you.

[Ackroman]

That you think the grief of Danny Jones death is yours to use as a stick to beat some one with says far more about you than it does the people you are talking about. It pretty much defines the word 'crass'.

 

frankly Im embarrassed for you.

 

 

I may be embarrassing and crass but I can't recall ever really giving a flying ____  what you think.

[Derwent]

On 5th January before the season started, in a previous similar themed thread, I wrote...

 

Why would people expect crowds to go up or down, especially in the first part of the season ? Its still the same clubs playing each other in the same leagues as last season.

 

I would think that fans of the "big 4" Championship clubs and the "small 4" SL clubs are of the opinion that it is not the 1st phase that will define their season, it is how they do in the second phase that is important. The fact that all clubs in the middle 8 start on zero points again is a key factor. You could be leading the Championship by 10 points or bottom of SL by 10 points but it doesn't really matter. Once the middle 8 starts you're all back on terms again.

 

There may be a slight overall average increase, particularly in the Championship, but I think that is down to the participants rather than the actual structural format. Bradford will automatically improve the average due to getting at least double the crowd of most of their rivals and will probably take above average away support to other grounds too. But that is not something you could use to declare the league format a success or not. It'll be interesting to see what the other clubs' averages look like without the Bradford games included.

 

 

I think it is still valid.

[The Parksider]

 

On 5th January before the season started, in a previous similar themed thread, I wrote...

 

Why would people expect crowds to go up or down, especially in the first part of the season ? Its still the same clubs playing each other in the same leagues as last season.

 

I would think that fans of the "big 4" Championship clubs and the "small 4" SL clubs are of the opinion that it is not the 1st phase that will define their season, it is how they do in the second phase that is important. The fact that all clubs in the middle 8 start on zero points again is a key factor. You could be leading the Championship by 10 points or bottom of SL by 10 points but it doesn't really matter. Once the middle 8 starts you're all back on terms again.

 

There may be a slight overall average increase, particularly in the Championship, but I think that is down to the participants rather than the actual structural format. Bradford will automatically improve the average due to getting at least double the crowd of most of their rivals and will probably take above average away support to other grounds too. But that is not something you could use to declare the league format a success or not. It'll be interesting to see what the other clubs' averages look like without the Bradford games included.

 

I think it is still valid.

 

Yes fair shout as always.

 

The middle eight games will be fascinating in terms of whether they draw the crowds or not.

 

And it will be interesting once we have the averages for the 22 rounds how these may go up or down by club etc etc.

 

Lots of number crunching to do and figures to look at, RL fans have always been fascinated with attendances, let's hope this becomes accepted by the mean spirited on here and they just live and let live.

[Krytensmate]

Or as Derwent pointed out , it isn't relative at all until the 8 series's

So why do people feel the need to keep bringing up threads about it every week ?