Passage to SL?

[GUBRATS]

1 hour ago, Tommygilf said:

Thats been part of a sport wide decline at the highest levels and is overstated by us playing in half a stadium for a year and a bit. There are other reasons but not for this thread really.

Nevertheless it was Hetherington who literally laid out the criteria that seemed to be eminently pro Toulouse and has been a supporter of Toronto since inception. So I doubt he'd really care too much.

And as we've established , the clubs in SL might gain some financial benefits from Toulouse being in SL via broadcasting and increased media interest , but it won't have any positive affect on any lower tier clubs , so don't be surprised if they express that opinion 

[Tommygilf]

3 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

And as we've established , the clubs in SL might gain some financial benefits from Toulouse being in SL via broadcasting and increased media interest , but it won't have any positive affect on any lower tier clubs , so don't be surprised if they express that opinion 

How many french players are currently playing in the lower leagues? 

[GUBRATS]

33 minutes ago, meast said:

Invite applications from any clubs interested in taking the 12th spot for 2021, assess them on various things, finances, structure, player development etc, narrow it down to 2 and invite them to play off in a qualifying game for the right to take the last super league place?

Why do all the assessments to then do it on the pitch ? , You either assess , or play ? , Why do both , if you do both then do both for who can come down as well 

[GUBRATS]

8 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

How many french players are currently playing in the lower leagues? 

What difference does a handful of French lads playing in the lower tiers make ?

[GUBRATS]

17 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

You'll find plenty of Leeds fans bemused by the clubs self advertising decline over the last 10 years. 

PS how long are you going to keep up this McDonald's thing its tiresome and only been a few hours.

Yes , just lazy , chasing the corporate dollar 

A bit more life left in it yet

[Tommygilf]

2 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

What difference does a handful of French lads playing in the lower tiers make ?

You seem to be really bothered about strengthening the player pool vis a vis Toronto I'd assume that would be your stance on Toulouse 

[GUBRATS]

5 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

You seem to be really bothered about strengthening the player pool vis a vis Toronto I'd assume that would be your stance on Toulouse 

Nobody has mentioned the player pool on this thread for days , why bring it up now ? , Is the argument against away fans lost ? , If so then yes let's discuss player production 

[Harry Stottle]

1 hour ago, Tommygilf said:

Other than the initial Super League creation Harry I don't think Sky have particularly asked us for anything. They'll pay more for a better product and less for a worse one (from their perspective). They've only ever shown the summer bash, playoffs (in whatever format) and Toronto games during the current broadcast deal. I think all 3 of those came from the RFL/Toronto pushing side of things rather than Sky saying "we want this" in particular.

Regardless, I was responding to a point that is total fallacy that "Catalans, and Toronto, are only in because Sky want them". Sky might like these clubs (so much of the marketing has been around SBW and Toronto this year), but they're not in because of that reason. I'm sure you'll pick up on such ludicrous suggestions that give you and fellow Leigh fans a bad name.

I haven't said anything about what Sky have done previously to format of the sport Tommy, after all it is 7 years since the last contract was signed, but times can change.

Maybe, just maybe that last season created interest with most of the competeing teams at both ends of the division,  re scheduling games because of the interest generated that would not be even contemplated if there was nothing to compete for at the bottom, even in the 8's a very much underperforming Leeds being in the bottom 4 twice still added to the season instead of well err just playing it out. I will concede on the SBW factor and say that in normal circumstances had Toronto maintained their form there would have been much more interest, whether that is morbid curiosity, elation or fear depending on which side one sits on. But the overriding factor is interest, and that is what TV companies want, I should think. 

Do you honestly think, and be honest please that in 25 years of SL it is good that we have only had 4 winners of the 'big pot'? I will have a wager with you and say this years winner will still be one of 4 but substitute Wire for Bradford, Salford were a breath of fresh air last year, but normality will be resumed this season, this will be the only interest created by 11 clubs this season with 5 of them going through the motions in 6 or so weeks time, as a fan of Rugby League I want more from my Sky subscription I want to be entertained much more than just a race to the top, jeopardy and the promotion race for the Championship, provides that.

If a numpty like me can see this I am sure someone at Sky can recognise it too, I hope they do get involved at least I will know one way or the other whether to continue with my subscription come the next contract, and I suspect if no more promotion or relegation meaning all we have to watch is the race to the SL GF I won't be on my own in cancelling.

Has that got me a bad name?

[Harry Stottle]

1 hour ago, meast said:

Invite applications from any clubs interested in taking the 12th spot for 2021, assess them on various things, finances, structure, player development etc, narrow it down to 2 and invite them to play off in a qualifying game for the right to take the last super league place?

And from '21 and beyond Meast?

[meast]

16 hours ago, PEANUT HEAD said:

Why if I was an owner I would want all the away fans a team could muster, one for atmosphere and two for income.

If you were an owner, wouldn't you want to be trying to attract home supporters for that?

[Tommygilf]

14 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

Nobody has mentioned the player pool on this thread for days , why bring it up now ? , Is the argument against away fans lost ? , If so then yes let's discuss player production 

I thought it would be an ever present on your mind?

[Harry Stottle]

42 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

You'll find plenty of Leeds fans bemused by the clubs self advertising decline over the last 10 years. 

I think that is very evident considering the population v attendees.

[Tommygilf]

6 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

I haven't said anything about what Sky have done previously to format of the sport Tommy, after all it is 7 years since the last contract was signed, but times can change.

Maybe, just maybe that last season created interest with most of the competeing teams at both ends of the division,  re scheduling games because of the interest generated that would not be even contemplated if there was nothing to compete for at the bottom, even in the 8's a very much underperforming Leeds being in the bottom 4 twice still added to the season instead of well err just playing it out. I will concede on the SBW factor and say that in normal circumstances had Toronto maintained their form there would have been much more interest, whether that is morbid curiosity, elation or fear depending on which side one sits on. But the overriding factor is interest, and that is what TV companies want, I should think. 

Do you honestly think, and be honest please that in 25 years of SL it is good that we have only had 4 winners of the 'big pot'? I will have a wager with you and say this years winner will still be one of 4 but substitute Wire for Bradford, Salford were a breath of fresh air last year, but normality will be resumed this season, this will be the only interest created by 11 clubs this season with 5 of them going through the motions in 6 or so weeks, as a fan of Rugby League I want more from my Sky subscription I want to be entertained much more than just a race to the top, jeopardy and the promotion race for the Championship, provides that.

If a numpty like me can see this I am sure someone at Sky can recognise it too, I hope they do get involved at least I will know one way or the other whether to continue with my subscription come the next contract, and I suspect if no more promotion or relegation meaning all we have to watch is the race to the SL GF I won't be in my own in cancelling.

Has that got me a bad name?

Of course not Harry, I largely agree with what you have put and have argued it several times. 

What does get bad names is fans of clubs like yours on threads like these coming along and saying "Catalans bring nowt" and "they're only in because sky want them". Both are demonstrably untrue and I'm sure you would want these erroneous claims (to which you originally responded to my reply) to be refuted.

[Tommygilf]

2 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

I think that is very evident considering the population v attendees.

Its an example of how with a bigger place you don't have to try as hard to double most other teams averages.

[meast]

13 hours ago, ATLANTISMAN said:

The reason why we have limited appeal outside of RL towns is the lack of INTERNATIONALS end of, and if anyone on here thinks this is NOT the case is living in cloud cuckoo land.

 

Paul

Which is why every RL fan, regardless of club loyalties should be getting fully behind next years world cups.

If that is a success, then hopefully, better leadership of the game, the clubs and the whole sport could turn it into a success story.

We need every ground packed, every ticket sold, we need a massive publicity shove and hopefully the sport can attract new fans, sponsors and businesses to the game.

we missed a massive trick after 2013, let's not make the same mistake!

[Tommygilf]

Just on away fans, please show me where at any of the recent home firm games it was impossible to create an atmosphere despite only 750 odd tickets being sold to the away team (as indeed is the case for most Scottish Premiership games at Ibrox or Paradise)? 

Seems its less to do with "no away fans", and more to do with "lots of empty spaces".

[GUBRATS]

8 minutes ago, meast said:

If you were an owner, wouldn't you want to be trying to attract home supporters for that?

You want both , all , whoever , come every match people , come one match people , people who come and chat all game without even knowing who's playing , people who think it's a RU game , people who just come to see muscular blokes in tight shorts , people who like rubbish beer in plastic glasses , people who like eating ###### food , as long as they pay 

[Tommygilf]

1 minute ago, GUBRATS said:

You want both , all , whoever , come every match people , come one match people , people who come and chat all game without even knowing who's playing , people who think it's a RU game , people who just come to see muscular blokes in tight shorts , people who like rubbish beer in plastic glasses , people who like eating ###### food , as long as they pay 

To get all those you might have to start listening to those marketing experts Gubby

[Harry Stottle]

2 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Its an example of how with a bigger place you don't have to try as hard to double most other teams averages.

Very true, but isn't standing still going backwards, which if I am not mistaken Leeds average attendance as been waning over the last few seasons, that is something Mr Hetherington should be concerned about and trying to rectify it, if he doesn't getting the manicurists into Headingley spending £40M may just proove to be a big mistake.

[Harry Stottle]

15 minutes ago, meast said:

we missed a massive trick after 2013, let's not make the same mistake!

Wasn't the '13 tournament a financial success Meast? Or have I dreamt that.

PS re the other question I asked of you, after you have secured a team from the Championship for '21, what for '22 are you considering?

[meast]

46 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

Why do all the assessments to then do it on the pitch ? , You either assess , or play ? , Why do both , if you do both then do both for who can come down as well 

Because, there might be 7 clubs apply, but not all of them would be sound financially or have the means to compete sufficiently.

By reducing the applications to say 4 or even 2 that meet all criteria, the final place is then settled where it should be, on the pitch.

[Tommygilf]

1 minute ago, Harry Stottle said:

Very true, but isn't standing still going backwards, which if I am not mistaken Leeds average attendance as been waning over the last few seasons, that is something Mr Hetherington should be concerned about and trying to rectify it, if he doesn't getting the manicurists into Headingley spending £40M may just proove to be a big mistake.

Tbf I think the stadium rebuild has been part of that - perhaps to the detriment of other things. The premium seating at Headingley is now significantly improved as are the North and South Concourses. I think there are still lots they could do but its certainly a great start  

Investing in the stadium has been a major success for the club as it has for most teams that have. I would wager Leeds make more from the a handful of the current corporate suites on one matchday than some clubs make from a full capacity standard entry (that they don't even get). 

Leeds can now sell RL and Headingley as a premium product with improved facilities even on the standing terraces. That's definitely not going to prove a big mistake.

[meast]

27 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

And from '21 and beyond Meast?

Well, that's a whole new subject matter!

One that seems to come around every 2 or 3 years sadly.

[meast]

15 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

You want both , all , whoever , come every match people , come one match people , people who come and chat all game without even knowing who's playing , people who think it's a RU game , people who just come to see muscular blokes in tight shorts , people who like rubbish beer in plastic glasses , people who like eating ###### food , as long as they pay 

Away fans are a bonus, away fans don't buy season tickets, merchandise, lotteries, memberships, etc etc

Away fans are a good source of income, and of course, have a role to play but they shouldn't be a major factor, all clubs should be doing more to attract home supporters, these are the ones who keep the clubs going, not away fans.

[GUBRATS]

21 minutes ago, meast said:

Which is why every RL fan, regardless of club loyalties should be getting fully behind next years world cups.

If that is a success, then hopefully, better leadership of the game, the clubs and the whole sport could turn it into a success story.

We need every ground packed, every ticket sold, we need a massive publicity shove and hopefully the sport can attract new fans, sponsors and businesses to the game.

we missed a massive trick after 2013, let's not make the same mistake!

Which is why it is madness to try to play out a full season now , a 9/10 round mini comp could have given SKY it's contracted games and allowed an early ( boxing day ) start to next year , stretching next season out without burning out the players