Toronto’s squad

[Tommygilf]

Just now, Dave T said:

Nah, it's a discussion about PT and Full Time players. Not good wages and bad wages.

Well Dave I can only say what I know from my experience of 3 SL clubs. Top 25 squad number players are being paid less than 10k p.a. I don't regard that as a full time wage - thus the conclusion for me is that there are in effect "part time" players in SL - even if they don't have second jobs. 

Whether that is to make space for bigger wages on the rest of the cap I can't say.

[SSoutherner]

6 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Well Dave I can only say what I know from my experience of 3 SL clubs. Top 25 squad number players are being paid less than 10k p.a. I don't regard that as a full time wage - thus the conclusion for me is that there are in effect "part time" players in SL - even if they don't have second jobs. 

Whether that is to make space for bigger wages on the rest of the cap I can't say.

London living wage is £10.75, for a 37.5hr week that is just under £21k !!!!!!

Outside london they list £9.30 which is just over £18k

[aj1908]

2 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Well Dave I can only say what I know from my experience of 3 SL clubs. Top 25 squad number players are being paid less than 10k p.a. I don't regard that as a full time wage - thus the conclusion for me is that there are in effect "part time" players in SL - even if they don't have second jobs. 

Whether that is to make space for bigger wages on the rest of the cap I can't say.

Wow that's nothing 

It should.be at least 30k pa minimum 

[SSoutherner]

4 minutes ago, aj1908 said:

Wow that's nothing 

It should.be at least 30k pa minimum 

even 25 on that is £3/4m assuming the cap is on just gross salary and not all the other things like pension payments etc

[Kayakman]

Players should be paid an honest, fair wage...when Toronto do it they get penalized and then roasted...so be it...players should be paid a fair, honest wage...no buts.

If they want to peanlize us for it; so be it.

[aj1908]

8 minutes ago, SSoutherner said:

even 25 on that is £3/4m assuming the cap is on just gross salary and not all the other things like pension payments etc

Nrl minimum wage is 75k I think 

Which is the average wage in Australia 

[Dave T]

14 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Well Dave I can only say what I know from my experience of 3 SL clubs. Top 25 squad number players are being paid less than 10k p.a. I don't regard that as a full time wage - thus the conclusion for me is that there are in effect "part time" players in SL - even if they don't have second jobs. 

Whether that is to make space for bigger wages on the rest of the cap I can't say.

Aye, I do get that, and agree with your view on it.  I suppose my question is around those lads occupying space 25-30 in the Wire squad for example, are they training and playing full time as RL players.

I thought the cap was only for the top 25 players

[Loup]

3 hours ago, To Be Confirmed said:

a link to the statement that TWP will only be allowed into SL if they agreed not to take any sky money would also be appreciated. 

Look it up. Three days before the MPG, Wolfpack still did not have absolute confirmation from Elstone that they would be admitted to SL if they won. You negative nabobs have been nattering for umpteen posts about incompetence, but don't lay that charge at TWP's door.

When the green light was eventually switched on, TWP had been forced to give up Sky money - their share distributed among the other greedy clubs - and pay for SL clubs' accommodation and travel for a year (altho this was originally agreed for L1 and Championship only). No protection from relegation.

The 'rules' are a shambles. TWP is fully entitled to ask for a cap dispensation - they gave up a lot to get into SL and have promoted the sport far and wide to no thanks from the SL brains trust.

[Tommygilf]

21 minutes ago, SSoutherner said:

London living wage is £10.75, for a 37.5hr week that is just under £21k !!!!!!

Outside london they list £9.30 which is just over £18k

Perhaps its time they (re)started a union

[aj1908]

2 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Perhaps its time they (re)started a union

Yes they should. 

They should just demand a share of the games.revenue 

I think the figure here is 28 percent of all the games income.is guaranteed to players 

They get to audit revenues and if they go up They get more 

[Kayakman]

Toronto is treating its players fairly, the other clubs should be too.

[Tommygilf]

17 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Aye, I do get that, and agree with your view on it.  I suppose my question is around those lads occupying space 25-30 in the Wire squad for example, are they training and playing full time as RL players.

I thought the cap was only for the top 25 players

AFAIK it is still top 25 on the cap. 26 to 30 are academy but I don't know whether that means FT training or not. I can see a lot of that being done on an individual circumstance basis. They'd still have to have a job/ college that could fit around training from u16s onwards I assume, which is hard to come by.

Regardless, it is their pay scales that are pushing into the top 25 not the other way around. The 30 to 26 of today are the 25 to 20 of tomorrow. 

[Tommygilf]

42 minutes ago, aj1908 said:

Wow that's nothing 

It should.be at least 30k pa minimum 

It is interesting that of all that we are fond of copying things from the NRL, the minimum wage isn't one of the things thats made it over.

[Marty Funkhouser]

42 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

It is interesting that of all that we are fond of copying things from the NRL, the minimum wage isn't one of the things thats made it over.

The NRL minimum wage is £60000 per top thirty squad member this year. If the SL had to do this it would result in fewer top line players here. If players 20-30 are costing nearly a third of the cap then there is not a great deal to share amongst the other 20. No marquees anymore. The NRL is a rich sport, comparisons are not equal.

Players in the UK however get a much larger slice of the games actual income than in Australia. Salary cap takes up the whole of the SKY deal money.

[Tommygilf]

10 minutes ago, Marty Funkhouser said:

The NRL minimu wage is £60000 per top thirty squad member this year. If the SL had to do this it would result in fewer top line players here. If players 20-30 are costing nearly a third of the cap then there is not a great deal to share amongst the other 20. No marquees anymore. The NRL is a rich sport, comparisons are not equal.

Players in the UK however get a much larger slice of the games actual income than in Australia. Salary cap takes up the whole of the SKY deal money.

Its all relative, and the principle of a minimum wage is different to having the same minimum as the NRL, which of course will be higher.

Tell me why a minimum wage of say £20k for the top 25 players would stop Marquee signings or indeed why it would be undesirable?

On your final point about slice of the pie that is indeed true. Are you suggesting then that we reduce the salary cap then?

[Marty Funkhouser]

30 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Its all relative, and the principle of a minimum wage is different to having the same minimum as the NRL, which of course will be higher.

Tell me why a minimum wage of say £20k for the top 25 players would stop Marquee signings or indeed why it would be undesirable?

On your final point about slice of the pie that is indeed true. Are you suggesting then that we reduce the salary cap then?

Not at all, no fan of the salary cap whatsoever. What the non-realists do not get however is that the players already do very well out of what the game has got to give. They get the main and very large chunk of the pie. The UK game is not overflowing with cash and is totally reliant on the SKY money for its full time status. Full time professional squads of 25-30 players are not the default setting for UK RL, the last 20 odd years are the exception to the rule.

It is not forced to last, indeed it could be argued that SKY/TV rights have already peaked and there will never be another deal like the ones of the last three decades. There may be some adapting to do. The runaway wage inflation Toronto are looking to (have) cause (d) is unsustainable in UK Rugby League.