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Vikings announce financial figures


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#61 Vengeance

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Posted 30 August 2010 - 07:54 PM

Well, having been at the meeting where it was announced a council member would take a place on our board, and having listened to that councilor, I can tell you EXACTLY the motivation behind it.

It is well documented that a 'marquee' sports organisation in any given district of the UK has a dramatic effect on the health of the district's inhabitants. In a nutshell, more young people want to play rugby, and old people want to get up from their chair and walk to the ground. Proven fact that the burden on health resources is lighter when the town's sporting heroes are doing well. The investment of Halton BC in the Vikings and the success of the Vikings DIRECTLY supports government driven health (and particularly obesity) directives in this respect.

It is also a documented fact that small businesses in a given town in the UK (especially those in the food/drink/retail/entertainment sectors) also do better when the marquee sporting club are successful, again supporting a key aim of the borough council to help small business.

Halton BC are helping the Vikings by addressing THEIR OWN targets handed down by Downing Street. Its a win-win for them and us. Coupled with the fact that Stobart in partnership with the council have just created a major transport hub for the town, earning 25 million-per-year contracts from the likes of Tesco and creating 5000 jobs, you soon see why HBC and Stobart together works so well for the Vikings and the town as a whole. The wider activity of the two partners is plentiful. 'Widnes Sport Ltd' has announced which im sure reflect a LOT more activity than just rugby on a Sunday, and it's quite frankly fantastic to see it.

Edited by Vengeance, 30 August 2010 - 08:03 PM.


#62 Bulletproof

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Posted 30 August 2010 - 08:04 PM

QUOTE (l'angelo mysterioso @ Aug 30 2010, 08:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I want to believe that everything is OK at Widnes
I wonder whether you'd ask questions if a simillar situation existed at another club?
It's perfectly valid to be interested in and ask questions about what is going on here.


The trouble is, you don't want to believe everything is okay at Widnes. You were vocal in questioning the success of our academy and accused us of not really producing the players we've been bringing through even though we have been. You're naturally sceptical of us, that is your default position. We have a very small cap this year, and a very good business minded owner. I don't know the ins and outs of this financial report of the club - no one spouting the usual nonsense does - but I do know the health of the club is much better than it was.

It is fine to question things, but people are merely being sceptical for the sake of it. They accepted everything at face value when we posted a loss and yet over scrutinise when we post a profit. That's not mere questioning, it's attempting to douse significant positivity in the club repeatedly.


#63 Maximus Decimus

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Posted 30 August 2010 - 10:23 PM

QUOTE (Vengeance @ Aug 30 2010, 08:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Well, having been at the meeting where it was announced a council member would take a place on our board, and having listened to that councilor, I can tell you EXACTLY the motivation behind it.

It is well documented that a 'marquee' sports organisation in any given district of the UK has a dramatic effect on the health of the district's inhabitants. In a nutshell, more young people want to play rugby, and old people want to get up from their chair and walk to the ground. Proven fact that the burden on health resources is lighter when the town's sporting heroes are doing well. The investment of Halton BC in the Vikings and the success of the Vikings DIRECTLY supports government driven health (and particularly obesity) directives in this respect.

It is also a documented fact that small businesses in a given town in the UK (especially those in the food/drink/retail/entertainment sectors) also do better when the marquee sporting club are successful, again supporting a key aim of the borough council to help small business.

Halton BC are helping the Vikings by addressing THEIR OWN targets handed down by Downing Street. Its a win-win for them and us. Coupled with the fact that Stobart in partnership with the council have just created a major transport hub for the town, earning 25 million-per-year contracts from the likes of Tesco and creating 5000 jobs, you soon see why HBC and Stobart together works so well for the Vikings and the town as a whole. The wider activity of the two partners is plentiful. 'Widnes Sport Ltd' has announced which im sure reflect a LOT more activity than just rugby on a Sunday, and it's quite frankly fantastic to see it.


Agreed, I've said this before. In places like Widnes, St Helens, Warrington, Wigan, Featherstone, Castleford etc etc it's the rugby club that gives the town it's heart and soul.

Without it, all your left with is Runcorn....

#64 The Parksider

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Posted 30 August 2010 - 11:05 PM

QUOTE (Vengeance @ Aug 30 2010, 08:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Well, having been at the meeting where it was announced a council member would take a place on our board, and having listened to that councilor, I can tell you EXACTLY the motivation behind it.

It is well documented that a 'marquee' sports organisation in any given district of the UK has a dramatic effect on the health of the district's inhabitants. In a nutshell, more young people want to play rugby, and old people want to get up from their chair and walk to the ground. Proven fact that the burden on health resources is lighter when the town's sporting heroes are doing well. The investment of Halton BC in the Vikings and the success of the Vikings DIRECTLY supports government driven health (and particularly obesity) directives in this respect.

It is also a documented fact that small businesses in a given town in the UK (especially those in the food/drink/retail/entertainment sectors) also do better when the marquee sporting club are successful, again supporting a key aim of the borough council to help small business.


Well said sir.

I just wish councils across the board could be consistent in their (positive) support accordingly............

As for the argument over the accounts, once again you have a club with a strong young player base, a great stadium, a good fanbase and a sugar daddy - which is the type of club SL desperately needs. Clearly accounts are not a problem, and if the accounts were published to show a 1M profit so as to to impress, then there really really was no need.





#65 Bomb Jack

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Posted 30 August 2010 - 11:23 PM

QUOTE (Maximus Decimus @ Aug 30 2010, 11:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Without it, all your left with is Runcorn....


Come on Mike, we all have to stick together you know biggrin.gif
Widnes - Super League's newest Club, and Cheshire's Original Glamour Club. Watch out Warrington, we're back !

#66 l'angelo mysterioso

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Posted 31 August 2010 - 08:04 AM

QUOTE (Bulletproof @ Aug 30 2010, 09:04 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The trouble is, you don't want to believe everything is okay at Widnes. You were vocal in questioning the success of our academy and accused us of not really producing the players we've been bringing through even though we have been. You're naturally sceptical of us, that is your default position. We have a very small cap this year, and a very good business minded owner. I don't know the ins and outs of this financial report of the club - no one spouting the usual nonsense does - but I do know the health of the club is much better than it was.

It is fine to question things, but people are merely being sceptical for the sake of it. They accepted everything at face value when we posted a loss and yet over scrutinise when we post a profit. That's not mere questioning, it's attempting to douse significant positivity in the club repeatedly.

not true
and I'm not being funny but I've never made any kind of comment about Widnes' Academy. I wish Widnes well and have no reason not to. I feel you are mixing me up with someone else.
A major financial turn around such as the one under discussion is worthy of question and discussion. As is a claim by one poster that the club has a tame politician.
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#67 l'angelo mysterioso

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Posted 31 August 2010 - 08:05 AM

QUOTE (Vengeance @ Aug 30 2010, 08:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Well, having been at the meeting where it was announced a council member would take a place on our board, and having listened to that councilor, I can tell you EXACTLY the motivation behind it.

It is well documented that a 'marquee' sports organisation in any given district of the UK has a dramatic effect on the health of the district's inhabitants. In a nutshell, more young people want to play rugby, and old people want to get up from their chair and walk to the ground. Proven fact that the burden on health resources is lighter when the town's sporting heroes are doing well. The investment of Halton BC in the Vikings and the success of the Vikings DIRECTLY supports government driven health (and particularly obesity) directives in this respect.

It is also a documented fact that small businesses in a given town in the UK (especially those in the food/drink/retail/entertainment sectors) also do better when the marquee sporting club are successful, again supporting a key aim of the borough council to help small business.

Halton BC are helping the Vikings by addressing THEIR OWN targets handed down by Downing Street. Its a win-win for them and us. Coupled with the fact that Stobart in partnership with the council have just created a major transport hub for the town, earning 25 million-per-year contracts from the likes of Tesco and creating 5000 jobs, you soon see why HBC and Stobart together works so well for the Vikings and the town as a whole. The wider activity of the two partners is plentiful. 'Widnes Sport Ltd' has announced which im sure reflect a LOT more activity than just rugby on a Sunday, and it's quite frankly fantastic to see it.

great post
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#68 FearTheVee

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Posted 31 August 2010 - 12:07 PM

QUOTE (l'angelo mysterioso @ Aug 31 2010, 08:05 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
great post


That profit looks unobtainably large for a Championship club and I can only assume it reflects write offs of directors' loans or similar, as per Wigan's recent profit after Whelan wrote off over 1m (2008 perhaps?)


#69 l'angelo mysterioso

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Posted 31 August 2010 - 12:15 PM

QUOTE (FearTheVee @ Aug 31 2010, 01:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
That profit looks unobtainably large for a Championship club and I can only assume it reflects write offs of directors' loans or similar, as per Wigan's recent profit after Whelan wrote off over 1m (2008 perhaps?)

I don't know, that's why I'm asking.
there's nothing wrong with local authorities investing in sports clubs. I thought Vengance expressed that idea very well, hence my reply.
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#70 Viking Warrior

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Posted 31 August 2010 - 12:35 PM

QUOTE (l'angelo mysterioso @ Aug 31 2010, 01:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I don't know, that's why I'm asking.
there's nothing wrong with local authorities investing in sports clubs. I thought Vengance expressed that idea very well, hence my reply.


what a shame that you are always trying to read everything related to widnes as a negative, just face the facts that we are a far more forward looking and successful club than your beloved featherstone. we have the ground, the academy structure, and now the financial stability that you so obviously envy...........get over it we are in a far far stronger position to gain a super league license than the rovers.
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#71 1976PMJwires

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Posted 31 August 2010 - 12:51 PM

Congrats Widnes RLFC



not long before we have the 2 Glamour clubs of Cheshire together in the same league.


to all the knockers...................Jealousy gets you nowhere laugh.gif laugh.gif

good thing for you all to think about :- Jealousy is an emotion and typically refers to the negative thoughts and feelings of insecurity, fear, and anxiety over an anticipated loss of something...... MAYBE YOUR PLACE IN SUPER LEAGUE biggrin.gif biggrin.gif biggrin.gif biggrin.gif

#72 Bomb Jack

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Posted 31 August 2010 - 01:35 PM

Bloody hell, first we had Dave T, now we also have 1976PMJwires on our side. ohmy.gif

I'm going for a lie down biggrin.gif

Edited by Bomb Jack, 31 August 2010 - 01:36 PM.

Widnes - Super League's newest Club, and Cheshire's Original Glamour Club. Watch out Warrington, we're back !

#73 1976PMJwires

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Posted 31 August 2010 - 01:41 PM

QUOTE (Bomb Jack @ Aug 31 2010, 02:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Bloody hell, first we had Dave T, now we also have 1976PMJwires on our side. ohmy.gif

I'm going for a lie down biggrin.gif




It's only fair, your club have made a real effort and credit were credit is due.

Hope you don't sleep for toooooooooo long you only get 3 yrs biggrin.gif biggrin.gif

#74 Dave T

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Posted 31 August 2010 - 02:05 PM

QUOTE (Bomb Jack @ Aug 31 2010, 02:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Bloody hell, first we had Dave T, now we also have 1976PMJwires on our side. ohmy.gif

I'm going for a lie down biggrin.gif
biggrin.gif Don't worry, it'll all change once you are back in SL!!!


#75 1976PMJwires

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Posted 31 August 2010 - 02:13 PM

QUOTE (Dave T @ Aug 31 2010, 03:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
biggrin.gif Don't worry, it'll all change once you are back in SL!!!



Correct DaveT biggrin.gif

all change indeed wink.gif

#76 l'angelo mysterioso

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Posted 31 August 2010 - 03:05 PM

QUOTE (Viking Warrior @ Aug 31 2010, 01:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
what a shame that you are always trying to read everything related to widnes as a negative, just face the facts that we are a far more forward looking and successful club than your beloved featherstone. we have the ground, the academy structure, and now the financial stability that you so obviously envy...........get over it we are in a far far stronger position to gain a super league license than the rovers.

what on earth are you talking about?


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#77 tonyXIII

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Posted 31 August 2010 - 04:00 PM

May I pose a question for our Widnes friends?

The club certainly seems to be in very good shape now. Is it just possible that you are in a much better position to make a go of SL now than you were two years ago? After all, look at how we have struggled! Maybe the decision was the right one after all?

So, my question is: "With hindsight, how do you now feel about the decision in 2008?"

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#78 BulldogBurt

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Posted 31 August 2010 - 04:12 PM

QUOTE (tonyXIII @ Aug 31 2010, 05:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
May I pose a question for our Widnes friends?

The club certainly seems to be in very good shape now. Is it just possible that you are in a much better position to make a go of SL now than you were two years ago? After all, look at how we have struggled! Maybe the decision was the right one after all?

So, my question is: "With hindsight, how do you now feel about the decision in 2008?"


It's a good point mate and one I've pondered recently. I think that with Mr. O'Connor on board and just starting his revamp of the club then we'd have managed fine this time.

However, I do feel that franchising is great for giving clubs a set of defined criteria to aim at and we've had time to demonstrate how serious and well organised we are as an entire club (finally!).

#79 Bulletproof

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Posted 31 August 2010 - 05:18 PM

QUOTE (tonyXIII @ Aug 31 2010, 05:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
May I pose a question for our Widnes friends?

The club certainly seems to be in very good shape now. Is it just possible that you are in a much better position to make a go of SL now than you were two years ago? After all, look at how we have struggled! Maybe the decision was the right one after all?

So, my question is: "With hindsight, how do you now feel about the decision in 2008?"


I think we'd have been fine coming up with Steve O Connor on board. As it stands, our crowds are stagnating because there is little excitement in the rugby.

I'm not particularly sold on franchising. We could come out of it smelling of roses but the clubs who lose out will lose far too much in my opinion. We're selling them out.

The decision to leave us out was based on a number of clubs getting new stadiums and being supposedly stronger than we are. One of those has had to move to a completely different part of the country and of those getting stadia none have actually started building, and crowds wise we could have done better. So I still think it was the wrong decision. We could come out of this strong but it will remain to be seen whether the championship will be treated fairly in years to come. I do worry for certain teams. Whoever we replace wont be primed for coming back up, I think they will soon find it hard from the championship to justify replacing anyone in super league or going straight to the front of the queue. Thats the problem. A number of teams currently in super league would be only as strong as the better teams in the championship if they dropped down. So what justification is there of giving them 6 years and counting in the top flight? One measly team gets replaced? A number of average teams get 6 then 9 years in the top flight unhindered at the expense of clubs just as viable? On what basis is this fair?

#80 tonyXIII

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Posted 31 August 2010 - 08:41 PM

Thanks for the replies. Reasoned arguments which we should all consider when discussing 'franchising'.

Bulletproof, I think your crowds will pick up, especially when you get your place at the 'top table'. I agree with your concerns about what happens to the club(s) which lose out. Are they condemned to a three-year 'ghetto'? The RFL really must sort out their own thinking about the second tier.

BulldogBurt, I think you're right on both counts. With Mr O'Connor in charge, I think you would have done well, had you got the vote over my lot last time. I agree with what you say about franchising "giving clubs a set of defined criteria to aim at" and Widnes have set their stall out perfectly. (I also think Salford have - it's about priorities and ours was the ground and now is on-field performance)

I was fascinated with the 'licensing' last time round and I will be next time (not least because Salford are in the firing line) but I felt that, despite the obvious disappointment, most Widnes fans had no argument with the decision, but they had a real problem with the decision-making process, which certainly could have been more transparent.

Anyway, thanks for the answers and Good Luck in SL in 2012.

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