Our England Squad

[GaryO]

Ben, you have been talking a load of sense until you mention Cudjoe, really!

He is totally nieve in defensive positioning, he flies out of the line with a regularity that says he will never improve in this department, and I also think that as a centre he has been complimented through his wingers (Jermaine Mc's) ability to score other than Leroy's endeavours.

[kiwis 13 6]

you guys will be tough to beat at home kiwis without johnson who was difference for us in world cup semi final but your missing sam burgess who will be collecting splinters on the bench playing limited minutes in union world cup! Tomkins will be lucky to make the starting line up as fullback over hardaker but should make the squad as utility halfs cover, back up full back, interchange impact player in my opinion. likes of graham, other 2 burgess boys, widdop, watkins and ryan hall are all world class but weve got bromwhich, foran, luke, mannering, matulino and benji marshall if coach will pick him? Will be some world class rugby either way

[BenGilesRL]

Ben, you have been talking a load of sense until you mention Cudjoe, really!

He is totally nieve in defensive positioning, he flies out of the line with a regularity that says he will never improve in this department, and I also think that as a centre he has been complimented through his wingers (Jermaine Mc's) ability to score other than Leroy's endeavours.

Cudjoe is a pure confidence player and right now it's high - he was great against Cas and if I remember rightly most of Saints tries v Giants were down their attacking right though I'm struggling to remember. Is close between him and Percival so I'll whack him in as an either or

[GeordieSaint]

Ben, you stated Wilkin deserves a recall. You need your head tested. He has never been international standard in the past when he did play and hasn't got any better. He is club standard.

[deluded pom?]

Aquila Uate:

Born 6 October 1987 (age 27)

Votua, Nadroga-Navosa, Fiji

Joe Wardle:

Born 22 September 1991 (age 23)

Halifax, West Yorkshire, England

There's a clear difference here

However Rangi Chase or Maurie Fa'asavalu would be a better comparison - and the selection of these players for England was widely criticised

Wardle chose another nation before England, his place of birth is irrelevant. Uate never played RL before moving to Australia. I can't recall much criticism of the selection of Bridge or Harrison for England squads and 'Brough for England' is often the call when a Test involving England comes around. How do you expect to grow the game in the rest of the British Isles if as soon as one of their players (irrespective of where he was born) shows any promise he's touted to play for England? The top and second tier description of international teams is complete BS. In my eyes they are all equal and deserve the same respect as each other. Developing nations are not there to use as a testing ground for potential players for Australia, England and New Zealand.

[BenGilesRL]

Wardle chose another nation before England, his place of birth is irrelevant. Uate never played RL before moving to Australia. I can't recall much criticism of the selection of Bridge or Harrison for England squads and 'Brough for England' is often the call when a Test involving England comes around. How do you expect to grow the game in the rest of the British Isles if as soon as one of their players (irrespective of where he was born) shows any promise he's touted to play for England? The top and second tier description of international teams is complete BS. In my eyes they are all equal and deserve the same respect as each other. Developing nations are not there to use as a testing ground for potential players for Australia, England and New Zealand.

 

The things is we can talk around this as much as we like - but we both agree that the international selection rules need to be more defined so that switching of nations is restricted, and eventually eradicated. This is a complex situation that would require stronger incentives across the world to play for the weaker nations, and therefore is likely to remain an aim rather than an immediate change.

 

Given we can't change the rules as they are, if anything we should really just pick on the basis of those rules - and sentimental exclusions or counter claims that 'suddenly it's fine for England' are redundant.

 

We're both guilty of this as I've not included Cuthbertson and you have understandable gripes with Wardle etc. Rules as they are, I should have included Cuthberston, so have amended the team accordingly in order to prevent this going off topic any further.

 

I would urge you to use your energy to pursue those that can make a difference to the rules by which every nation selects their teams, rather than me. I agree with you that the current rules lead to complications and feelings of unrest, and have felt the same way myself many times. I'm simply trying to share my interest in what the England team might look like for the Test series.

[BenGilesRL]

I have now included Gareth Widdop who looks likely to return for the Dragons this weekend and Adam Cuthbertson due to the rules allowing.

 

This has led to the removal of Marc Sneyd, and some more split decisions as to who is in the squad.

 

I have put Sam Tomkins as an option at 7, as I believe as the most capped England player, and currently in the NRL playing with many Kiwis who we will face, McNamara will find somewhere for him. It also backs up some calls in replies for Matty Smith not to be first choice half.

[BenGilesRL]

I've been discussing the England squad of 24 with Odds On Rob based on current form, availability and eligibility.

We've listed a starting 17 and 18th man, plus remaining squad and here's what we have come with:

1. S. Tomkins - Wigan Warriors

2. J. McGillvary - Huddersfield Giants

3. K. Watkins - Leeds Rhinos

4. J. Reed - Brisbane Broncos

5. D. Solomona - Castleford Tigers

6. K. Brown - Widnes Vikings

7. L. Gale - Castleford Tigers

8. G. Burgess - South Sydney Rabbitohs

9. J. Hodgson - Canberra Raiders

10. J. Graham - Canterbury Bulldogs

11. B. Currie - Warrington Wolves

12. J. Bateman - Wigan Warriors

13. S. Burgess - South Sydney Rabbitohs

14. M. Cooper - St George-Illawarra Dragons

15. S. Taylor - Hull FC

16. D. Houghton - Hull FC

17. E. Whitehead - Catalans Dragons

18. C. Hill - Warrington Wolves

19. D. Manfredi - Wigan Warriors

20. L. Cudjoe - Huddersfield Giants

21. D. Taylor - Catalans Dragons

22. R. Hanbury - Widnes Vikings/J. Shaul - Hull FC (split opinion)

23. G. Widdop - St George-Illawarra Dragons

24. G. Millington - Castleford Tigers

25. D. Sarginson - Wigan Warriors

Some controversial selections in there, but after Radrara was selected for Aus it threw the doors wide open.

[Guest]

I've been discussing the England squad of 24 with Odds On Rob based on current form, availability and eligibility.

We've listed a starting 17 and 18th man, plus remaining squad and here's what we have come with:

1. Sam Tomkins - Wigan Warriors

2. J. McGillvary - Huddersfield Giants

3. K. Watkins - Leeds Rhinos

4. J. Reed - Brisbane Broncos

5. D. Solomona - Castleford Tigers

6. K. Brown - Widnes Vikings

7. L. Gale - Castleford Tigers

8. G. Burgess - South Sydney Rabbitohs

9. J. Hodgson - Canberra Raiders

10. J. Graham - Canterbury Bulldogs

11. B. Currie - Warrington Wolves

12. J. Bateman - Wigan Warriors

13. S. Burgess - South Sydney Rabbitohs

14. M. Cooper - St George-Illawarra Dragons

15. S. Taylor - Hull FC

16. D. Houghton - Hull FC

17. E. Whitehead - Catalans Dragons

18. C. Hill - Warrington Wolves

19. J. Carney - Salford Red Devils

20. L. Cudjoe - Huddersfield Giants

21. D. Taylor - Catalans Dragons

22. R. Hanbury - Widnes Vikings/J. Shaul - Hull FC (split opinion)

23. G. Widdop - St George-Illawarra Dragons

24. G. Millington - Castleford Tigers

Some controversial selections in there, but after Radrara was selected for Aus it threw the doors wide open.

WTF!!!!

Sam Tomkins hasn't played all season while some would say neither has Kallum Watkins and as for Denny solomona and Justin carney you must be trying to wind people up. Ever heard of Dom manfredi or daryl Clark??

[thepimp007]

Ha Ha, Cooper before Hill???? Better than most props in the NRL let alone int he England squad. But then again its all about opinions.

 

On Current form

 

1. Shaul

2. McGilvray

3. Cudjoe (dont like him but his form this season even when Hudds were struggling has been great)

4. Reed

5. Manfredi/Charnley (although not available been superb this year)

6. Brown

7. Gale

8. Hill

9. Hodgson

10. G. Burgess

11. Bateman

12. S. Burgess

13. Graham (plays big minutes)

 

14. Clark

15. Taylor

16. T. Burgess

17. Whitehead

[BenGilesRL]

WTF!!!!

Sam Tomkins hasn't played all season while some would say neither has Kallum Watkins and as for Denny solomona and Justin carney you must be trying to wind people up. Ever heard of Dom manfredi or daryl Clark??

Based on Opta stats Solomona and Carney are above Manfredi - but yeah he's good too

If Solomona is eligible and aus can pick Radradra it's a no brainer for me.

I was more Manfredi but odds on said Carney though I'm not sure how that would go with other cas lads in the team.

Happy to change that one

Reason Sam Tomkins got in was experience and that he will improve hopefully and we imagined Shaul under a high ball against inglis and thought he's got no chance

[Tommygilf]

Tom Burgess led the line last year for England! Watkins is struggling to deserve being picked for leeds never mind England

[BenGilesRL]

Tom Burgess led the line last year for England! Watkins is struggling to deserve being picked for leeds never mind England

Agreed he's struggling but in a struggling team. Who would you have in the squad instead? (If dropped completely for example)

All three Burgess brothers aren't playing well at the moment so they are lucky two got in

[Tommygilf]

Agreed he's struggling but in a struggling team. Who would you have in the squad instead? (If dropped completely for example)

All three Burgess brothers aren't playing well at the moment so they are lucky two got in

Dan Sarginson maybe? I know he's played a lot at FB this year but he's been quality in the centres before. FB I feel would go to Tomkins by default of hardaker playing very poorly this year. Although Shaul is still a prospect for the future.

With regards to the burgess bros they are still inspirational for England and are box office names that fans want to see.

[BenGilesRL]

Dan Sarginson maybe? I know he's played a lot at FB this year but he's been quality in the centres before. FB I feel would go to Tomkins by default of hardaker playing very poorly this year. Although Shaul is still a prospect for the future.

With regards to the burgess bros they are still inspirational for England and are box office names that fans want to see.

On Burgess - exactly that why all three in the squad - Sam has to play - switch and swap other two as you like

Again agree on Tomkins and Shaul being a prospect for the future

I mentioned the Sarg Odds on wasn't keen but has to be a shout along with Cudjoe. Will add as first reserve to show inclusion

[BenGilesRL]

Updated:

I've been discussing the England squad of 24 with Odds On Rob based on current form, availability and eligibility.

We've listed a starting 17 and 18th man, plus remaining squad and here's what we have come with:

1. S. Tomkins - Wigan Warriors

2. J. McGillvary - Huddersfield Giants

3. K. Watkins - Leeds Rhinos

4. J. Reed - Brisbane Broncos

5. D. Solomona - Castleford Tigers

6. K. Brown - Widnes Vikings

7. L. Gale - Castleford Tigers

8. G. Burgess - South Sydney Rabbitohs

9. J. Hodgson - Canberra Raiders

10. J. Graham - Canterbury Bulldogs

11. B. Currie - Warrington Wolves

12. J. Bateman - Wigan Warriors

13. S. Burgess - South Sydney Rabbitohs

14. M. Cooper - St George-Illawarra Dragons

15. S. Taylor - Hull FC

16. D. Houghton - Hull FC

17. E. Whitehead - Canberra Raiders

18. C. Hill - Warrington Wolves

19. D. Manfredi - Wigan Warriors

20. L. Cudjoe - Huddersfield Giants

21. D. Taylor - Catalans Dragons

22. R. Hanbury - Widnes Vikings/J. Shaul - Hull FC (split opinion)

23. G. Widdop - St George-Illawarra Dragons

24. G. Millington - Castleford Tigers

25. D. Sarginson - Wigan Warriors

Some controversial selections in there, but after Radrara was selected for Aus it threw the doors wide open.

[Allora]

Updated:

I've been discussing the England squad of 24 with Odds On Rob based on current form, availability and eligibility.

We've listed a starting 17 and 18th man, plus remaining squad and here's what we have come with:

1. S. Tomkins - Wigan Warriors

2. J. McGillvary - Huddersfield Giants

3. K. Watkins - Leeds Rhinos

4. J. Reed - Brisbane Broncos

5. D. Solomona - Castleford Tigers

6. K. Brown - Widnes Vikings

7. L. Gale - Castleford Tigers

8. G. Burgess - South Sydney Rabbitohs

9. J. Hodgson - Canberra Raiders

10. J. Graham - Canterbury Bulldogs

11. B. Currie - Warrington Wolves

12. J. Bateman - Wigan Warriors

13. S. Burgess - South Sydney Rabbitohs

14. M. Cooper - St George-Illawarra Dragons

15. S. Taylor - Hull FC

16. D. Houghton - Hull FC

17. E. Whitehead - Canberra Raiders

18. C. Hill - Warrington Wolves

19. D. Manfredi - Wigan Warriors

20. L. Cudjoe - Huddersfield Giants

21. D. Taylor - Catalans Dragons

22. R. Hanbury - Widnes Vikings/J. Shaul - Hull FC (split opinion)

23. G. Widdop - St George-Illawarra Dragons

24. G. Millington - Castleford Tigers

25. D. Sarginson - Wigan Warriors

Some controversial selections in there, but after Radrara was selected for Aus it threw the doors wide open.

 

Solomona qualifies?

[Guest]

The day the likes of Denny solomona, Justin carney, grant millington, dave Taylor and Rhys hanbury make the England squad is the day I once and for all walk away from international RL.

[GeordieSaint]

<Snip>

 

We should resist changing the side to drastically as cohesion and understanding is really important at International level; it's why the Aussies have been so successful - experience is essential so similar faces with 3-6 new squad players is how to keep refreshing the squad. So despite some current form, we wouldn't go wrong with something like this:

 

1. S Tomkins

2. J McGilvary/D Manfredi

3. K Watkins/L Cudjoe

4. J Reed/D Sarginson

5. R Hall

6. G Widdop

7. L Gale/M Smith

8. J Graham/T Burgess

9. J Hodgson/D Clark

10. C Hill/G Burgess/L Watts

11. S Burgess/D Whitehead

12. J Bateman/B Currie

13. S O'Loughlin/M Cooper

 

I don't think you could go too wrong with that squad with some fresh blood either in the squad i.e. Manfredi and Watts or non-playing squad members from last year i.e. Gale and Currie.

 

Absolutely no to any Kiwi/Island/Aussie accents in the squad unless they were born in England.

[BenGilesRL]

Absolutely no to any Kiwi/Island/Aussie accents in the squad unless they were born in England.

 

 

The day the likes of Denny solomona, Justin carney, grant millington, dave Taylor and Rhys hanbury make the England squad is the day I once and for all walk away from international RL.

 

Unfortunately we are playing under rules where all nations can select whoever they like within the criteria. So we either get the rules changed or if we don't do the same we are at a disadvantage and making our task even more difficult.

 

I would rather no one was doing it, but if they are doing I'm inclined to say stuff them otherwise it's not fair.

 

Maybe it needs us to do it in order for the other countries to have a desire to change it? If we keep playing the "it's not the proper thing to do" card they will keep getting away with it and it'll never change.

[GeordieSaint]

Unfortunately we are playing under rules where all nations can select whoever they like within the criteria. So we either get the rules changed or if we don't do the same we are at a disadvantage and making our task even more difficult.

 

I would rather no one was doing it, but if they are doing I'm inclined to say stuff them otherwise it's not fair.

 

Maybe it needs us to do it in order for the other countries to have a desire to change it? If we keep playing the "it's not the proper thing to do" card they will keep getting away with it and it'll never change.

 

I really don't care what others are doing; we should set an example as the country with the 2nd biggest pool of talent and not follow the Australian's lead. I absolutely want the rules to be changed but we simply shouldn't bow to the same lows as other nations.

[Scubby]

We should resist changing the side to drastically as cohesion and understanding is really important at International level; it's why the Aussies have been so successful - experience is essential so similar faces with 3-6 new squad players is how to keep refreshing the squad. So despite some current form, we wouldn't go wrong with something like this:

 

1. S Tomkins

2. J McGilvary/D Manfredi

3. K Watkins/L Cudjoe

4. J Reed/D Sarginson

5. R Hall

6. G Widdop

7. L Gale/M Smith

8. J Graham/T Burgess

9. J Hodgson/D Clark

10. C Hill/G Burgess/L Watts

11. S Burgess/D Whitehead

12. J Bateman/B Currie

13. S O'Loughlin/M Cooper

 

I don't think you could go too wrong with that squad with some fresh blood either in the squad i.e. Manfredi and Watts or non-playing squad members from last year i.e. Gale and Currie.

 

Absolutely no to any Kiwi/Island/Aussie accents in the squad unless they were born in England.

 

Exactly, for a change there is no need to sway from that core squad. I really hope Hall, Watkins and the Burgess twins hit top form in the second half of the season. I have a sneaking suspicion that Sam Tomkins will be on fire come September/October. He is all class and last year showed how much we needed him.

[Scubby]

11. S Burgess/D Whitehead

 

Showing your age a bit there. Derek Whitehead must have retired 35 years ago.