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toffeedog

Who going to be playing for us next season

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I'm sure who ever took over wouldn't take credit for wins and blame players for losses or play centres in second row and then not play ur best full back for two.must win matches or say then there was the loss to swinton when asked said did the charity run today was great did good time too or say players have a phycholgloical issue at the moment breeds confidence all this dont you think !!!!!

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I’m not sure if you saw the last two matches toffee but I have to say Joufrett has impressed at fullback he has what Scotty doesn’t 

The way he comes into attack at speed and the lines he runs at least two tries at Rochdale and one against Dewsbury we’re down to just that 

I for one can’t criticise Diskin for that selection .Scotty is great under the high ball and defence but lacks the attacking edge of the Frenchman 

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3 hours ago, toffeedog said:

I'm sure who ever took over wouldn't take credit for wins and blame players for losses or play centres in second row and then not play ur best full back for two.must win matches or say then there was the loss to swinton when asked said did the charity run today was great did good time too or say players have a phycholgloical issue at the moment breeds confidence all this dont you think !!!!!

Sorry, but I need a translator for most of that Toffee.

We won the two must win matches didn't we? So I'm not sure what point you are making. Jouffret offers far better attacking options from full back than Scott ever will. He left Scott out for making two shocking errors that cost us tries against Sheffield. We won the following game, so he kept to the same team. Some were moaning he was like the tinkerman earlier in the season for making too many changes. Then when he doesn't tinker, you complain about that? 

Although the quote about psychological issues was probably said tongue in cheek, I'm not convinced that there is not an element of truth to it TBH. We have some very good players, but all of them have made a huge amount of handling errors this season, not to mention the number of interceptions we have thrown out. How would you explain it, if it is not a psychological issue? 

Edited by DOGFATHER

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The man is a clueless idiot and yes I went to the dewsbury game which louie dropped the ball under the sticks to give them there try . Also louie only feeds people the ball which to be fair isn't that great on the eye . He the quickest player we have yet never takes the line on . Diskin should leave soon as possible if not I'm done not watching anymore of his dross he calls rugby came 3 years ago told the players play what they saw so set plays just play what they saw he said 3 years later his team we nearly got relegated next year he in charge we will . As cant motivate a team and they look lost everytime we concede . 

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The requested wrestle room did nothing but increase our ability to give opposition soft penalties.

The off the cuff self backing playing style saw a predictable slow passage of play. Dom brambani just looked greedy and slow the amount of times he was caught with the ball killing momentum.

Let's not even mention expecting leaky to play 80 mins when even teenage amateur clubs include replacement hookers on the subs bench.

The working for each other bulldog spirit seems lost. The energy and fitness levels under kear seems halved.

The way diskin swaggers around the place you'd expect him to be of mal meninga or Cameron Smith quality.

Let's face it we've been disappointed with matts up to date rugby knowledge from the most successful club around (Leeds not bulls) why also didn't he have access to 10 or 15 Jack broadbents via Leeds even after fevs pickings


'Shaw cross juniors, Birkenshaw, Mirfield, Heckmondwike Panthers, Stainland Stags and then the Heavy woolen donkeys... WARDY, STOZZA, GT, KARL OR KEAR MUST OF DROPPED A DIGIT FROM MY MOBILE NUMBER! :clapping:

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2 hours ago, toffeedog said:

The man is a clueless idiot and yes I went to the dewsbury game which louie dropped the ball under the sticks to give them there try . Also louie only feeds people the ball which to be fair isn't that great on the eye . He the quickest player we have yet never takes the line on . Diskin should leave soon as possible if not I'm done not watching anymore of his dross he calls rugby came 3 years ago told the players play what they saw so set plays just play what they saw he said 3 years later his team we nearly got relegated next year he in charge we will . As cant motivate a team and they look lost everytime we concede . 

Louis also threw the final pass for all 3 of our tries on Sunday. He also scored a very good try against Rochdale chiming in to the line from fullback. I agree he doesn't take the line on enough for my liking, and his defence is shaky too. But just like all of the players and coaches in the CH, if he didn't have these flaws, he would be in SL or the NRL.

Edited by DOGFATHER

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So Scotty, who leads the season's MOM table and has saved us more over 4 seasons, gives 2 tries away in one match and becomes unselectable? Louis is a stand-off, whether opinion says he's been good or bad, and whilst a combination of injury and non-selection has resulted in a guy I've spent £250 on not getting much game time I would akways back playing your best players in their best positions, Louis is 6 Scott's 1. Especially as he has put himself up for another year in an effort to help rectify a situation, what can he then expect of a coach who can't credit him when week after week he knocks down big guys and saves tries, yet can publicly point the finger on 2 errors? Sounds too late now to be discussing the coaching job anyway,  20 odd pages of disgruntled fans and 8 pages of talking about players appears to have no effect whatsoever on the thoughts of a board which is clearly happy to see people greatly unhappy.

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Personally I couldn't care less if the players like diskin or if the BOD are happy with what he's achieved over the past 3 years. For me it's simply down to whether or not the on pitch product is worth the money I'm paying for it. And I'm very sorry to say but it's not.

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For when the one great scorer comes to mark against your name he writes not if you won or lost but how you played the game.

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10 hours ago, phildog said:

So Scotty, who leads the season's MOM table and has saved us more over 4 seasons, gives 2 tries away in one match and becomes unselectable? Louis is a stand-off, whether opinion says he's been good or bad, and whilst a combination of injury and non-selection has resulted in a guy I've spent £250 on not getting much game time I would akways back playing your best players in their best positions, Louis is 6 Scott's 1. Especially as he has put himself up for another year in an effort to help rectify a situation, what can he then expect of a coach who can't credit him when week after week he knocks down big guys and saves tries, yet can publicly point the finger on 2 errors? Sounds too late now to be discussing the coaching job anyway,  20 odd pages of disgruntled fans and 8 pages of talking about players appears to have no effect whatsoever on the thoughts of a board which is clearly happy to see people greatly unhappy.

Personally, I wouldn't have dropped Scott for his performance against Sheffield, as I thought besides the mistakes, he had a pretty good game.

Although, even you must admit, his decision has been fully vindicated. Joufrett has had a couple of decent games since his change in position, he has given us more attacking options playing at fullback, than we have had all season. We won both "must win" games whilst he has played there and he threw the final passes for all 3 of our tries on Sunday, whether you like it or not, Diskin's tactic/plan has worked.

Neither were very pretty wins, but I'd take ugly wins over pretty losses every week. Especially in games like those, if only we could have done the same in the 1895 Cup. 

Regarding the squad numbers, are you serious? Danny Yates is 14, does that mean he should be on the subs bench every week?

Several fans have complained, including you I believe, that we don't communicate enough with fans on selection decisions and injuries. Then when he does, it is publicly pointing the finger. What do you want him to do Phil?

It is also worth noting, Diskin actually stated:-

“There are some players that have been struggling a bit with form and Dave is one of them,” said Diskin. “Dave’s a real quality player and I’m sure he’ll be working hard to get back in the team.” 

I'm not quite sure how you can construe that as finger pointing, or running the player down.

Edited by DOGFATHER

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1 hour ago, Batley Bob said:

Scotty is a full back/ winger , so why are  we playing a centre on wing 

I'm not saying I necessarily agree with his decision Bob.

As I stated above, it is difficult to argue with it though, as we won both games.

I'm also sure, many fans would be scratching their heads, if he had put Scott back in and dropped either Broadbent or Reittie, who have both had a couple of really good games.

Edited by DOGFATHER

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Broadbent IS a Centre. NOT a winger. We seem to have a clash of personality between coach and players. The naughty step has been busy this year. I feel, and this is just my opinion, but there is a distinct lack of Man Management. Call it inexperience if you like but it's taken 3 years to get here.It's like the workplace, some of us react to an arm round the shoulder, other to a verbal " discussion". It's a long time since I've felt these feelings and it's not good. But I will always follow the Gallant Youths, it seems like we have had 6 years(steps) forward and 3 years (steps) back. Rant over. 

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WHERE DO YOU WANT ME TO SWIPE THIS?

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52 minutes ago, DOGFATHER said:

I'm not saying I necessarily agree with his decision Bob.

As I stated above, it is difficult to argue with it though, as we won both games.

 

Aye , you forgot to mention that we conceded 5 tries against a lousy Rochdale side who have won a mere single game all season . Up to the game with us they had scored and average of just under 14 points per game and then suddenly , they score 26 ! Maybe , just maybe , not having a sound defensive Full Back on the field may have had something to do with Rochdale's increase productivity !!

Just saying .

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DF, Not sure I follow you in squad numbers relating to position in selection sheet. I would suggest that when a coach gives out shirts 1-13 at Presentation Night, that, in his mind, is the first 13. After that, if we were to expect the next 4 to be the first 4 subs then I would follow your thinking, but even I can understand that it doesn't necessarily follow. If one sponsors a player who isn't chosen on that first 13, you know it's a chance you take. A bad match from one of that first 13, after his previous standards, just doesn't sit right. Funnily enough I seem to remember at the back end of last season Ward was out ahead on the MOM list then couldn't buy a place.....are we seeing unfair benefit to a buddy?

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11 hours ago, colinb said:

Broadbent IS a Centre. NOT a winger. We seem to have a clash of personality between coach and players. The naughty step has been busy this year. I feel, and this is just my opinion, but there is a distinct lack of Man Management. Call it inexperience if you like but it's taken 3 years to get here.It's like the workplace, some of us react to an arm round the shoulder, other to a verbal " discussion". It's a long time since I've felt these feelings and it's not good. But I will always follow the Gallant Youths, it seems like we have had 6 years(steps) forward and 3 years (steps) back. Rant over. 

You are closer to the inner goings on than me Colin. Surely though, if there was a lack of man-management, the better players would have left already? 

I find it hard to believe, the players that have re-signed would have done, if they did not believe in the coach. But I could be totally wrong with that assumption.

It is widely rumoured that Manning is money motivated, not that there's anything wrong with that, but he is one of the best second rowers in the division, it just doesn't make sense that he would stick with us, if he didn't believe in the coach and he is happy to settle for losing pay most weeks.

What I do find hard to understand, is how the club are sticking by a coach whose team has consistently made too many unforced errors, thrown suicidal passes out, consistently taken the wrong option and given away needless, soft penalties away. In 3 years we have not made any tangible progress in fixing any of these issues. 

Whether that is down to the players or the coach is open to debate. However, it hasn't mattered who we have brought in to the squad over that 3 year period, they have all been guilty of the same failings.

Then again, I've seen a lot of SL games this season and I have seen the same sorts of things in so many games this season. Dewsbury were even more guilty of those same frailties on Sunday. Diskin isn't coaching them, yet they displayed all of the same characteristics as us. 

3 years ago, I really admired, and was quite excited by his approach of letting players play what was in front of them. However, I would have hoped that after a half a season of watching it fail, the penny would have dropped, that part time players are simply not capable of playing without a very rigid and structured approach.

I would be fine with us trying to play entertaining football once we had the game won, i.e. Once we were 3 scores in front. But we don't, we try to play football from minute 1. As we haven't got on top first, we are put under pressure and this leads to unnecessary mistakes and panic sets in, because we are constantly chasing the game.

What adds weight to the fact it is not just the coach in my opinion is. We obviously went with a very conservative game plan against Sheffield, the 5 drives and a kick approach, and the players were unable to even do that. We still made far too many errors and gave away too many needless penalties.

Scott made two pretty bad unforced errors in that game. Playing devil's advocate, I'm not sure what else he could do? Would he have been better to reward him for these mistakes by playing him in the Rochdale game? Again, I wouldn't have dropped him personally, I thought it was a mistake, but I find it hard to criticise him after we won both games and the guy he moved in to Scott's position has been at the hub of most of the points we have scored in those two games.

Edited by DOGFATHER

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14 minutes ago, phildog said:

DF, Not sure I follow you in squad numbers relating to position in selection sheet. I would suggest that when a coach gives out shirts 1-13 at Presentation Night, that, in his mind, is the first 13. After that, if we were to expect the next 4 to be the first 4 subs then I would follow your thinking, but even I can understand that it doesn't necessarily follow. If one sponsors a player who isn't chosen on that first 13, you know it's a chance you take. A bad match from one of that first 13, after his previous standards, just doesn't sit right. Funnily enough I seem to remember at the back end of last season Ward was out ahead on the MOM list then couldn't buy a place.....are we seeing unfair benefit to a buddy?

The squad numbers do not mean anything. Brown is squad number 13 for example, but he is mainly used as an impact player from the bench.

I also do not understand your gripe about Scott not playing enough, he has had more starts than anyone else in the squad this season, 27 according to Rog's stats.

 

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1 hour ago, nineoil said:

Aye , you forgot to mention that we conceded 5 tries against a lousy Rochdale side who have won a mere single game all season . Up to the game with us they had scored and average of just under 14 points per game and then suddenly , they score 26 ! Maybe , just maybe , not having a sound defensive Full Back on the field may have had something to do with Rochdale's increase productivity !!

Just saying .

It is also the first time we have scored over 30 points this season too. It was also the very poor Rochdale team that we only managed to beat by 6 points at home earlier in the season, whilst Scott was at full back.

Just saying. 😉 

Edited by DOGFATHER

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So DF you don't like Scott and are on  a witch hunt ! 

You repeat 2 shocking errors.  Well he has only dropped 3 high balls this season and Sheffield was one of them. 

A knock on at PTB uncharacteristic yes but he wasn't the only one in that game with that error. Leak also knocked on at PTB. Leak was also responsible for a knock on after Scott's high ball drop which gifted Sheffield another set of 6 to attack the line which lead to a try.I wonder if there was interference at PTB by Sheffield as 2 players who would not normally do this did it in the same game. That's up to the ref to sort out though. 

You don't seem to berate all the errors made week on week by players.

Edited by La belle chanson

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51 minutes ago, La belle chanson said:

So DF you don't like Scott and are on  a witch hunt ! 

You repeat 2 shocking errors.  Well he has only dropped 3 high balls this season and Sheffield was one of them. 

A knock on at PTB uncharacteristic yes but he wasn't the only one in that game with that error. Leak also knocked on at PTB. Leak was also responsible for a knock on after Scott's high ball drop which gifted Sheffield another set of 6 to attack the line which lead to a try.I wonder if there was interference at PTB by Sheffield as 2 players who would not normally do this did it in the same game. That's up to the ref to sort out though. 

You don't seem to berate all the errors made week on week by players.

Quite the opposite in fact, I really like Scott, defensively I wouldn't swap him for any other full back in the division. Given the fact he is one of the first players to be announced as signed for next year, also suggests the club think so too.

He seems to have a great character, and I'm really glad we have managed to sign him on again. As stated several times, I thought he had a good game apart from the errors against Sheffield, and I wouldn't have left him out, I thought it was a mistake to drop him. I thought he saved 3 or 4 tries in the Sheffield game too, tries I don't think Louis would have managed to prevent. But even his biggest supporter, must admit we have looked better in attack with Louis at Fullback.

I stated in a previous thread, I would have Scott as the fullback, but would have Jouffret running Scott's lines and chiming in to the line on attack, rather than playing as a first receiver. With Scott running angles off of him and providing options.

See Johndeere's post above, it really sums it up.

Edited by DOGFATHER

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1 hour ago, La belle chanson said:

So DF you don't like Scott and are on  a witch hunt ! 

The over-reaction and reaching on these pages really does astonish me at times!

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4 hours ago, colinb said:

Broadbent IS a Centre. NOT a winger. We seem to have a clash of personality between coach and players. The naughty step has been busy this year. I feel, and this is just my opinion, but there is a distinct lack of Man Management. Call it inexperience if you like but it's taken 3 years to get here.It's like the workplace, some of us react to an arm round the shoulder, other to a verbal " discussion". It's a long time since I've felt these feelings and it's not good. But I will always follow the Gallant Youths, it seems like we have had 6 years(steps) forward and 3 years (steps) back. Rant over. 

Absolutely Colin. We are currently in a backward stage, that I sincerely hope is being looked at with a very proactive attitude within the Club. I admire DFs lengthy and numerous posts defending Diskin in great detail, but I think the discord between Coach & Players has been an issue for 3 years, with a constant cycle of leavings and signings to paper over the cracks. If he was so committed to rectifying the errors of the past 3 years, why put himself in the frame for the Salford Assistant?

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Dog father are you Matt diskin agent or drinking friend or friend in general or just rate him or simply besotted by his brilliant rugby  we didn't beat dewsbury dewsbury beat dewsbury or was you watching matt with ur rose tinted glasses louie fullback why not loose forward anyways after we get taken to the cleaners tomorrow in France you can come back and tell me how great the team selection and the way he blames the team after like the stuck record he his with the usual were not doing what we practice .practice writing ur resignation but that takes a ###### a man than him . Gary Thornton knew he couldn't continue and left because he cared for the club he cares for matt not batley

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1 hour ago, toffeedog said:

Dog father are you Matt diskin agent or drinking friend or friend in general or just rate him or simply besotted by his brilliant rugby  we didn't beat dewsbury dewsbury beat dewsbury or was you watching matt with ur rose tinted glasses louie fullback why not loose forward anyways after we get taken to the cleaners tomorrow in France you can come back and tell me how great the team selection and the way he blames the team after like the stuck record he his with the usual were not doing what we practice .practice writing ur resignation but that takes a ###### a man than him . Gary Thornton knew he couldn't continue and left because he cared for the club he cares for matt not batley

Neither, I've never met him, nor even spoken to him. I'm just not wearing my anti-Diskin specs, which allows me to look at things with a tiny bit of objectivity, unlike some on this forum.

Try to read my posts Toffee, where have I agreed with his decision to leave Scott out and move Jouffret to full back? I thought it was a bad decision to leave one of our best and most consistent players out. 

But I'm open minded enough to realise that it was a decision that paid off. Whether I, or anyone else thinks it was a bad decision is irrelevant, the fact that we won both games, the 50 points we scored at Rochdale and the 3 tries he set up against Dewsbury says it was a good decision. End of story!

On one hand Diskin is criticised for doing the same thing every week, when he does make a change, like the one to replace Scott with Jouffret he is also wrong, even though, the facts show it was a good decision.

Some have just had the knife in since day one, and it doesn't matter what he does, even if he dropped his pants and laid a golden egg on the halfway line at halftime, it still wouldn't be good enough for some of our fans. That is what I have an issue with. I've never stated he is the best coach, he isn't, but he is far from the worst too.

Edited by DOGFATHER

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