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South Sydney director’s international blueprint

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1 hour ago, Tex Evans Thigh said:

Read my post again. It shouldn't be the pinnacle, it's the wrong strategy.

Before 2018, NZ had won more tournaments than NSW in the preceding 8 years or so but Origin is constantly pushed by the Australian media and NRL. That needs to be broken for international RL to succeed.

Who needs?

The game in Australia is hugely popular and Origin works.

It's up to the other tier 1 nations to develop in order to bring 80k people to see a tests and beat the Kangaroos more often.


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1 hour ago, MatthewWoody said:

Who needs?

The game in Australia is hugely popular and Origin works.

It's up to the other tier 1 nations to develop in order to bring 80k people to see a tests and beat the Kangaroos more often.

But this is my point. NSW couldn't beat Queensland for years but people kept showing up. NZ beat Australia in a few comps in the last 10 years but there is little interest.  Why? Because the Origin concept is held up as the best so every other rep game is downgraded, even the World Cup.

England, Tonga and NZ could beat Australia every week and Origin would still be more popular in Australia. There is obviously a place for Origin, it's a good concept, but there needs to be a shift in the Australian mindset that International football is more important.

Edited by Tex Evans Thigh
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You cannot control what people like or dislike.

When England will regularly beat Australia, maybe...

About Australia, they'd be stupid not to push Origin, because it works a lot as an event.

In fact, the NRL is doing for the Int game more than the SL, that doesn't have any rep weekend, etc.

Next year, I'm not sure there will be a sold out for the England v Aus games. In England!

By the way, QLD or NSW could beat England or Tonga. 


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6 minutes ago, MatthewWoody said:

You cannot control what people like or dislike.

When England will regularly beat Australia, maybe...

About Australia, they'd be stupid not to push Origin, because it works a lot as an event.

In fact, the NRL is doing for the Int game more than the SL, that doesn't have any rep weekend, etc.

Next year, I'm not sure there will be a sold out for the England v Aus games. In England!

By the way, QLD or NSW could beat England or Tonga. 

But the media do to a large extent, brainwashing viewers that Origin is the pinnacle and denigrating the international game. It has a huge impact 

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Just now, DoubleD said:

But the media do to a large extent, brainwashing viewers that Origin is the pinnacle and denigrating the international game. It has a huge impact 

I really don't see what's wrong with Origin. It works, people like it, well done.

What we need is giving non Australian players something similar to play.

For example, a Tonga v England in Auckland could be very similar.

 


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11 minutes ago, MatthewWoody said:

I really don't see what's wrong with Origin. It works, people like it, well done.

What we need is giving non Australian players something similar to play.

For example, a Tonga v England in Auckland could be very similar.

 

I don’t disagree but my point still stands 

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On 12/11/2019 at 11:02, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

This could work in the international games favour. If we can get State of Origin to be played on 3 stand alone weekends, Tonga, New Zealand, Samoa, Fiji, PNG, Cook Islands, Lebanon, England could all potentially play 3 mid season internationals. 

You are right, and i think it absolutely would work in favour of the international game.

Richardson's suggestions are just that though... suggestions.  Opinion.

They are (unfortunately) miles away from being adopted by the NRL.

 


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Let's hope!  

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19 hours ago, Sports Prophet said:

I see no reason at all why the NRL cannot expand to be come the governors of the sport across all nations in the pacific. Branded as NZRL in New Zealand for example. NZRL are still the governors of the sport in NZ, but effectively managed by an international governing body.

1st of all I highly doubt the NRL wants to run the NZRL. 2nd NZRL legally runs the sport in NZ and receives NZ government funding & % of profit on betting from Government regulated NZ Racing Board. 3rd NZRL operating costs are nearly 10 million NZ dollars per year and I doubt the NRL can afford an annual grant that big. 

NZRL budgets for 2016 & 2017 https://nzrl.co.nz/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/Annual-Report-16-17.pdf.  show profits of $342,000 in 2016 and $643,000 in 2017. But In 2015 & 2018 NZRL made losses. As a result NZRL couldnt afford to send the 2015 NZ Schoolboys to Australia. In 2018 NZ residents side didnt play a game just named a team on paper to save funds. NRL makes Multi millions in profit from the NZ market every year in TV rights, sponsorship and merchandise. What Shane Richardson understands is NZRL relies on the national side to make revenue to help fund the sport in NZ. In the years where revenues not as high as needed, NZRL makes a loss and NZ Youth and NZ Residents sides suffer. A yearly NRL grant to NZRL of 10% of the profit they make in NZ TV rights, would really help the game in NZ.

Edited by kiwis 13 6
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On 12/11/2019 at 22:04, Oliver Clothesoff said:

That’s a good idea in principle if you’re a profitable competition, like the NRL. 

And that hits the nail on the head.

In SL there are clubs that invest a lot of time and resources in just keeping their heads above water.  If they succeed then that is considered a success.  But they do not, or choose not, to see a possible bigger picture.

The big question is .... Can the game be restructured and marketed to bring in the income that will compensate teams for a reduction in fixtures and make the game more visible to new spectators and investors?

IMHO a restructure as suggested by Richardson could be a game changer if everyone buys in and supports the change.

 

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On 14/11/2019 at 11:40, kiwis 13 6 said:

1st of all I highly doubt the NRL wants to run the NZRL. 2nd NZRL legally runs the sport in NZ and receives NZ government funding & % of profit on betting from Government regulated NZ Racing Board. 3rd NZRL operating costs are nearly 10 million NZ dollars per year and I doubt the NRL can afford an annual grant that big. 

NZRL budgets for 2016 & 2017 https://nzrl.co.nz/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/Annual-Report-16-17.pdf.  show profits of $342,000 in 2016 and $643,000 in 2017. But In 2015 & 2018 NZRL made losses. As a result NZRL couldnt afford to send the 2015 NZ Schoolboys to Australia. In 2018 NZ residents side didnt play a game just named a team on paper to save funds. NRL makes Multi millions in profit from the NZ market every year in TV rights, sponsorship and merchandise. What Shane Richardson understands is NZRL relies on the national side to make revenue to help fund the sport in NZ. In the years where revenues not as high as needed, NZRL makes a loss and NZ Youth and NZ Residents sides suffer. A yearly NRL grant to NZRL of 10% of the profit they make in NZ TV rights, would really help the game in NZ.

1. That’s like saying the NSWRL has no ambition in becoming the Australian national body for RL

2. yes, correct. What’s the point? If the NRL became the governors and managers of the game in the South Pacific, those grants are not all of a sudden lost.

3. The NZRL costs can be streamlined if they came under the jurisdiction of an expanded NRL and the NRL would have more influence over exploiting the benefits.

I am well aware that the NRL milks NZ and the reinvestment is not equitable. Should the NRL become “owners” of the sport in NZ, this would be a very different story.

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9 hours ago, Sports Prophet said:

1. That’s like saying the NSWRL has no ambition in becoming the Australian national body for RL

2. yes, correct. What’s the point? If the NRL became the governors and managers of the game in the South Pacific, those grants are not all of a sudden lost.

3. The NZRL costs can be streamlined if they came under the jurisdiction of an expanded NRL and the NRL would have more influence over exploiting the benefits.

I am well aware that the NRL milks NZ and the reinvestment is not equitable. Should the NRL become “owners” of the sport in NZ, this would be a very different story.

Somehow youve become fixated with the NRL ruining NZRL something nobody is seriously proposing or even considering. Shane Richardson was referring to NRL making a grant to NZRL of a percentage of the millions they make in profit from New Zealand. This grant would help ensure the NZRL run a full program every year as some years they struggle with funding shortfalls. This Grant would also help the NRL be seen as giving back to communities in NZ that follow the competition & strengthen one of NRL's key talent recruiting areas.

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On 13/11/2019 at 05:04, Tex Evans Thigh said:

But this is my point. NSW couldn't beat Queensland for years but people kept showing up. NZ beat Australia in a few comps in the last 10 years but there is little interest.  Why? Because the Origin concept is held up as the best so every other rep game is downgraded, even the World Cup.

England, Tonga and NZ could beat Australia every week and Origin would still be more popular in Australia. There is obviously a place for Origin, it's a good concept, but there needs to be a shift in the Australian mindset that International football is more important.

It comes down to money. Origin makes money, Internationals no where near as much unfortunately.    

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3 hours ago, kiwis 13 6 said:

Somehow youve become fixated with the NRL ruining NZRL something nobody is seriously proposing or even considering. Shane Richardson was referring to NRL making a grant to NZRL of a percentage of the millions they make in profit from New Zealand. This grant would help ensure the NZRL run a full program every year as some years they struggle with funding shortfalls. This Grant would also help the NRL be seen as giving back to communities in NZ that follow the competition & strengthen one of NRL's key talent recruiting areas.

You’re right, I am a little fixated. That’s because I think the good of the game depends on it.

In the meantime, a grant from the NRL to the NZRL is of paramount importance and should be somewhere around 25-50% of those given to the NSWRL and QRL, with a view that in time it gets closer to parity with those two organisations.

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22 hours ago, Sports Prophet said:

You’re right, I am a little fixated. That’s because I think the good of the game depends on it.

In the meantime, a grant from the NRL to the NZRL is of paramount importance and should be somewhere around 25-50% of those given to the NSWRL and QRL, with a view that in time it gets closer to parity with those two organisations.

I would like to know the yearly amounts the NRL grants to NSWRL & QRL & other states of Australia? In 25 years NZ Warriors have been in the competition NRL have made millions per year in Profit from NZ. The total amount granted by the NRL to NZRL in 25 years is $10,000 for 2015 NZ Schoolboys trip. After NSW & QLD, NZ is the NRL's next biggest market, revenue earner and source of playing talent. NRL makes some revenue from W.A, Victoria, S.A and N.T that amount is relatively small compared to NZ. You can count the current NRL players to come from W.A, Victoria and N.T on 2 hands! Rugby League in NZ is largely based in poorer area's of the Country that struggle to attract funding & the game struggles to compete with Union. Then NRL makes millions in profit from NZ and reinvests nothing, while Australian states get grants some of that grant money comes from profit made from NZ... a cycle making the rich get richer & the poor tread water to keep afloat!

Edited by kiwis 13 6

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2 hours ago, kiwis 13 6 said:

I would like to know the yearly amounts the NRL grants to NSWRL & QRL & other states of Australia? In 25 years NZ Warriors have been in the competition NRL have made millions per year in Profit from NZ. The total amount granted by the NRL to NZRL in 25 years is $10,000 for 2015 NZ Schoolboys trip. After NSW & QLD, NZ is the NRL's next biggest market, revenue earner and source of playing talent. NRL makes some revenue from W.A, Victoria, S.A and N.T that amount is relatively small compared to NZ. You can count the current NRL players to come from W.A, Victoria and N.T on 2 hands! Rugby League in NZ is largely based in poorer area's of the Country that struggle to attract funding & the game struggles to compete with Union. Then NRL makes millions in profit from NZ and reinvests nothing, while Australian states get grants some of that grant money comes from profit made from NZ... a cycle making the rich get richer & the poor tread water to keep afloat!

To my point exactly. There is a conflict of interest. Whilst smarter brains like ours would easily understand the value in NZRL investment, but until the NRL/ARLC gets some sort of ownership of the game in NZ, the devil’s advocate in me does understand the idea that NZ should run themselves.

Give ownership of the sport in NZ and the rest of the pacific to the stewardship of the NRL or a renamed ARLC and you could expect the funding priorities change.

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2 hours ago, Sports Prophet said:

To my point exactly. There is a conflict of interest. Whilst smarter brains like ours would easily understand the value in NZRL investment, but until the NRL/ARLC gets some sort of ownership of the game in NZ, the devil’s advocate in me does understand the idea that NZ should run themselves.

Give ownership of the sport in NZ and the rest of the pacific to the stewardship of the NRL or a renamed ARLC and you could expect the funding priorities change.

Again this thread has nothing to do with NRL running the NZRL, thats never going to happen. This is about a possible NRL grant of revenue sourced in NZ from TV rights being reinvested into the sport in NZ. NRL dosnt have to give a grant but has definitely been very greedy making millions and not giving anything back to the community it makes money from in NZ. A grant would give the NRL some influence, goodwill and help retain & improve market share in a important market.

This 9's idea could be good if they can get some TV rights money to fund it even if it started out as 4 tournament competition it could feature likes of French residents side, NZ residents side, PNG, Fiji, USA, Jamaica, England etc and be another source of income for domestic player in those country to encourage people to choose to play the game in a wide range of countries.

 

Edited by kiwis 13 6
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This thread is somewhat about the NRL funding NZRL, so therefore my points are relevant.

It’s the role of the governing body to recruit, retain and develop players and officials. The NRL really owes NZRL nothing. 

It is however in the best interest of the NRL also to recruit, retain and develop players in the entire pacific, but until the NRL gets full directorship over how its funding is spent, then don’t expect NZRL to get much at all.
 

Edited by Sports Prophet
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27 minutes ago, Sports Prophet said:

This thread is somewhat about the NRL funding NZRL, so therefore my points are relevant.

It’s the role of the governing body to recruit, retain and develop players and officials. The NRL really owes NZRL nothing. 

It is however in the best interest of the NRL also to recruit, retain and develop players in the entire pacific, but until the NRL gets full directorship over how its funding is spent, then don’t expect NZRL to get much at all.
 

I don’t think you can safely say that NZRL would continue to receive government grants etc if they were under a foreign country’s body of control

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7 hours ago, kiwis 13 6 said:

I would like to know the yearly amounts the NRL grants to NSWRL & QRL & other states of Australia? In 25 years NZ Warriors have been in the competition NRL have made millions per year in Profit from NZ. The total amount granted by the NRL to NZRL in 25 years is $10,000 for 2015 NZ Schoolboys trip. After NSW & QLD, NZ is the NRL's next biggest market, revenue earner and source of playing talent. NRL makes some revenue from W.A, Victoria, S.A and N.T that amount is relatively small compared to NZ. You can count the current NRL players to come from W.A, Victoria and N.T on 2 hands! Rugby League in NZ is largely based in poorer area's of the Country that struggle to attract funding & the game struggles to compete with Union. Then NRL makes millions in profit from NZ and reinvests nothing, while Australian states get grants some of that grant money comes from profit made from NZ... a cycle making the rich get richer & the poor tread water to keep afloat!

Queensland RL gets around $18m Australian dollars in ARLC Funding per year.

NSWRL gets around $10m Australian dollars in ARLC Funding per year. 

Out of a total of $38m Funding to States.

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1 hour ago, DoubleD said:

I don’t think you can safely say that NZRL would continue to receive government grants etc if they were under a foreign country’s body of control

If they were under international governing body control they would. That’s my point. The NRL needs to become the international governing body for the sport in the Pacific.

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2 minutes ago, Sports Prophet said:

If they were under international governing body control they would. That’s my point. The NRL needs to become the international governing body for the sport in the Pacific.

It’s not at the moment though and so it’s a far fetched suggestion. The APRLC have that responsibility 

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2 minutes ago, DoubleD said:

It’s not at the moment though and so it’s a far fetched suggestion. The APRLC have that responsibility 

Far fetched in the way the NSWRL happened to expand their competition to become an international league?

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5 minutes ago, DoubleD said:

It’s not at the moment though and so it’s a far fetched suggestion. The APRLC have that responsibility 

Far fetched in the way northern rugby union clubs went on to form their own league and governance in the 1800s

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4 minutes ago, Sports Prophet said:

Far fetched in the way the NSWRL happened to expand their competition to become an international league?

Not really comparable in any way

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