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The General 'Toronto Wolfpack' Discussion Thread

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12 hours ago, CanadianRugger said:

DA likes the sport but also seems to think he can make money off it long term.

Reality is, the cost of entry is ridiculously low.  Expansion in most Major League Sports in NA is priced in the 100s of Millions of dollars now.

Vancouver and Montreal paid roughly $40 million each to join MLS a decade ago and would pay considerably more now.

Indeed they would, St Louis is paying 200 million US$ to join MLS, a twentyfold increase on what Toronto paid 23 years ago.

MLS is by far the least expensive major North American pro league to join, and Argyle's investment to date is peanuts compared to what that would cost anyone.

Edited by Big Picture

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6 minutes ago, TboneFromTO said:

Sigh. I know.  Tried to disguise it as a middle ground to get an agreement - seems to have not worked lol

There doesn't seem to be much middle ground left anymore. Just like everything else in our modern world. At least unlike politics every week the lads can go out to settle things.

I'm just waiting for the day when some game official makes a truly egarious call vs TWP and the 'they're out to get us' conspiracy types come out.

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Just now, Big Picture said:

Indeed they would, St Louis is paying 200 million US$ to join MLS, a tenfold increase on what Toronto paid 13 years ago.

MLS is by far the least expensive major North American pro league to join, and Argyle's investment to date is peanuts compared to what that would cost anyone.

i wonder if argyle offered up a decent license fee (say 10 or 20 million pounds) that they would be granted permanent exemption from relegation.

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3 minutes ago, aj1908 said:

i wonder if argyle offered up a decent license fee (say 10 or 20 million pounds) that they would be granted permanent exemption from relegation.

Just imagine how controversial that would be in the small time world of English RL.

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1 minute ago, Big Picture said:

Just imagine how controversial that would be in the small time world of English RL.

Bore off and go and bother others then.

Edited by Dave T
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6 hours ago, CanadianRugger said:

One of the MLR teams, Austin, already almost folded but was bought by the owner of fellow league rival, San Diego Legion who apparently has very deep pockets.

MLR is being run by business people and in order to own a team, you have to buy in to the league.   It is in fact one ownership group with their respective clubs being worth equal shares in the entire operation.

MLR is dirt cheap too, their franchise fee is well below the value of most minor league baseball franchises so it's definitely in the minor league category.

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8 hours ago, ojx said:

I can see the Arrows crowds growing slowly and steadily. MLR is very much an experiment in progress (but so are the TWP). However, it in conceivable that in 5-10 years MLR is commercially richer than Super League, and that would make TWP look like the poor cousin..They have already done well to get TSN, ESPN and NBC on board, even if they are probably paying peanuts. It is all about finding investors who can stay the course until a future lucrative TV deal. This is how it was for MLS.

The superior form of rugby definitely needs a league capable of following the same path as MLS and the other major North American pro leagues to profit for investors.

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22 minutes ago, aj1908 said:

i wonder if argyle offered up a decent license fee (say 10 or 20 million pounds) that they would be granted permanent exemption from relegation.

Hi!

Edited by aj1908

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1 minute ago, aj1908 said:

yes maybe but if the money was large enough they would jump at it imo.

maybe this is the way forward for cashed up expansion clubs.  and if the license fee is large enough perhaps they can then be more forceful about kick off times and other things.

in a cash strapped league, money will talk loudest imo

Why are you replying to yourself? 😮

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1 minute ago, Wildcat said:

Why are you replying to yourself? 😮

i clicked the wrong person lol

too much preworkout from the gym.

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18 minutes ago, Big Picture said:

Just imagine how controversial that would be in the small time world of English RL.

yes maybe but if the money was large enough they would jump at it imo.

maybe this is the way forward for cashed up expansion clubs.  and if the license fee is large enough perhaps they can then be more forceful about kick off times and other things.

in a cash strapped league, money will talk loudest imo

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1 minute ago, aj1908 said:

i clicked the wrong person lol

too much preworkout from the gym.

Hang about, didn't Parky make this 'mistake' once? :kolobok_biggrin:

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2 hours ago, TboneFromTO said:

@aj1908 @davet @Dave T   can we agree to a Middle ground that both the leagues and twp are doing their best to navigate the minefield of this exciting venture?  That's my view.  Both are trying and it will take a while to figure it out what works best

Edit sorry davet (no space) tagged the wrong one and it won't let me delete it!

It's not a minefield and bar actually letting them in the game could not have been less accommodating

Toronto play at a time which suits english clubs flights home, not because the alternative would be onerous or difficult or prohibitively expensive but because it's slightly easier

Toronto dont get their central funding, they dont get the TV revenue yet the NA tv revenue they were supposed to go out and get it isnt even possible to sell.

Toronto will play just under a quarter of their home games elsewhere because apparently playing slightly more fixtures in the summer is an impossible task

Toronto pay for the travel and accommodation of the other sides, something demanded of no other side. Despite not getting the funding other clubs do and many of their games being on sky, adding value to RL on sky and those games being broadcast at Torontos cost.

Torontos promotion wasnt even confirmed until very late last season as elstone et al stuck their thumb up their asses and quibbled and wibbled about nonsense

We Are a week in to the season and the powers that be have only just discovered that the salary cap doesnt work when set at such a low level for a transatlantic sport. 

Toronto pay for their games to be broadcast, the british game then gained value add from sky with extra games and toronto arent even allowed to schedule them for the most beneficial kick off.

Other than letting them in, the game has done nothing to accommodate them and has at times made it infinitely more difficult for Toronto to make a success of it.

Its following almost exactly the same path as the denver test in that whilst its happening it's only happening with huge part of the game trying to undermine it and putting as many barriers in place to try and make it fail so that when it does they can pat themselves on the back and say it was a stupid idea.in the first place.

If Argyle were to walk away I couldnt blame him. Either we are working with him to make it a success or we arent. And if we arent it's a waste of his money and our time. 

Edited by scotchy1
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8 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Hang about, didn't Parky make this 'mistake' once? :kolobok_biggrin:

if you mean the JBD thing maybe.  and i was the one suffering JBDs wrath.  

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Gonna be interesting who benefits most, players from Toronto stepping down to play or Rochdale players stepping up to play. When the Toronto players step down, where do the surplus Rochdale players then play?

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7 minutes ago, scotchy1 said:

It's not a minefield and bar actually letting them in the game could not have been less accommodating

Toronto play at a time which suits english clubs flights home, not because the alternative would be onerous or difficult or prohibitively expensive but because it's slightly easier

Toronto dont get their central funding, they dont get the TV revenue yet the NA tv revenue they were supposed to go out and get it isnt even possible to sell.

Toronto will play just under a quarter of their home games elsewhere because apparently playing slightly more fixtures in the summer is an impossible task

Toronto pay for the travel and accommodation of the other sides, something demanded of no other side. Despite not getting the funding other clubs do and many of their games being on sky, adding value to RL on sky and those games being broadcast at Torontos cost.

Torontos promotion wasnt even confirmed until very late last season as elstone et al stuck their thumb up their asses and quibbled and wibbled about nonsense

We Are a week in to the season and the powers that be have only just discovered that the salary cap doesnt work when set at such a low level for a transatlantic sport. 

Toronto pay for their games to be broadcast, the british game then gained value add from sky with extra games and toronto arent even allowed to schedule them for the most beneficial kick off.

Other than letting them in, the game has done nothing to accommodate them and has at times made it infinitely more difficult for Toronto to make a success of it.

Its following almost exactly the same path as the denver test in that whilst its happening it's only happening with huge part of the game trying to undermine it and putting as many barriers in place to try and make it fail so that when it does they can pat themselves on the back and say it was a stupid idea.in the first place.

If Argyle were to walk away I couldnt blame him. Either we are working with him to make it a success or we arent. And if we arent it's a waste of his money and our time. 

Further, Toronto still not full members of the League (GUEST) and still not allowed a vote...its sad is what it is.

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12 minutes ago, scotchy1 said:

It's not a minefield and bar actually letting them in the game could not have been less accommodating

Toronto play at a time which suits english clubs flights home, not because the alternative would be onerous or difficult or prohibitively expensive but because it's slightly easier

Toronto dont get their central funding, they dont get the TV revenue yet the NA tv revenue they were supposed to go out and get it isnt even possible to sell.

Toronto will play just under a quarter of their home games elsewhere because apparently playing slightly more fixtures in the summer is an impossible task

Toronto pay for the travel and accommodation of the other sides, something demanded of no other side. Despite not getting the funding other clubs do and many of their games being on sky, adding value to RL on sky and those games being broadcast at Torontos cost.

Torontos promotion wasnt even confirmed until very late last season as elstone et al stuck their thumb up their asses and quibbled and wibbled about nonsense

We Are a week in to the season and the powers that be have only just discovered that the salary cap doesnt work when set at such a low level for a transatlantic sport. 

Toronto pay for their games to be broadcast, the british game then gained value add from sky with extra games and toronto arent even allowed to schedule them for the most beneficial kick off.

Other than letting them in, the game has done nothing to accommodate them and has at times made it infinitely more difficult for Toronto to make a success of it.

Its following almost exactly the same path as the denver test in that whilst its happening it's only happening with huge part of the game trying to undermine it and putting as many barriers in place to try and make it fail so that when it does they can pat themselves on the back and say it was a stupid idea.in the first place.

If Argyle were to walk away I couldnt blame him. Either we are working with him to make it a success or we arent. And if we arent it's a waste of his money and our time. 

i agree with much of this.  i do think argyle is fairly pragmatic and not a snowflake type.

you also missed the whole drama with argyles poor attempt at humour last year and when he stood down as boss of the wolfpack

its similar to how koucash was treated when at salford.  its crazy the game tries to force these guys out of it.  we need them.

 

edit : that is such a good summary of the situation.  so well put. 

Edited by aj1908
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27 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Hang about, didn't Parky make this 'mistake' once? :kolobok_biggrin:

I think that was Harry replying to himself and when he got caught blamed it on his wife. 

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6 minutes ago, Michael1812 said:

I think that was Harry replying to himself and when he got caught blamed it on his wife. 

so dave was right then 

😀

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1 hour ago, scotchy1 said:

It's not a minefield and bar actually letting them in the game could not have been less accommodating

Toronto play at a time which suits english clubs flights home, not because the alternative would be onerous or difficult or prohibitively expensive but because it's slightly easier

Toronto dont get their central funding, they dont get the TV revenue yet the NA tv revenue they were supposed to go out and get it isnt even possible to sell.

Toronto will play just under a quarter of their home games elsewhere because apparently playing slightly more fixtures in the summer is an impossible task

Toronto pay for the travel and accommodation of the other sides, something demanded of no other side. Despite not getting the funding other clubs do and many of their games being on sky, adding value to RL on sky and those games being broadcast at Torontos cost.

Torontos promotion wasnt even confirmed until very late last season as elstone et al stuck their thumb up their asses and quibbled and wibbled about nonsense

We Are a week in to the season and the powers that be have only just discovered that the salary cap doesnt work when set at such a low level for a transatlantic sport. 

Toronto pay for their games to be broadcast, the british game then gained value add from sky with extra games and toronto arent even allowed to schedule them for the most beneficial kick off.

Other than letting them in, the game has done nothing to accommodate them and has at times made it infinitely more difficult for Toronto to make a success of it.

Its following almost exactly the same path as the denver test in that whilst its happening it's only happening with huge part of the game trying to undermine it and putting as many barriers in place to try and make it fail so that when it does they can pat themselves on the back and say it was a stupid idea.in the first place.

If Argyle were to walk away I couldnt blame him. Either we are working with him to make it a success or we arent. And if we arent it's a waste of his money and our time. 

Add: Brazen attempt to milk Toronto for half a million quid to participate in the Challenge Cup.

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When the Toronto players step down the Rochdale players leave the club and go back to their local amateur team where they will be welcomed and treat a hell of a lot better than they were at Rochdale. I see this as a real chance of the end of Rochdale, I hope not but I do not hold out much hope.

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13 minutes ago, Loup said:

Add: Brazen attempt to milk Toronto for half a million quid to participate in the Challenge Cup.

That isn't what a bond is.

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7 minutes ago, fairfolly said:

When the Toronto players step down the Rochdale players leave the club and go back to their local amateur team where they will be welcomed and treat a hell of a lot better than they were at Rochdale. I see this as a real chance of the end of Rochdale, I hope not but I do not hold out much hope.

Rochdale have had DR before haven't they?

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16 minutes ago, Dave T said:

That isn't what a bond is.

Not the point. No other club was asked for this.

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2 hours ago, Kayakman said:

Further, Toronto still not full members of the League (GUEST) and still not allowed a vote...its sad is what it is.

The most idiotic thing about this nonsense is it has left London still a member of SL.

The game has been so accommodating that they have a none SL club as a ln SL.shareholder to stop Toronto being so.

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