Why don't rugby league people in England receive knighthoods?

[Oxford]

You do get the feeling that if RL had a presence in every town from Lands End to the tip of Scotland and even in that bit of stolen Ireland that there would still be claims that it's a small sport and some fans still being apologetic for daring to think its sportmen and women worthy of the token and largely false gestures of a completely unmeritocratic system.

"Take you caps off inside, the pies've arrived!"

 

[Tommygilf]

23 hours ago, Oxford said:

You do get the feeling that if RL had a presence in every town from Lands End to the tip of Scotland and even in that bit of stolen Ireland that there would still be claims that it's a small sport and some fans still being apologetic for daring to think its sportmen and women worthy of the token and largely false gestures of a completely unmeritocratic system.

"Take you caps off inside, the pies've arrived!"

 

Quite the opposite, the regional (and Northern regional at that) nature of the sport is a hinderance with these things. 

[Oxford]

2 hours ago, Tommygilf said:

Quite the opposite, the regional (and Northern regional at that) nature of the sport is a hinderance with these things. 

I think you missed the thread of my post Tommy.

I said there are attitudes both inside and outside of the game that are so embedded that it wouldn't matter how much of the UK we gained a foothold in.

The question of silly knighthoods is just a reflection of the hierarchy of the system rather than the northerness of the sport.

When people stress our geographical footprint behind their reasong for a lack of recognition they have a tendency to ignore changes and growth on the one hand and that why great sportsmen and women are left out consistently like their achievements are insignificant and have no value.

To put this down simply to regionailty is to support the nonsense and failures of the system.

 

[Tommygilf]

2 minutes ago, Oxford said:

I think you missed the thread of my post Tommy.

I said there are attitudes both inside and outside of the game that are so embedded that it wouldn't matter how much of the UK we gained a foothold in.

The question of silly knighthoods is just a reflection of the hierarchy of the system rather than the northerness of the sport.

When people stress our geographical footprint behind their reasong for a lack of recognition they have a tendency to ignore changes and growth on the one hand and that why great sportsmen and women are left out consistently like their achievements are insignificant and have no value.

To put this down simply to regionailty is to support the nonsense and failures of the system.

We are a regional oddity even in the North though. Of the 5 big cities that culturally dominate the Region (Liverpool, Manchester, Sheffield, Leeds and Newcastle), we have a strong presence in 1. So even in the places in the north that have broken down barriers and stereotypes, we barely make a mark. Big fishes in small ponds.

How many Shinty players have been knighted?

[Oxford]

1 minute ago, Tommygilf said:

We are a regional oddity even in the North though. Of the 5 big cities that culturally dominate the Region (Liverpool, Manchester, Sheffield, Leeds and Newcastle), we have a strong presence in 1. So even in the places in the north that have broken down barriers and stereotypes, we barely make a mark. Big fishes in small ponds.

How many Shinty players have been knighted?

I have to say this is exactly what I was refering to.

1) We are marginally behind Cricket for bums on seats.

2) The viewing figures are very good and high enough to merit far greater coverage.

3) At the moment the footprint from Newcastle to Cornwall just in the professional side of the game.

These are just three examples that at least undermine the too regional argument. If people  from inside the sport don't see these things and won't argue the case it will prove those who make decisions about recognition correct.

If you won't argue the case for the sport you can only value  and support it's poor treatment. If you accept other people's notions about the things you love there is no point in loving them as your passions are considered worthless.

 

[Damien]

16 minutes ago, Oxford said:

3) At the moment the footprint from Newcastle to Cornwall just in the professional side of the game.

These are just three examples that at least undermine the too regional argument. If people  from inside the sport don't see these things and won't argue the case it will prove those who make decisions about recognition correct.

This really doesn't undermine that argument. You could travel from Newcastle to Cornwall and vast swathes of that route would have zero RL presence. An outpost setup in isolation doesn't make the sport any less regional in my opinion.

[Oxford]

2 minutes ago, Damien said:

This really doesn't undermine that argument. You could travel from Newcastle to Cornwall and vast swathes of that route would have zero RL presence. An outpost setup in isolation doesn't make the sport any less regional in my opinion.

 

19 minutes ago, Oxford said:

If you won't argue the case for the sport you can only value  and support it's poor treatment. If you accept other people's notions about the things you love there is no point in loving them as your passions are considered worthless.

 

[Toby Chopra]

22 minutes ago, Oxford said:

I have to say this is exactly what I was refering to.

1) We are marginally behind Cricket for bums on seats.

2) The viewing figures are very good and high enough to merit far greater coverage.

3) At the moment the footprint from Newcastle to Cornwall just in the professional side of the game.

These are just three examples that at least undermine the too regional argument. If people  from inside the sport don't see these things and won't argue the case it will prove those who make decisions about recognition correct.

If you won't argue the case for the sport you can only value  and support it's poor treatment. If you accept other people's notions about the things you love there is no point in loving them as your passions are considered worthless.

 

1. Partially agree: in the areas where the game is strongest our crowds are creditable, and we can make a decent claim to be a strong second after soccer. We need more locations like this. For me the debate is a about how and where. 

2. Our viewing figures are not "very good" they pretty much exactly reflect the level we sell our rights for, that of a second tier sport. Our rating, both on pay-TV and terrestrial nowhere near to that of soccer, or international cricket/union etc. If we merited "far greater coverage" we'd be getting it, there's no conspiracy to stop broadcasters. (I would also add weve just this year added a bunch more televised games on premier and C4 and Ourleague. When you add that to SL, CC, RLWC and NRL, we're not under-served.) 

3. Come on, thats really stretching it. Using two massively far flung outposts to claim that the game exists in between is just twisting the facts. I wish it were different, but RL just doesn't even enter people's consciousness in huge swathes of the south. We need to be honest about where we are starting from, if we're going to make improvements. 

 

[Oxford]

1 minute ago, Toby Chopra said:

Our viewing figures are not "very good" they pretty much exactly reflect the level we sell our rights for, that of a second tier sport.

I agree to some extent with what you say Toby but the viewing figures are much better than this statement suggests.

 

[Toby Chopra]

2 minutes ago, Oxford said:

I agree to some extent with what you say Toby but the viewing figures are much better than this statement suggests.

 

We average around 150k on Sky, which puts is on a par with Sky's NFL coverage and BT's (mediocre) rugby premiership figures.

On terrestrial we get, at very best, 1 mln which is less than union or cricket internationals, F1 etc. 

I'm not saying they are something to be embarrassed about - they're enough to secure us a core broadcast contract which underpins the game - but you can see where they slot in on the pecking order of sports. 

I assume increasing our TV ratings for SL/CC/Internationals will be a key target for IMG, as everything else commercially will have to come off the back of that. 

[Oxford]

11 minutes ago, Toby Chopra said:

I assume increasing our TV ratings for SL/CC/Internationals will be a key target for IMG, as everything else commercially will have to come off the back of that. 

And I assumed IMG would be engaging sponsors for the game as a whole.

If it means what I'm most suspicious of, I won't care either way.

 

[Toby Chopra]

6 minutes ago, Oxford said:

And I assumed IMG would be engaging sponsors for the game as a whole.

If it means what I'm most suspicious of, I won't care either way.

 

You wouldn't expext IMG to work getting the local builders on board for an NCL team, that's not what were paying thrm for. We need them to be engaging with blue chip and international sponsors and media, so we can start targeting the big bucks that we've been historically bad at doing. If that works, it should eventually benefit the whole game. 

[Oxford]

1 hour ago, Toby Chopra said:

You wouldn't expext IMG to work getting the local builders on board

I hesitated to say high level sponsors as I assumed you'd know I didn't mean Arkright's corner shop Trafford Road Salford.

[gingerjon]

2 hours ago, Damien said:

This really doesn't undermine that argument. You could travel from Newcastle to Cornwall and vast swathes of that route would have zero RL presence. An outpost setup in isolation doesn't make the sport any less regional in my opinion.

West Wales will have travelled the 255 miles to Cornwall RLFC today and, assuming google maps is correct, will have done so without passing through a single town that has a senior rugby league team.

[Oxford]

"Accentuate the negative,

Ignore the affirmative,

Latch on to disadvantages  ........"

 

[Derwent]

Lockers has been given an OBE in the Jubilee honours list.

[Dallas Mead]

The class system.  Lock the thread.

[Oxford]

15 hours ago, Derwent said:

Lockers has been given an OBE in the Jubilee honours list.

Good we can file it under TGG mentions like seeing a poster for the game on Corrie!

Edited June 2 by Oxford

[Oxford]

15 hours ago, Dallas Mead said:

The class system.  Lock the thread.

The common knowledge on here insists this no longer exists so locking the thread would be a bit silly. Although quite a few seemed to have been locked "on suspicion" so you might be right.

[Oxford]

Why don't rugby league people in England receive knighthoods?

Because then they'd be allowed in the House of Lords and ........

Tony Blair would have to talk to oiks and the votes might not go right and the world, as we know it, would come to an end, and then where would we be?

Edited June 3 by Oxford

[Copa]

Peter V’landys had lunch with the Queen at Windsor castle this week. It’s his horse racing background that got him an invite.