Sat 21st May: SL: Hull Kingston Rovers v Catalans Dragons KO 12:30 (Channel 4)

[meast]

4 hours ago, Rach said:

Who makes the decision that the a player needs to leave the field for a HIA? 

In the 1st half Tompkins spent some time on the floor after a knee to the head but didn't leave the field where as Stourton's reaction seemed far less but was immediately off.. 

Not a suggestion of any wrong doing, just genuinely interested. 

The doctor, based on their initial assessments.

[meast]

3 hours ago, Hull Kingston Bronco said:

I normally hate the moaning at refs, but he’s genuinely having a ‘mare here today

What did he do wrong?

[Dallas Mead]

Tomkins was awesome for Catalans, good win for them.

[meast]

45 minutes ago, Hull Kingston Bronco said:

No not at all. I was pleased with Rovers performance, and we’re accountable for our result which was a fair one. However, Catalans consistently slowed the ruck with very little limitation by the ref, and more importantly you could see their left edge consistently offside but not seen (harder to spot on the telly as usually out of frame). Refs aren’t biased, but sometimes one team effectively play to their weakness in some areas, and we saw that today. It’s one reason why I’d like the 4th official in the stand, where they could highlight misreads like that and coach adjustments. 

Could I make a couple of suggestions based on my knowledge on how the match officials work and by watching the game?

I say to this our fans to who gripe about the refs.

First, by winning the initial collisions, the team on top gets to be dominant in the tackle, it may appear that they are slowing the ruck and the ref is letting them, but they are allowed a bit of extra time in the tackle, the idea is for the other side to start winning the collision, where they too will be afforded more time at the tackle.

Second, if the players out of camera shot are stood offside, that suggests that they aren't going to be involved in the current passage of play, the touch judge will communicate to the referee if anyone is offside and likely to interfere, hence the referee calling out players who would likely be involved in the play, a referee rarely calls out anyone on the other side of the field unless the play is likely to reach him before the attack gets past the advantage.

The only misreads are usually from spectators in the stand who have a biased view of proceedings, a referee doesn't.

Again, as I say to our own fans, if we are losing the penalty count and being penalised for holding down etc it's because we are under the cosh and trying to cut corners, it's not the referee cheating or anything.

Rovers offered very little today but clung on when it could have got nasty, they were cutting corners and conceding penalties to try and disrupt Catalans because they had lost the battle, and the game.

The ref was fine.

[Hull Kingston Bronco]

1 hour ago, meast said:

Could I make a couple of suggestions based on my knowledge on how the match officials work and by watching the game?

I say to this our fans to who gripe about the refs.

First, by winning the initial collisions, the team on top gets to be dominant in the tackle, it may appear that they are slowing the ruck and the ref is letting them, but they are allowed a bit of extra time in the tackle, the idea is for the other side to start winning the collision, where they too will be afforded more time at the tackle.

Second, if the players out of camera shot are stood offside, that suggests that they aren't going to be involved in the current passage of play, the touch judge will communicate to the referee if anyone is offside and likely to interfere, hence the referee calling out players who would likely be involved in the play, a referee rarely calls out anyone on the other side of the field unless the play is likely to reach him before the attack gets past the advantage.

The only misreads are usually from spectators in the stand who have a biased view of proceedings, a referee doesn't.

Again, as I say to our own fans, if we are losing the penalty count and being penalised for holding down etc it's because we are under the cosh and trying to cut corners, it's not the referee cheating or anything.

Rovers offered very little today but clung on when it could have got nasty, they were cutting corners and conceding penalties to try and disrupt Catalans because they had lost the battle, and the game.

The ref was fine.

I understand all of the above, but respectfully, you weren’t at the match so wouldn’t have been able to see the areas of the field I could, and are wrong. The reason the left issue edge was irritating is that Litten regularly went to our right edge having feigned r left, so the defenders who’d encroached were indeed active. It was deliberate, perfectly rational decision making by Catalans on the basis of ref behaviour.
 

I don’t say the ref is bent, or incompetent, or any of the other one-eyed nonsense you get on here, but that he was having a ‘mare because he got played by a defensive team that was cleverer in that area than he was - and it was avoidable  

 

 

[ATLANTISMAN]

1 hour ago, Hull Kingston Bronco said:

I understand all of the above, but respectfully, you weren’t at the match so wouldn’t have been able to see the areas of the field I could, and are wrong. The reason the left issue edge was irritating is that Litten regularly went to our right edge having feigned r left, so the defenders who’d encroached were indeed active. It was deliberate, perfectly rational decision making by Catalans on the basis of ref behaviour.
 

I don’t say the ref is bent, or incompetent, or any of the other one-eyed nonsense you get on here, but that he was having a ‘mare because he got played by a defensive team that was cleverer in that area than he was - and it was avoidable  

 

 

I was there and a spot on comment:)

[Dallas Mead]

6 hours ago, Loiner said:

I really like the Channel 4 presentation, Clive Wilson and Kyle Amor did a fantastic job today. Also like to here Kevin Brown when he's on. Keep up the good work.

Mark Wilson mate.

[daz39]

3 hours ago, meast said:

What did he do wrong?

Made them lose, obviously

[meast]

15 hours ago, Hull Kingston Bronco said:

I understand all of the above, but respectfully, you weren’t at the match so wouldn’t have been able to see the areas of the field I could, and are wrong. The reason the left issue edge was irritating is that Litten regularly went to our right edge having feigned r left, so the defenders who’d encroached were indeed active. It was deliberate, perfectly rational decision making by Catalans on the basis of ref behaviour.
 

I don’t say the ref is bent, or incompetent, or any of the other one-eyed nonsense you get on here, but that he was having a ‘mare because he got played by a defensive team that was cleverer in that area than he was - and it was avoidable  

 

 

Fair do's, but if the play is at the opposite side of the field, then they can't be involved in that play?

It's also the TJ's that call offside so not sure how a team can be cleverer than a ref?

[Hull Kingston Bronco]

13 minutes ago, meast said:

Fair do's, but if the play is at the opposite side of the field, then they can't be involved in that play?

It's also the TJ's that call offside so not sure how a team can be cleverer than a ref?

The ref leads the team, he’s accountable. I’m talking about defenders on the left edge being offside, systematically (because they saw it wasn’t policed), who then made tackles when the play switched. They were active. 
 

Litten is accountable for still repeatedly switching it after he could see the defensive position, but to be fair had a reasonable expectation it would be penalised the first couple of times at least, even if afterwards it was naive.
 

It was a very specific thing I thought the ref was failing at, hence why I said he was having a ‘mare. I get the challenges of lateral vision at ground level - that’s why I suggested the 4th official in the stands would help. 

[Liverpool Rover]

It was a good effort from Rovers but we are missing Lewis IMO. Also Rovers need to start attacking more from deep as they line up too flat.

[meast]

15 minutes ago, Hull Kingston Bronco said:

The ref leads the team, he’s accountable. I’m talking about defenders on the left edge being offside, systematically (because they saw it wasn’t policed), who then made tackles when the play switched. They were active. 
 

Litten is accountable for still repeatedly switching it after he could see the defensive position, but to be fair had a reasonable expectation it would be penalised the first couple of times at least, even if afterwards it was naive.
 

It was a very specific thing I thought the ref was failing at, hence why I said he was having a ‘mare. I get the challenges of lateral vision at ground level - that’s why I suggested the 4th official in the stands would help. 

If play has switched then Rovers have used the advantage the offside then becomes void until the next tackle.

It's just opinion and conjecture really, I didn't think the referee did anything wrong, you did, but your team lost, that's usually how it goes, fans don't ever mention things their own team did but only the opposition.

[Hull Kingston Bronco]

39 minutes ago, meast said:

If play has switched then Rovers have used the advantage the offside then becomes void until the next tackle.

It's just opinion and conjecture really, I didn't think the referee did anything wrong, you did, but your team lost, that's usually how it goes, fans don't ever mention things their own team did but only the opposition.

No, I hear you, but here I’m talking about a dummy half feigning left to a decoy blind side play (that Rovers do run live a lot) and then passing right. Not the advantage scenario you describe. It’s cool tho, like you say we’ve done this to death now

[Loiner]

On 21/05/2022 at 21:53, Dallas Mead said:

Mark Wilson mate.

Really I'm sure it said Clive. Never mind he did a great job, well done Mark.