Is SL set for improved crowds and a higher profile in 2017?

[Exiled Wiganer]

Wigan are on course for 10k season tickets, after a significant price hike last year. We will also take 10s of thousands to OT. Which leaves home cup games (which are outside the scope of this thread) and a single semi final. I think that having the top 4 play off is a brilliant idea, and a huge step forward from the last 8s.

With the current set up, then the question remains whether individual clubs will be able to attract more fans.

 

Wigan have managed it. I am guessing that Leeds will again lead the way. Wire seemed to have got their act together big time off the field last year. By the sound of it, the Giants are on course for an increase. Despite a lack of interest in watching games in Hull, am guessing FC's will be up, though losing their derby may negate any increase in season tickets. Presumably, Leigh will be buoyant, though whether they can match HKR's crowds is somewhat doubtful. At least they have a derby to look forward to... Catalans seem pretty rock solid from this side of the water.

 

Saints have already dropped to their natural level below us, but presumably are unlikely to drop again? Cas seemed to be on the up - and well deserved - so more of the same? God knows, Powell and co deserve it.

 

I don't know enough about Widnes, Trinity and Salford to get a sense of optimism or pessimism. Surely they can't go any lower?

 

Looking at this on a club by club basis makes me think that in fact the ratio of local marketing to general RL brand awareness is probably 90:10.

 

One thread we never see is one praising the RFL and clubs for making Newcastle as the venue for magic week end such a success. I predict 70k next year.

[Scubby]

One thread we never see is one praising the RFL and clubs for making Newcastle as the venue for magic week end such a success. I predict 70k next year.

 

This for me is only a partial success. The Saturday crowds have been excellent but Sunday's have been very disappointing. This has happened at pretty much every magic over the last 5-6 years.

[Dave T]

This for me is only a partial success. The Saturday crowds have been excellent but Sunday's have been very disappointing. This has happened at pretty much every magic over the last 5-6 years.

in the strategy doc one of their targets is to sell out Day 1 of Magic. They have missed this by some distance so far, I think the positivity around Nrwcastle gives this event the chance of growth thougj.

[Exiled Wiganer]

Scubby, I don't want to go down the parky patrionising route, but you can be inclined to spot missed opportunities where others might say "good effort". Which is healthy in a not accepting second best way, but they have at least got magic on an upward trajectory.

[sweaty craiq]

All things being equal elsewhere I would expect a slight increase in crowds this year due to Leigh being in the competition.  You can throw a blanket over Wigan, Widnes, Saints, Wire and Salford so to add in Leigh to that and remove HKR should mean that probably all attendances at those matches - home and away, would be greater than if HKR were playing.  Even if you accept that HKR are a bigger club.  Obviously that increase would need to be off-set against any reduction in Yorkshire but I think it would be greater. 

 

So my view would be that Leigh will be a net contributor to increases in attendances for 2017.

 

The caveat being relative success of course.  If Leigh bomb (and I don't think they will) then that might see attendances stay the same.

My thoughts also, we will come at somewhere between 6-8000 average depending on how we start, season tickets will be about 4000, we don't do memberships, Wigan forum are looking for a 22k gate against us expecting 5000 to travel over

[Scubby]

Scubby, I don't want to go down the parky patrionising route, but you can be inclined to spot missed opportunities where others might say "good effort". Which is healthy in a not accepting second best way, but they have at least got magic on an upward trajectory.

 

Seeing Newcastle with 40k+ in is great and a big success, but then seeing barely 20k turn up for the Sunday means that Magic withers away rather than comes to an exciting climax. I would actually look at creating 2 magic Saturdays. Newcastle would still sell over 40k with 3 Saturday fixtures IMO. There would then be another opportunity for the other 3 fixtures to take place on a second Magic Saturday at another venue (whether that be Etihad or somewhere else) a few weeks later. You are not pitching to the same fans as there are different clubs playing.

 

The magic weekend creates some great highs but we are lying if we don't have a large element of club fans turning up for their game and sodding off shortly after. I would love to know what proportion of tickets are sold for the whole weekend compared with day trippers. We can have the best of both worlds with 2xMagic Saturdays.

[sweaty craiq]

Think we should have a magic Tuesday in the school hols

[yipyee]

Seeing Newcastle with 40k+ in is great and a big success, but then seeing barely 20k turn up for the Sunday means that Magic withers away rather than comes to an exciting climax. I would actually look at creating 2 magic Saturdays. Newcastle would still sell over 40k with 3 Saturday fixtures IMO. There would then be another opportunity for the other 3 fixtures to take place on a second Magic Saturday at another venue (whether that be Etihad or somewhere else) a few weeks later. You are not pitching to the same fans as there are different clubs playing.

The magic weekend creates some great highs but we are lying if we don't have a large element of club fans turning up for their game and sodding off shortly after. I would love to know what proportion of tickets are sold for the whole weekend compared with day trippers. We can have the best of both worlds with 2xMagic Saturdays.

You could be onto something there...only have magic days on same weekend...different venue!

Sat at Newcastle

Sunday at whoever has the best bid!

I would also charge venues a fee for hosting but they get to keep all profits...

That way all marketing etc would be done for free!

[nonbelievers]

 

One thread we never see is one praising the RFL and clubs for making Newcastle as the venue for magic week end such a success. I predict 70k next year.

 

Hull FC v HKR was a draw-card game last year....this years Sunday line up won't get close to last years figures with the French, Huddersfield, Salford and Leigh hardly renowned for travelling in great numbers...although Leeds being on last will help.

I agree though...Magic Weekend is a great success story!

[Lobbygobbler]

Hull FC v HKR was a draw-card game last year....this years Sunday line up won't get close to last years figures with the French, Huddersfield, Salford and Leigh hardly renowned for travelling in great numbers...although Leeds being on last will help.

I agree though...Magic Weekend is a great success story!

Since when did Leigh play at the Magic weekend? I reckon you'll find we'll be in the "top 6" of best supported clubs there

[Dave T]

 

but we are lying if we don't have a large element of club fans turning up for their game and sodding off shortly after. I would love to know what proportion of tickets are sold for the whole weekend compared with day trippers. 

I think we need to be careful of making statements like that. Your second line is very important. The 2nd day is always lower (apart from 1 year in Manchester) but there is often a decent amount of people who were there the day before. Even if you assume this is around 5-8k, then you are risking a market of less than 20k for an event elsewhere. You would also reduce the crowd of the first day as there will have been fans there from Day 2 teams.

 

The opportunity is that you could try and attract local fans from two cities, say Newcastle and Coventry, but you are increasing costs for possible smaller crowds. 

[Scubby]

I think we need to be careful of making statements like that. Your second line is very important. The 2nd day is always lower (apart from 1 year in Manchester) but there is often a decent amount of people who were there the day before. Even if you assume this is around 5-8k, then you are risking a market of less than 20k for an event elsewhere. You would also reduce the crowd of the first day as there will have been fans there from Day 2 teams.

 

The opportunity is that you could try and attract local fans from two cities, say Newcastle and Coventry, but you are increasing costs for possible smaller crowds. 

 

Or you could say that this event has been treading water for over a decade and it needs a fresh approach. My view is that 6 games over two days is indulgent (we even had 7 at one point FFS). If it was selling out both days then fine but last year there was a huge difference in crowds from the Saturday to the Sunday. This tells us that things need to be changed. Events like this shouldn't wither and die on day 2 it should build up to a climax.

 

My view is that less 'day' fans travel on a Sunday and the people who buy tickets for both days could be a low as 5-6k and even then those fans may watch one game on the Sunday and drift home. If you had 2x Magic Saturdays six weeks apart then you have the potential to create an extra city RL event. If I gave any marketing team 10 years to prove a concept and they were delivering the same result then you would either question their credentials or question the product.

 

We are a quality product we don't need a pile it high sell it cheap approach. We are trying to pack 12 hours of RL into 2 days and we are not getting 10s of thousands of people biting our hands off - particularly on the Sunday.

[Dave T]

Or you could say that this event has been treading water for over a decade and it needs a fresh approach. My view is that 6 games over two days is indulgent (we even had 7 at one point FFS). If it was selling out both days then fine but last year there was a huge difference in crowds from the Saturday to the Sunday. This tells us that things need to be changed. Events like this shouldn't wither and die on day 2 it should build up to a climax.

 

My view is that less 'day' fans travel on a Sunday and the people who buy tickets for both days could be a low as 5-6k and even then those fans may watch one game on the Sunday and drift home. If you had 2x Magic Saturdays six weeks apart then you have the potential to create an extra city RL event. If I gave any marketing team 10 years to prove a concept and they were delivering the same result then you would either question their credentials or question the product.

 

We are a quality product we don't need a pile it high sell it cheap approach. We are trying to pack 12 hours of RL into 2 days and we are not getting 10s of thousands of people biting our hands off - particularly on the Sunday.

I have been as critical of the small growth of Magic as anyone, but we need to be very careful with making rash decisions on the future of it.

 

The first 5 years averaged 58,796, the last 5 years has averaged 65,284 - an 11% increase. The last one was 16% higher than the first one. We are 31% higher than our low in 2010.

 

So whilst we can do much better (and the RFL agree with that as they have set a target of a Saturday sellout) we should acknowledge that the event is growing. Based on it being one of the few RL events that is growing, imho it would be perverse to split it up now.

 

Part of the attraction is that it is a weekend, and that all of the fans are there, not half of them. I have been to most of them, and most times to both days, and I know plenty others who are the same. I think the lows of the Sunday are overstated - although I genuinely don't get why we have moved away from the Bank Holiday weekend.

 

As a starter for 10, moving the event to two cities loses those 'weekend' fans - meaning that your crowd would be down at the very start. You need to have confidence that you would make those fans up - and tbh, to make it worthwhile, you would have to be confident of filling both grounds.

 

The Newcastle event would lose fans (literally not a single reason why it would go up under your proposal) - and the Sunday crowd may be slightly higher as it is moved to a Saturday and moved to be more of a 'main event' - but you will have lost the weekend crowd, so may end up just netting off.

 

You'd probably end up with 30k at both.