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Why is Sneyd not England's lead half back - Part 2

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Scubby

Scubby

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13 minutes ago, Roy Boy said:

Sneyd in an England shirt? Why the very thought is as daft as giving Watts a shot!

If Watts wasn't so daft on many occasions he would have had his shot long ago. He is starting to get some consistency to his game now which is good.

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Scubby

Scubby

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1 hour ago, Ant said:

Go back and watch that cup game again. Watch how much involvement Sneyd has...

He is instrumental in winning that game. He is first receiver in almost all cases and steers Hull up field all day.

90% of the game isn't that finishing play but the build up and pressure applied to the opposition - and Sneyd did that to wigan masterfully.

 

Big game player, 2x Lance Todd winner. Oh and a very good goal kicker too...

I have just watched the first 15 minutes of the cup final. In the first 6 sets Sneyd took the ball as first receiver just once. Most of the time he is standing 3 or 4 men out from the play the ball.

Ouside of kicks he touched the ball just twice. He passed to another player once and went himself once. He kicked at the end of every set except one. So I really don't know what game you were watching? When Hull are driving up field he doesn't get involved hardly at all. He is stood 3rd or 4th man out. Good player to Hull's system yes but very limited.

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Lowdesert

Lowdesert

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It would be interesting to see what legacy the WC brings about.  We are certainly short of any form of trial system or Tour type fixtures, when a player, in this case half back, is picked for friendlies or part of a tour 'midweek team'.  Knights would have helped, but we will always be on the back foot if any form of international team 'trial' isn't available.

I think Legacy is part of the RFLs duty after the WC and I'm sceptical they will deliver anything of significance.

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Scubby

Scubby

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Just now, Lowdesert said:

It would be interesting to see what legacy the WC brings about.  We are certainly short of any form of trial system or Tour type fixtures, when a player, in this case half back, is picked for friendlies or part of a tour 'midweek team'.  Knights would have helped, but we will always be on the back foot if any form of international team 'trial' isn't available.

I think Legacy is part of the RFLs duty after the WC and I'm sceptical they will deliver anything of significance.

You are right there. I am as interested in what Dutton and the RLWC 2021 team have got planned for 2022 and 2023 as I am the tournament itself. The legacy of the last successful World Cup was to play even less games - bonkers! It gives us absolutely no chance to look at people and prepare.

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Lowdesert

Lowdesert

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Watts, imo, is good enough for England.  Daft or not, other international teams have had similar players who are game changers - Fifita, Mason are two that spring to mind.  Barring Sam Burgess we have no one else.  As an impact player he can create something.

Larder and Reilly preached a good kicking game.  Difficult to pre empt where the backs going to go/bounce, difficult to field if pressure applied.  Sneyd could bring some of that.  He's reliable, not easily ruffled.  What player has been as cool playing at Wembley, bar Kenny?  If we're selecting on form, he has to be in with a shout......but WB won't select him because he doesn't know him or had him in the squad.

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Scubby

Scubby

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5 minutes ago, Lowdesert said:

Watts, imo, is good enough for England.  Daft or not, other international teams have had similar players who are game changers - Fifita, Mason are two that spring to mind.  Barring Sam Burgess we have no one else.  As an impact player he can create something.

Larder and Reilly preached a good kicking game.  Difficult to pre empt where the backs going to go/bounce, difficult to field if pressure applied.  Sneyd could bring some of that.  He's reliable, not easily ruffled.  What player has been as cool playing at Wembley, bar Kenny?  If we're selecting on form, he has to be in with a shout......but WB won't select him because he doesn't know him or had him in the squad.

Again I like Sneyd but let's remember he was substituted in the first half of the 2014 Wembley Cup final for Cas. He was awful in the first half of the final against Warrington. He is not a bossing half back who will command the ball at first receiver from minute one. He can do a job with a good kicking game but offers no threat with ball in hand or speed to follow a half break.

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GaryO

GaryO

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On 27/08/2017 at 9:07 PM, DavidM said:

My spine would be Hardaker , Widdop , Gale , Hodgson , Sam ... but Bennett not picking him at fullback in May would be a worry for Zak

I would take a leaf out of the Aussie book for the 1, 7, and 9, Hardacre, Gale, McShane, 

"If Rugby League had never been Invented, today we would only have Rugby League"

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GaryO

GaryO

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On 28/08/2017 at 10:51 AM, westhuller said:

He's played the two best half's in SL apparently and tactically out played them out thought them and out kicked them in massive knockout games. He does it every time, time after time what he has to do is a mystery to get an England start to me 

A bit like the Lee Briers and Paul Cooke scenario, both the most creative 6's we had at the time but both overlooked by numerous coaches.

"If Rugby League had never been Invented, today we would only have Rugby League"

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DavidM

DavidM

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14 minutes ago, GaryO said:

I would take a leaf out of the Aussie book for the 1, 7, and 9, Hardacre, Gale, McShane, 

Do you think mcshane will get that second hooker spot ... indeed will he take one ?

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GaryO

GaryO

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6 minutes ago, DavidM said:

Do you think mcshane will get that second hooker spot ... indeed will he take one ?

No I don't think he will, but not because he has not earned it with his performances this season and especially with his link play with Gale. BUT saying that he is in the train on squad and if Cas go on to win the GF it can't do his chances any harm at all.

"If Rugby League had never been Invented, today we would only have Rugby League"

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Davo5

Davo5

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3 minutes ago, Saint 1 said:

Do you not think the Aussies pick Slater, Cronk and Smith because they are the 3 best players in those positions? 

Absolutely,the fact they also play together for Qld and the Storm is a massive bonus,you can't really compare  Hardaker,Gale & McShane to them.

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GaryO

GaryO

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1 hour ago, Saint 1 said:

I agree it's a bonus. I just don't think that we should pick players for the sake of club combinations except when it's neck and neck between two players anyway. 

On performances over the season I would say Hardacre is the best FB, Gale with no peers at 7, and McShane has performed as well as most and would be neck and neck with any other 9.

Plus the luxury of regularly playing together, no brainer.

"If Rugby League had never been Invented, today we would only have Rugby League"

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GaryO

GaryO

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2 hours ago, Davo5 said:

Absolutely,the fact they also play together for Qld and the Storm is a massive bonus,you can't really compare  Hardaker,Gale & McShane to them.

That may be very true, but they still are as good as anything we can offer.

"If Rugby League had never been Invented, today we would only have Rugby League"

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Lowdesert

Lowdesert

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2 hours ago, GaryO said:

On performances over the season I would say Hardacre is the best FB, Gale with no peers at 7, and McShane has performed as well as most and would be neck and neck with any other 9.

Plus the luxury of regularly playing together, no brainer.

Familiarity makes a huge difference imo.  Remember Gregory once saying, he didn't look where the support was, sometimes, just put the ball into space.  Thurston, Cronk, Smith have that.

i can't see McShane displacing Hodgson though.

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roughyedspud

roughyedspud

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On 27/08/2017 at 2:26 PM, bobbruce said:

I'd imagine he will be in the squad ahead of Brown this year. As someone mentioned earlier this is why England need more games so we can play around with combinations. 

And that's what the England knights did!

OLDHAM RLFC

the 8TH most successful team in british RL

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Ant

Ant

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19 hours ago, GaryO said:

On performances over the season I would say Hardacre is the best FB, Gale with no peers at 7, and McShane has performed as well as most and would be neck and neck with any other 9.

Plus the luxury of regularly playing together, no brainer.

Frankly. Rubbish 

 

Hardacre I'll agree had been excellent and I'd pick as first choice at FB, but he hasn't shown his club form in internationals yet 

Gale with no peers? Ha! He is looking good in a team running red hot that's for sure. I'd still play Brough ahead of him if that option hadn't been burned in favour of another "amazing" Cas halfback 

McShane is bang average. 

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Ant

Ant

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14 minutes ago, DavidM said:

we could say a few need to turn up in internationals . They always build Watkins up only for him to have problems even catching a ball

To be fair he has that in league games too. And he is not too keen on passing 

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Davc1h

Davc1h

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4 hours ago, Ant said:

Frankly. Rubbish 

 

Hardacre I'll agree had been excellent and I'd pick as first choice at FB, but he hasn't shown his club form in internationals yet 

Gale with no peers? Ha! He is looking good in a team running red hot that's for sure. I'd still play Brough ahead of him if that option hadn't been burned in favour of another "amazing" Cas halfback 

McShane is bang average. 

You really do need to open the other eye.

FWIW I think Sneyd's kicking game should get him the nod over Gale even though no other part of his game is as good.

As Hull have shown, an excellent kicking game can win you the big games.

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