Boxing

[Maximus Decimus]

9 hours ago, StandOffHalf said:

I had the last round level as well. They were both pretty gun-shy and stand-offish in that one as the clock ran out. I gave a couple more rounds to Ngannou but it was one of those ones where Fury by a couple or a draw would have been understandable.

All the moaning from MMA quarters is because they are applying MMA scoring metrics to this fight (significant strikes, damage, control). Points-fighting is what got Fury over the line.

Like Fury in the first Wilder fight, Francis is very much the moral victor here. One judge giving him the nod is a big win for him. 

Against a pressure fighter (Chisora might angle for a shot at him), Francis might be in for a a more challenging boxing experience. He did really well on the night and, as an MMA fan, I was massively proud of him.

This is a good point about the different way of scoring. Personally, I would prefer something like this myself. I know the sport is boxing but it's also a fight, and hurting the opponent should be factored in better IMO as should effective punches. That's why I thought calling Fury-Wilder 1 a robbery wasn't quite right; he had after all been on the canvas twice and in serious trouble. I've also seen plenty of other fights where I've felt like they didn't really win the fight but output gave it to them, like Hopkins-Calzaghe. In that fight, all the effective punches were Hopkins IMO.

I'm going to be controversial and say that Fury didn't actually look that bad in hindsight. He had a couple of main problems IMO, firstly he wasn't hurting Ngannou at all and secondly Ngannou was heavy-handed. This resulted in Fury's feints and big punches having basically no effect and Ngannou was clearly hurting him, making him reluctant to commit. Compare this to Fury-Wilder, where he knew from minute one of fight one to be wary of his big punches. He trained and prepared to stay away from getting hit but didn't with Ngannou. If they fought again, he would no doubt be lighter and just do an AJ-Ruiz 2 on him. 

I don't want to do Ngannou a disservice, but it wasn't massively dissimilar to how Joe Joyce used to have some success. Fighter's would hit him with everything and he would just keep coming, before eventually getting demoralised and letting Joyce have success.

IMO Ngannou would be trouble for anybody that is quite big and slow with limited power. He'd be trouble for a Chisora or Whyte etc. A bad fight for him would be Wilder (at boxing) IMO. You can have the greatest chin in the world but if he can land it, and he would against Ngannou, then you're going down. I also think AJ and Usyk would find beating him easy now as they they know what to expect and would come up with a game plan to win. 

 

[StandOffHalf]

1 hour ago, Maximus Decimus said:

This is a good point about the different way of scoring. Personally, I would prefer something like this myself. I know the sport is boxing but it's also a fight, and hurting the opponent should be factored in better IMO as should effective punches. That's why I thought calling Fury-Wilder 1 a robbery wasn't quite right; he had after all been on the canvas twice and in serious trouble. I've also seen plenty of other fights where I've felt like they didn't really win the fight but output gave it to them, like Hopkins-Calzaghe. In that fight, all the effective punches were Hopkins IMO.

I'm going to be controversial and say that Fury didn't actually look that bad in hindsight. He had a couple of main problems IMO, firstly he wasn't hurting Ngannou at all and secondly Ngannou was heavy-handed. This resulted in Fury's feints and big punches having basically no effect and Ngannou was clearly hurting him, making him reluctant to commit. Compare this to Fury-Wilder, where he knew from minute one of fight one to be wary of his big punches. He trained and prepared to stay away from getting hit but didn't with Ngannou. If they fought again, he would no doubt be lighter and just do an AJ-Ruiz 2 on him. 

I don't want to do Ngannou a disservice, but it wasn't massively dissimilar to how Joe Joyce used to have some success. Fighter's would hit him with everything and he would just keep coming, before eventually getting demoralised and letting Joyce have success.

IMO Ngannou would be trouble for anybody that is quite big and slow with limited power. He'd be trouble for a Chisora or Whyte etc. A bad fight for him would be Wilder (at boxing) IMO. You can have the greatest chin in the world but if he can land it, and he would against Ngannou, then you're going down. I also think AJ and Usyk would find beating him easy now as they they know what to expect and would come up with a game plan to win. 

 

I agree that Wilder would be a bad boxing match-up for Francis, but I'd quite fancy his chances against AJ.

I wouldn't be surprised if we saw Joe Joyce or Chisora up against Ngannou next.

I agree that Fury wasn't terrible. We've seen him box his way to victory before and manage an opponent without looking spectacular.

[Maximus Decimus]

2 hours ago, StandOffHalf said:

I agree that Wilder would be a bad boxing match-up for Francis, but I'd quite fancy his chances against AJ.

I wouldn't be surprised if we saw Joe Joyce or Chisora up against Ngannou next.

I agree that Fury wasn't terrible. We've seen him box his way to victory before and manage an opponent without looking spectacular.

I think there was just such a shock that Fury wasn't winning easy.

But that's down to Ngannou doing way better than anticipated. If you treat it as Fury being up against a rock-solid big puncher, he doesn't look that different than usual. Like I said, if he'd known what he was in for he probably would have won easy.

Oddly enough, Ngannou might be the biggest draw in boxing right now. Everybody is going to want to see if it was a one off. He's simply too big for Joyce or Chisora. If he boxes again, it'll be one of the big 4. I could defo see a rematch with Fury happening.

 

[Maximus Decimus]

Things only get worse for Fury. Strong rumours that the PPV sales for the crossover fight were terrible. I've heard 70,000 but as few as 10,000 reported for the US. For some perspective, Mayweather-McGregor got 4.6m.

When I was in the states recently, the fight was being advertised on FTA TV. That can't have been cheap.

Judging from Twitter and the like, a lot of people were watching the fight but clearly on streams. I was never going to pay for it, and even though I don't have a dodgy stick or anything like that, I watched nearly all of it live.

[Gerrumonside ref]

Hot prospect and powerful Liverpool featherweight Nick Ball in action tonight as he takes another step to a world title.

Ranked highly by the WBC (18-0-0) he takes on Isaac Dogboe who himself has already fought three times for a world title.

Should be the toughest test so far.

On the supporting card are three British and Commonwealth belts up for grabs.

 

[Gerrumonside ref]

Ball dominated Dogboe and won by UD by as many as 11 rounds on one scorecard.

Dogboe is no mug who has fought three times for the world title.

Ball is a pressure fighter who the Americans tend to like.

Edited November 18, 2023 by Gerrumonside ref

[DavidM]

Just wanted to say that this weekends bill looks a cracker and I’ll be buying this one 

[Gerrumonside ref]

2 hours ago, DavidM said:

Just wanted to say that this weekends bill looks a cracker and I’ll be buying this one 

It’s surprisingly cheap too given the bill.

I’m unsure which provider to go with out of TNT or DAZN as both offering the same PPV.

 

[Maximus Decimus]

What a great night so far.

Wilder was absolutely appalling! He's got to be done after this.

[Maximus Decimus]

On 19/12/2023 at 19:59, Gerrumonside ref said:

It’s surprisingly cheap too given the bill.

I’m unsure which provider to go with out of TNT or DAZN as both offering the same PPV.

 

If only all boxing PPVs were like this.

[Gerrumonside ref]

1 hour ago, Maximus Decimus said:

What a great night so far.

Wilder was absolutely appalling! He's got to be done after this.

Parker boxed a great fight with good head movement and footwork to command the centre of the ring for most of the fight.

He did a fantastic job too, when he launched his attacks behind his steady jab, of tying up Wilder to minimise that lethal right hook the American has.

In the end it was a boxer (with all the skill that implies) against a puncher (maybe the hardest single shot ever) - it was a decisive night for boxing fans.

He won all three scorecards easily and I struggled to give Wilder more than a single round.

As we know with Wilder he is a one trick pony like a scorpion, but even so it is a decisive trick at times.

I still felt tense in the final round for Parker, but he cleverly closed the range on a tired Wilder to neutralise him with a series of clinches.

 

Edited December 24, 2023 by Gerrumonside ref

[Gerrumonside ref]

A very dominant display from Joshua from the start.

He was careful, but not overly cautious, in establishing the heavier jab and caused a fair bit of wear and tear to Otto Wallin’s face.

I would hope this time next year we are finally discussing who will win the long awaited Fury-Joshua fight.

I’ve not forgotten about Usyk, Zhang, Parker or even Dubois - it’s just the above fight is the one I want to see and the Middle East money seems to melt away all the previous politics between the rival boxing promotions.

 

Edited December 24, 2023 by Gerrumonside ref

[Maximus Decimus]

Big fight tonight. On paper AJ seems like he should win quite straightforwardly but I just have a feeling it isn't going to be.

Currently enjoying a tiny scouser on his way to looking like he might win a title over a much taller WBC title holder.

[Gerrumonside ref]

2 hours ago, Maximus Decimus said:

Big fight tonight. On paper AJ seems like he should win quite straightforwardly but I just have a feeling it isn't going to be.

Currently enjoying a tiny scouser on his way to looking like he might win a title over a much taller WBC title holder.

Zhang-Parker made me nod off.

Joshua destroyed his opponent.

Boxing’s reputation is restored somewhat.

Now bring on Fury-Joshua.

[Maximus Decimus]

37 minutes ago, Gerrumonside ref said:

Zhang-Parker made me nod off.

Joshua destroyed his opponent.

Boxing’s reputation is restored somewhat.

Now bring on Fury-Joshua.

Fury looked totally embarrassed after. All I've heard is about Ngannou's granite chin, well it didn't last very long.

[StandOffHalf]

Well, that was devastating.

I thought Francis had a good chance tonight, but he never got into it and was blasted out by the boxer.

 

 

[Maximus Decimus]

3 hours ago, StandOffHalf said:

Well, that was devastating.

I thought Francis had a good chance tonight, but he never got into it and was blasted out by the boxer.

 

 

It was personally very satisfying as my kid brother had been giving reasons all week why Ngannou was going to win and quite easily.

I was of the opinion that AJ only took the fight because he was confident he could do a job. The big difference I thought would be the tape of the Fury fight. For all their bluster about him improving leaps and bounds, he wasn't an unknown prospect anymore. 

That said, I thought AJ would be cagey and it would be like the 2nd Ruiz fight. Seeing as though the fight starter way later than anticipated, I was happy it ended quick!

[StandOffHalf]

25 minutes ago, Maximus Decimus said:

It was personally very satisfying as my kid brother had been giving reasons all week why Ngannou was going to win and quite easily.

I was of the opinion that AJ only took the fight because he was confident he could do a job. The big difference I thought would be the tape of the Fury fight. For all their bluster about him improving leaps and bounds, he wasn't an unknown prospect anymore. 

That said, I thought AJ would be cagey and it would be like the 2nd Ruiz fight. Seeing as though the fight starter way later than anticipated, I was happy it ended quick!

Francis was way off and made AJ look unbelievable.

Switching stances was plain dumb in the first round, and led directly to him getting sparked. He's better than that, but got complacent and too comfortable.

A nasty night for us MMA fans. The Drake curse strikes again. Boo-hoo.

[Maximus Decimus]

3 hours ago, StandOffHalf said:

Francis was way off and made AJ look unbelievable.

Switching stances was plain dumb in the first round, and led directly to him getting sparked. He's better than that, but got complacent and too comfortable.

A nasty night for us MMA fans. The Drake curse strikes again. Boo-hoo.

Personally, I think it just reinforces the reality that they're two different sports. It's like Union fans getting hyped thinking the All Blacks could beat the Kangaroos in a game of RL and vice-versa.

I hope this puts paid to the notion of high-profile crossover fights like this. Fury made people believe it was possible, but his was the equivalent of a top boxer getting in the Octagon and the UFC fighter standing right in front of him trying to box.

AJs win will make it less appealing for boxers, as the intrigue will be less. If a man-mountain who's never been dropped before can get beat like that, who is really going to be an interesting fight for the public?

[StandOffHalf]

8 minutes ago, Maximus Decimus said:

Personally, I think it just reinforces the reality that they're two different sports. It's like Union fans getting hyped thinking the All Blacks could beat the Kangaroos in a game of RL and vice-versa.

I hope this puts paid to the notion of high-profile crossover fights like this. Fury made people believe it was possible, but his was the equivalent of a top boxer getting in the Octagon and the UFC fighter standing right in front of him trying to box.

AJs win will make it less appealing for boxers, as the intrigue will be less. If a man-mountain who's never been dropped before can get beat like that, who is really going to be an interesting fight for the public?

I have tended to enjoy the cross-over fights - Toney v Couture, McGregor v Mayweather, Cyborg boxing, and Ngannou's ventures into the ring.

Money will always talk. 

[EggFace]

13 hours ago, Gerrumonside ref said:

Zhang-Parker made me nod off.

Joshua destroyed his opponent.

Boxing’s reputation is restored somewhat.

Now bring on Fury-Joshua.

 I was so tired and bored having to listen to the pundits dragging it out and then a 2nd round KO past my bedtime.

The only good thing last night was the Liverpool little fella but sadly he was robbed and next time hope he trys uppercuts for once.

Wish we good have Boxing back in England with normal times and better crowd atmosphere.

[EggFace]

1 hour ago, Maximus Decimus said:

Personally, I think it just reinforces the reality that they're two different sports. It's like Union fans getting hyped thinking the All Blacks could beat the Kangaroos in a game of RL and vice-versa.

I hope this puts paid to the notion of high-profile crossover fights like this. Fury made people believe it was possible, but his was the equivalent of a top boxer getting in the Octagon and the UFC fighter standing right in front of him trying to box.

AJs win will make it less appealing for boxers, as the intrigue will be less. If a man-mountain who's never been dropped before can get beat like that, who is really going to be an interesting fight for the public?

Saying that the best cross over fighters to Boxing are the Thai's from Muay Thai backgrounds.

[Gerrumonside ref]

2 hours ago, Maximus Decimus said:

Personally, I think it just reinforces the reality that they're two different sports. It's like Union fans getting hyped thinking the All Blacks could beat the Kangaroos in a game of RL and vice-versa.

I hope this puts paid to the notion of high-profile crossover fights like this. Fury made people believe it was possible, but his was the equivalent of a top boxer getting in the Octagon and the UFC fighter standing right in front of him trying to box.

AJs win will make it less appealing for boxers, as the intrigue will be less. If a man-mountain who's never been dropped before can get beat like that, who is really going to be an interesting fight for the public?

 

54 minutes ago, EggFace said:

 I was so tired and bored having to listen to the pundits dragging it out and then a 2nd round KO past my bedtime.

The only good thing last night was the Liverpool little fella but sadly he was robbed and next time hope he trys uppercuts for once.

Wish we good have Boxing back in England with normal times and better crowd atmosphere.

Agree with both these.

The card was too long and there wasn’t enough atmosphere.

Some great points about UFC/Boxing there.

[Bedford Roughyed]

Loving the people saying AJ paid a bung for him to go down in the second.  

I think Fury went in complacent and nearly got caught.  AJ went in fully knowing what Ngannou could do.  Trying to read too much into both performances is a folly in my opinion.

(Plenty of AJ fans saying it shows how superior to fury he is.)

[DavidM]

Ive just saw a clip of the end and it looks like the ref should have stopped it after the first knockdown