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Lions tour 2019 (Merged Threads)

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16 minutes ago, damp squib said:

People will dismiss this but it actually makes a lot of sense. There are only two countries in the NH who have a pool of professional players - England and France. It also means you can keep the classic jersey as it is representative of both countries. It would be a much more genuine multi-national representative RL team in every meaningful sense.

Entente Cordiale Lions anyone?

Red white and blue or blue white and red?

Sacré bleu that would be a hard sell to some.

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Plus La Marseillaise is way better than GSTQ. Let's do it.

On second thoughts, let's just play as England and put loads of our spare money into developing France so that hopefully in the future we can have a competitive three match series against them, and they can also tour the southern hemisphere at the same time as  England do. That way we could have Aus v Eng and then NZ v France on the same day.

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19 minutes ago, damp squib said:

People will dismiss this but it actually makes a lot of sense. There are only two countries in the NH who have a pool of professional players - England and France. It also means you can keep the classic jersey as it is representative of both countries. It would be a much more genuine multi-national representative RL team in every meaningful sense.

Entente Cordiale Lions anyone?

Exactly, If England are my national side, there is no difference in principle between GB&I and GBI&France or any other number of nations.

Remi Casty is as British as Brian Carney.

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4 minutes ago, 17 stone giant said:

Plus La Marseillaise is way better than GSTQ. Let's do it.

On second thoughts, let's just play as England and put loads of our spare money into developing France so that hopefully in the future we can have a competitive three match series against them, and they can also tour the southern hemisphere at the same time as  England do. That way we could have Aus v Eng and then NZ v France on the same day.

Thats kind of the point, if we are going an Ashes series, send England.

If we are doing a proper Lions tour, make it a proper tour with a Rep side lets make it one with a real differentiator, something unique. A proper lions tour has to be unique or its pointless.

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1 minute ago, scotchy1 said:

Thats kind of the point, if we are going an Ashes series, send England.

If we are doing a proper Lions tour, make it a proper tour with a Rep side lets make it one with a real differentiator, something unique. A proper lions tour has to be unique or its pointless.

I agree. Sadly, I just can't imagine Scotland, Wales and Ireland ever producing enough quality players for a RU style Lions tour to ever work. When is it going to happen? If anything, we've gone backwards in that respect since RU went professional and the flow of talent from amateur RU to professional RL has dried up, and probably now even reversed. It wouldn't surprise me at all that if Regan Grace developed into a great player that the Welsh RFU would come knocking at the door with a bag of money. I don't know the guy or how he thinks, but I again wouldn't be surprised if he saw the money and the possibility of representing Wales RU in front of 75000 and switched codes.

RL administrators need to stop making decisions on what they wish the situation was, and starting making them based on what the real situation is.

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PNG - Port Moresby

Australia - Melbourne

Australia - Perth

Australia - Brisbane

Tonga/Samoa/Fiji - Sydney

Rather play actual internationals than "all star" teams or representative teams. 

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6 minutes ago, londonrlfan said:

PNG - Port Moresby

Australia - Melbourne

Australia - Perth

Australia - Brisbane

Tonga/Samoa/Fiji - Sydney

Rather play actual internationals than "all star" teams or representative teams. 

I like the look of that. Maybe Tonga in Auckland again. I'm sure they'd be up for a revenge match after feeling hard done by at the world cup. Would definitely play PNG too. They get a great crowd and they have potential to grow given their population size. Samoa and Fiji I would only play if it could be done with a 2nd XIII. I'd also play one match against New Zealand. Can't really go all that way - especially if you're playing Tonga in Auckland - and not play NZ.

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Just now, 17 stone giant said:

I like the look of that. Maybe Tonga in Auckland again. I'm sure they'd be up for a revenge match after feeling hard done by at the world cup. Would definitely play PNG too. They get a great crowd and they have potential to grow given their population size. Samoa and Fiji I would only play if it could be done with a 2nd XIII. I'd also play one match against New Zealand. Can't really go all that way - especially if you're playing Tonga in Auckland - and not play NZ.

That's why I'd rather have a tournament than a test series. Seems such a waste to only face the Australians and one or two "warm ups". Could have easily had a 6 Nations/insert other name with Aus, NZ, Tonga, PNG and Fiji instead. 

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16 hours ago, Davo5 said:

Tours down under are always tough without playing internationals Wed/Sat  for a month.

Thats why they always took a squad big enough to formulate 2 teams, basically an initial 'test' and a 'midweek' team, but that was not set in stone, players who performed well 'midweek' would/could be promoted, or those from the strongest selection who's form was not desirable could/would be dropped, it is the best way of touring.

Many times those selected as part of the strongest line up's have been displaced, best example I can recall is the team which became known as "The Invincibles" the 1982 Kangaroo's, Wally Lewis and Steve Mortimer were selected as the first choice 6 & 7, but such was the form of the expected second string Brett Kenny(6) and Peter Sterling(7) in the games prior to the first test at Boothferry Park, Hull, they gained selection and never lost it being the pairing for all 3 tests.

The more games they can put into the schedule is fine just as long as they take a big enough squad, AND have player's back home under instruction to keep themselves fit and ready should they be called upon to travel at quick notice as replacements for injured players.

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1 hour ago, Harry Stottle said:

Thats why they always took a squad big enough to formulate 2 teams, basically an initial 'test' and a 'midweek' team, but that was not set in stone, players who performed well 'midweek' would/could be promoted, or those from the strongest selection who's form was not desirable could/would be dropped, it is the best way of touring.

Many times those selected as part of the strongest line up's have been displaced, best example I can recall is the team which became known as "The Invincibles" the 1982 Kangaroo's, Wally Lewis and Steve Mortimer were selected as the first choice 6 & 7, but such was the form of the expected second string Brett Kenny(6) and Peter Sterling(7) in the games prior to the first test at Boothferry Park, Hull, they gained selection and never lost it being the pairing for all 3 tests.

The more games they can put into the schedule is fine just as long as they take a big enough squad, AND have player's back home under instruction to keep themselves fit and ready should they be called upon to travel at quick notice as replacements for injured players.

Playing Tonga,Fiji,Samoa etc midweek is totally different to playing the likes of Northern Territories,Burleigh Bears or a 2nd string NRL team which previous tours have done and our 2nd string will be of a lot less quality than the 82 invincibles 

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GB and a random nation that doesnt really play RL. Brilliant

GB and the random nation that doesnt really play RL plus another random nation that does. Terrible.

Strange lot RL fans. Pick an awful lot of strange hills to fight on.

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1 hour ago, scotchy1 said:

GB and a random nation that doesnt really play RL. Brilliant

GB and the random nation that doesnt really play RL plus another random nation that does. Terrible.

Strange lot RL fans. Pick an awful lot of strange hills to fight on.

It's a project entirely based on nostalgia. If it doesn't match up perfectly with that childhood memory then it has no purpose. I'm not in favour of bringing back GB or GB&I or whatever else, but I can see how it could work by making a few changes (such as your suggestions) to more accurately reflect the current RL World we live in. But that would defeat the purpose for most of it's supporters.

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20 hours ago, 17 stone giant said:

I agree. Sadly, I just can't imagine Scotland, Wales and Ireland ever producing enough quality players for a RU style Lions tour to ever work. When is it going to happen? If anything, we've gone backwards in that respect since RU went professional and the flow of talent from amateur RU to professional RL has dried up, and probably now even reversed. It wouldn't surprise me at all that if Regan Grace developed into a great player that the Welsh RFU would come knocking at the door with a bag of money. I don't know the guy or how he thinks, but I again wouldn't be surprised if he saw the money and the possibility of representing Wales RU in front of 75000 and switched codes.

RL administrators need to stop making decisions on what they wish the situation was, and starting making them based on what the real situation is.

but ... being able to beat Australia while playing for GB could stop him from switching codes, couldn't it?

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20 hours ago, londonrlfan said:

PNG - Port Moresby

Australia - Melbourne

Australia - Perth

Australia - Brisbane

Tonga/Samoa/Fiji - Sydney

Rather play actual internationals than "all star" teams or representative teams. 

If it's GB, it's not an actual International
 


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Just now, MatthewWoody said:

If it's GB, it's not an actual International
 

Its not even GB, its GB and another country.

Its a rep side we wont commit to calling a rep side brought back because of nostalgia for a Jersey.

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Just now, scotchy1 said:

Its not even GB, its GB and another country.

Its a rep side we wont commit to calling a rep side brought back because of nostalgia for a Jersey.

Yes, I see what you mean. 
I was just reflecting about this International or Test Match mantra. 
Rep sides are good, as soon as they reflect and actually represent something that exists [culturally, in sports, etc.]. 


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20 hours ago, londonrlfan said:

That's why I'd rather have a tournament than a test series. Seems such a waste to only face the Australians and one or two "warm ups". Could have easily had a 6 Nations/insert other name with Aus, NZ, Tonga, PNG and Fiji instead. 

You'd need the money to have the non tier 1 nations available and camped for 4-5 weeks. 


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On 4/16/2018 at 11:10 AM, lucky 7 said:

I think the ARL commission are very poor at promoting International Rugby League. The see it as a treat to SOO. The jewel in the crown for Australian Rugby League as far as they are concerned.

And rightly so, from that point of view. ?


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The reality as we all know is that the majority of the Celtic Nations players play for them as they aren’t good enough (some yet) for England. Bring along a GB&I Celts (nickname nor formal) team to play midweek teams

1. Russel

2. Tierney

3. Wardle

4. Evans 

5. Grace

6. Sneyd

7. Brierly

8. Flower

9. McIllorum

10. Mullally

11. Ward

12. Roberts 

13. LMS

 

No reason players like Sneyd, Mullally, McIllorum, Stevie Ward (Wales qualified) Roberts or Grace couldn’t step up on tour. Also incentivizes some of those to actually play for the Celtic Nations. Like Evans and Flower more pertinently.

 

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4 hours ago, MatthewWoody said:

but ... being able to beat Australia while playing for GB could stop him from switching codes, couldn't it?

It might stop him from switching until after the 2019 tour, but given that after that it's a 5 year wait for GB to play again, I'm not sure that would be enough for him to stick around.

More likely is that if he did well for GB in 2019, that's when Wales RU would make their move for him.

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6 hours ago, JoneslessBishop said:

The reality as we all know is that the majority of the Celtic Nations players play for them as they aren’t good enough (some yet) for England. Bring along a GB&I Celts (nickname nor formal) team to play midweek teams

1. Russel

2. Tierney

3. Wardle

4. Evans 

5. Grace

6. Sneyd

7. Brierly

8. Flower

9. McIllorum

10. Mullally

11. Ward

12. Roberts 

13. LMS

 

No reason players like Sneyd, Mullally, McIllorum, Stevie Ward (Wales qualified) Roberts or Grace couldn’t step up on tour. Also incentivizes some of those to actually play for the Celtic Nations. Like Evans and Flower more pertinently.

 

Or....that Celtic team tours.....and England go on a separate tour..

Problem solved...we don't degrade the England brand and we give the Celtic nations a touring team they actually have a chance of playing for..


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8 hours ago, roughyedspud said:

Or....that Celtic team tours.....and England go on a separate tour..

Problem solved...we don't degrade the England brand and we give the Celtic nations a touring team they actually have a chance of playing for..

Not sure how we are degrading the England brand. Because all the players in the GB 1st team will be English? Doesn’t that just emphasize England as the strongest team in the N Hemisphere and thus strengthen the brand?

Reading between the lines of Nigel Woods’ Singapore statement re the international calendar, looks like the Denver test could be at risk next year. That void could be filled with a GB Nation of Origin test. GB v the Celtic Nations. Just as Origin was created as a selection games for the summers Oz squad, this could do the same. Gives the relaunched GB a big launch, creates interest in how many Celts will end up in the touring 1st team, and has a big game in England in 2019. Seems more credible than the Anzac Nation of Origin we played a few years back.

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23 hours ago, Davo5 said:

Playing Tonga,Fiji,Samoa etc midweek is totally different to playing the likes of Northern Territories,Burleigh Bears or a 2nd string NRL team which previous tours have done and our 2nd string will be of a lot less quality than the 82 invincibles 

For all those who say why GB, only English lads will get in. What if:

Some Bona Fide Welsh, Scot or Irish guy's emerge in the near future who turn out to be very good top performing players, whose inclusion to strengthen the GB team will be achevied on merit, should those guy's be denied the opportunity to perform on the highest stage? Or should they be expected to denounce their heritage and move over to the England team?

I do not see anything wrong with having with still having "Home Nations" teams for the world cup but retaining the British Lions for Ashes series.

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54 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

For all those who say why GB, only English lads will get in. What if:

Some Bona Fide Welsh, Scot or Irish guy's emerge in the near future who turn out to be very good top performing players, whose inclusion to strengthen the GB team will be achevied on merit, should those guy's be denied the opportunity to perform on the highest stage? Or should they be expected to denounce their heritage and move over to the England team?

I do not see anything wrong with having with still having "Home Nations" teams for the world cup but retaining the British Lions for Ashes series.

Exactly Harry. And having a GB Celts team touring with the 1st team is a great way of creating that path way and ensuring players stick with or start playing for the Celtic Nations until they make the 1st team

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