Taking the hill.

[Dog Faced Gremlin]

Am I right in thinking that despite winning the toss Halifax elected to play downhill in the first half?

[distantdog]

2 hours ago, Dog Faced Gremlin said:

Am I right in thinking that despite winning the toss Halifax elected to play downhill in the first half?

I haven't heard that but I understand that several teams often choose that. I suspect that the vast majority of the learned spectators would always prefer us to play uphill first.

I am not sure that had we been at 6-6 at half time on sunday having played downhill, we would have won.

[phildog]

Ah but DD, we might NOT have been 6 all downhill!! Yes, whilst you're fit and fresh you should always defend the slope 1st half then have it with you when both sides are huffing.

[silverback]

we play some good stuff uphill too now and again,alos its a lot better getting back in defence going uphill backtracking as its downhill.all swings and roundabouts but the way the boys were fired up sunday we could a taken anyone on and given them one hell of a game, a sad day that turned out a special day in a strange way.

[tms]

6 hours ago, Dog Faced Gremlin said:

Am I right in thinking that despite winning the toss Halifax elected to play downhill in the first half?

the answer to that is who kicked off

according to rfl rules 

The kick off is a place kick from the centre of the halfway line. The team which loses the toss for choice of ends kicks off to start 

[Piggy's mate]

We kicked off first half

[phildog]

Whichvwouldvtherefore suggesrsvthst Halifax DID win the toss and chose to play downhill.

[fredm]

Probably thought they could put enough points on the board that we would lose enthusiasm for the second half and they would see the game out.

[greydog]

With a strong wind down hill better playing down hill first

[Dog Faced Gremlin]

I cant think of a time when we've not taken the hill even with a strong wind behind us. A ref did once suggest to me it was better to play downhill in the first half as the other team will get tired retreating 10 metres up it in defence. 

[colinb]

48 minutes ago, Dog Faced Gremlin said:

I cant think of a time when we've not taken the hill even with a strong wind behind us. A ref did once suggest to me it was better to play downhill in the first half as the other team will get tired retreating 10 metres up it in defence. 

John Etty once told me that playing downhill and running backwards back up in defence was tiring.. That also told me you didn't turn your back on the play the ball.....like they do now.

[The Phantom Horseman]

Has anyone ever kept records of uphill/downhill scores at the Mount over a period of time? I did a bit of research a while ago about the slope at Fev (which was always much less pronounced than at Batley even before it was levelled off to a degree) and over an extended period there were certainly more points scored downhill than uphill...can't remember the exact sum but maybe the slope was worth 4-6 points per game on average, even though you get the odd game (such as v Bradford last week) where a lot more points are scored uphill.

Was thinking how much start I would want to choose playing uphill rather than downhill in a one-off 40 minute game at Batley. I'd probably want at least 10, which suggests that overall the slope would be worth at least 20pts a game if that were accurate. I wonder if the figures back that up.

 

 

[distantdog]

49 minutes ago, The Phantom Horseman said:

Has anyone ever kept records of uphill/downhill scores at the Mount over a period of time? I did a bit of research a while ago about the slope at Fev (which was always much less pronounced than at Batley even before it was levelled off to a degree) and over an extended period there were certainly more points scored downhill than uphill...can't remember the exact sum but maybe the slope was worth 4-6 points per game on average, even though you get the odd game (such as v Bradford last week) where a lot more points are scored uphill.

Was thinking how much start I would want to choose playing uphill rather than downhill in a one-off 40 minute game at Batley. I'd probably want at least 10, which suggests that overall the slope would be worth at least 20pts a game if that were accurate. I wonder if the figures back that up.

 

 

Anecdotally, we (my match watching associates) reckon 12 points. I do think that playing up the slope can also be an advantage if played the right way. 

[Dog Faced Gremlin]

7 hours ago, distantdog said:

Anecdotally, we (my match watching associates) reckon 12 points. I do think that playing up the slope can also be an advantage if played the right way. 

I agree I always think if we go in at half time less than a couple of scores down we have a chance.

[The Phantom Horseman]

21 hours ago, distantdog said:

 I do think that playing up the slope can also be an advantage if played the right way. 

I'm struggling to visualise that between two evenly-matched teams. Maybe at a lower level, but in the Championship, where winning the collision is everything, it's so much easier to get on the front foot. The laws of physics mean runners pick up momentum much more quickly running downhill.

Yes in theory having to continually run uphill back to the defensive line could be tough, but at this level you don't see that many clean breaks per game, and in an evenly-matched contest the team playing downhill are usually going to be able to control the ruck when defending.

[distantdog]

In our succesful year of 2016, we played error free rugby, kept hold of the ball, had a fierce kick and chase and tackled with intensity. It took the slope out of the equation in many of the games, and had the effect of turning round the opposition as if they had played uphill anyway.

I know this is controversial, but I have often said that if we had lots of money, i would dig up thepitch and level it. Not found many people who agree with that though.

[Lone Drinker]

Halifax won the toss and played downhill first. 

If we play downhill first I’m not happy unless we’re 18 points up.

[Blind side johnny]

22 hours ago, distantdog said:

In our succesful year of 2016, we played error free rugby, kept hold of the ball, had a fierce kick and chase and tackled with intensity. It took the slope out of the equation in many of the games, and had the effect of turning round the opposition as if they had played uphill anyway.

I know this is controversial, but I have often said that if we had lots of money, i would dig up thepitch and level it. Not found many people who agree with that though.

Yes an interesting suggestion DD. Anyone opposed to the idea in theory (ignoring cost implications) must be of the opinion that the slope and knowing how to play it gives the home team an advantage. Should this still be the case in this day and age?

[distantdog]

3 minutes ago, Blind side johnny said:

Yes an interesting suggestion DD. Anyone opposed to the idea in theory (ignoring cost implications) must be of the opinion that the slope and knowing how to play it gives the home team an advantage. Should this still be the case in this day and age?

I personally have no problem with teams having advantages when playing at home! It has always been the case and probably always will be. My issue with the slope is twofold.

1. I don't think it gives us any real advantage anyway and

2. I believe it holds us back as a club. We have bid for WC matches in the past, but will never get that standard on matches at the Mount with our pitch. It is seen as quaint in the RL world and not forward looking and modern. (This final point is anecdotal but I think still stands)

On the other side, it is a great surface, and I have always thought that the slope alows it to drain well which means it remains playable in damaging weather.

[Piggy's mate]

I think it does play a psychological part, but when you play on it (running) seems to have little impact imo. I would level it given the money just to get those games that DD mentioned etc.

[Blind side johnny]

44 minutes ago, Piggy's mate said:

I think it does play a psychological part, but when you play on it (running) seems to have little impact imo. I would level it given the money just to get those games that DD mentioned etc.

Running?

[Piggy's mate]

1 hour ago, Blind side johnny said:

Running?

Ok a quick walk..

[The Phantom Horseman]

7 hours ago, Blind side johnny said:

Yes an interesting suggestion DD. Anyone opposed to the idea in theory (ignoring cost implications) must be of the opinion that the slope and knowing how to play it gives the home team an advantage.

I'm opposed to the idea, but not because of the reason you gave - I just think the hill gives an added tactical dimension that adds to the overall interest - I love watching games at Batley even as a neutral (Fev fan).

Not saying that other clubs should deliberately create slopes on their pitches, I just think having this ground adds a bit of variety and a twist.

 

 

[Batley Bob]

Today playing downhill 1st half batley winning 16.12 at half time 

uphill 2nd half batley won   22.6 

batley 38 Rochdale 18

[distantdog]

39 minutes ago, Batley Bob said:

Today playing downhill 1st half batley winning 16.12 at half time 

uphill 2nd half batley won   22.6 

batley 38 Rochdale 18

As discussed BB. This game makes idiots of all of us amatuers!