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So What's The Plan From Here?


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50 minutes ago, iangidds said:

Ive long held the view that RL is dying on its feet . We stagger on as a sport with inept people running the game into the ground 

There appears to be zero vision and zero optomism in the game since Lewis departed.....

Lewis created Les Catalans, bringing in a wealthy owner and a strong well supported club. Beyond that he didn't make any more ground as he faced what we have always faced, the Monster of Soccer and for those who prefer Rugby the monster of Union. We do very well to survive (and not be killed by) those two enormous pressures.

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Just now, steve oates said:

Lewis created Les Catalans, bringing in a wealthy owner and a strong well supported club. Beyond that he didn't make any more ground as he faced what we have always faced, the Monster of Soccer and for those who prefer Rugby the monster of Union. We do very well to survive (and not be killed by) those two enormous pressures.

We do well not to have been killed yet ,but i fear we might get killed pretty soon! We certainly are not on an upwarc curve like other sports

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I think Lewis brought proffesionalism and credibilty to the sport within the higher reaches of uk sport and media ; Woods and Rimmer have taken us backwards in that respect I feel

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Just now, iangidds said:

We do well not to have been killed yet ,but i fear we might get killed pretty soon! We certainly are not on an upwarc curve like other sports

Well you agree with me Ian don't you - we are doing well by surviving.

 

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1 hour ago, Eddie said:

They’d just asset strip it, the WC decision has proven what we all suspected, that they have zero interest in the game outside Australia. 

There`s more to this observation than meets the eye.

I suspect that those in the corridors of power know full well the double-edged sword a successful NH game could be.

Australia plus NZ and the Pacific is a market of roughly 30-35 million, many of those low-income, Europe is a continent of 500m with vast wealth. If Super League takes off over the next 30+ years how many NRL clubs could compete with the wealth that European clubs could generate.

We would be the competitions with 5 or 6 wealthy clubs able to compete on player wages and a dozen battlers, sound familiar ?

NRL will want a goldilocks level of competition from the northern hemisphere, not too big, not too small.

Far easier said than done, things like these can quickly take on a life of their own, the NRL will be well aware of this as they formulate a plan of what to do about Rugby League in the northern hemisphere.

 

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1 minute ago, iangidds said:

I think Lewis brought proffesionalism and credibilty to the sport within the higher reaches of uk sport and media ; Woods and Rimmer have taken us backwards in that respect I feel

Many years after Lewis the game remains professional and it's TV deals with SKY and the BBC retain it's cerdibility. It does well for a minority sport. 

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48 minutes ago, steve oates said:

Many years after Lewis the game remains professional and it's TV deals with SKY and the BBC retain it's cerdibility. It does well for a minority sport. 

How minority are we going ? It seems to me we are getting more minority all the time hence the smaller tv deals and less or no money for the lower levels; is that doing well?

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When you look at the product of Rugby League and some of the players they would grace any sport and be knighted at the end of their playing careers. If you look at Tommy Makinson, Tom Johnstone and Regan Grace for me they are my 3 favourite British players that should be poster boys of the sport and would be massive in football if they had that convertible skill sets but how many people would recognise the names nevermind faces outside of the RL arena which is a major hurdle. Rugby League likes its traditions which is great to be proud of however the downside is that doesn't attract big sponsors.

You look at Rugby 7s World circuit their principle sponsor is HSBC they play in Dubai, Vegas, Singapore and Hong-Kong just to name a few. They have household names, big broadcasting partners and other big commercial sponsors. 

With the right marketing would 8 weekend events with 8 franchised clubs with massive marketing and household player names showcase the sport, pick your venues across the NH then afterwards play a NH International tournament for 8 weekends allow it to develop across Europe, North America and Asia With 16 weekends across April to September. 

With a domestic UK league structure still in place so that the 3pm Sunday slot isn't disrupted for the traditionalists. 

For RL to progress in the Northern hemisphere it would need something as large as that with huge commercial sponsors, vision and focus otherwise, stick to the regionalised heartlands which so are successful in their own right with small interest in other areas. 

Edited by BridBeachRL
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2 hours ago, steve oates said:

Many years after Lewis the game remains professional and it's TV deals with SKY and the BBC retain it's cerdibility. It does well for a minority sport. 

It's virtually 20 years since RL was in charge of RL. Not sure it's advanced much at all since then really. 

Firefighting seems to be the name of the game.

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7 hours ago, RayCee said:

Point taken Griff but rather than the 100 year record, what is the current management like? If given a chance, would they take it and have the potential to do well? I think the fact it has a sizable population catchment that is appealing to many. I don't know enough about the club to know. 

It does have a sizeable population , has had for at least a 100 years , and they've shown little to no I test in supporting either of the 2 sports clubs in the ' City ' , what we generally see on here is fans suggesting " yes but it's a nice place to visit and go on the pee " , and these same fans then tell us that clubs shouldn't rely on ' away ' support , total hypocrisy

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3 hours ago, BridBeachRL said:

When you look at the product of Rugby League and some of the players they would grace any sport and be knighted at the end of their playing careers. If you look at Tommy Makinson, Tom Johnstone and Regan Grace for me they are my 3 favourite British players that should be poster boys of the sport and would be massive in football if they had that convertible skill sets but how many people would recognise the names nevermind faces outside of the RL arena which is a major hurdle. Rugby League likes its traditions which is great to be proud of however the downside is that doesn't attract big sponsors.

You look at Rugby 7s World circuit their principle sponsor is HSBC they play in Dubai, Vegas, Singapore and Hong-Kong just to name a few. They have household names, big broadcasting partners and other big commercial sponsors. 

With the right marketing would 8 weekend events with 8 franchised clubs with massive marketing and household player names showcase the sport, pick your venues across the NH then afterwards play a NH International tournament for 8 weekends allow it to develop across Europe, North America and Asia With 16 weekends across April to September. 

With a domestic UK league structure still in place so that the 3pm Sunday slot isn't disrupted for the traditionalists. 

For RL to progress in the Northern hemisphere it would need something as large as that with huge commercial sponsors, vision and focus otherwise, stick to the regionalised heartlands which so are successful in their own right with small interest in other areas. 

Name me a 7 s player ?

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3 hours ago, BridBeachRL said:

 

You look at Rugby 7s World circuit their principle sponsor is HSBC they play in Dubai, Vegas, Singapore and Hong-Kong just to name a few. They have household names, big broadcasting partners and other big commercial sponsors. 

Um, 

unlike many on here as a genuine dual code fan I watch a *lot* of RU - I'll agree with broadcast partners, glitzy locations, and big commercial sponsors but I can't name a single mens* sevens circuit player (that didn't play for my club initially), let alone suggest they're household names.

7s makes a lot of money, but the household names play proper RU.

I think there's a parallel with 9s in that 7s is a distraction from the real thing - it's been more successful since it's basically become its own sport. When it was mostly the same players trying to do 7 and XV a side, it was chaos.

FWIW I agree with The Rocket. The whole issue with RL into the future is what happens if it takes off (again) in the Northern Hemisphere, because if it ever did click (never mind the impact on RU, which I think would be minimal for a long time) it could reduce the NRL to a feeder league very quickly.

Oddly enough they don't want that. 

*I can name a fair few of the England Women 7s, but that's because it's generally many of the same players as the XV, but the format depends on which one the RFU's decided to properly fund at any one time (because they vanishingly rarely fund both).

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5 minutes ago, iffleyox said:

Um, 

unlike many on here as a genuine dual code fan I watch a *lot* of RU - I'll agree with broadcast partners, glitzy locations, and big commercial sponsors but I can't name a single mens* sevens circuit player (that didn't play for my club initially), let alone suggest they're household names.

7s makes a lot of money, but the household names play proper RU.

I think there's a parallel with 9s in that 7s is a distraction from the real thing - it's been more successful since it's basically become its own sport. When it was mostly the same players trying to do 7 and XV a side, it was chaos.

FWIW I agree with The Rocket. The whole issue with RL into the future is what happens if it takes off (again) in the Northern Hemisphere, because if it ever did click (never mind the impact on RU, which I think would be minimal for a long time) it could reduce the NRL to a feeder league very quickly.

Oddly enough they don't want that. 

*I can name a fair few of the England Women 7s, but that's because it's generally many of the same players as the XV, but the format depends on which one the RFU's decided to properly fund at any one time (because they vanishingly rarely fund both).

Agreed household names play full sized RU with Europe, international and B&I Lions at the top of the sport. However why can't RL 13 a side players be household names. The RFL or Super League need to look at marketing better. If people saw our sport, our players and how good the on field product was that might convince others to get onboard. But if you are inclusive whether intentional or not from the Toronto debacle to others then the Sport will be a slow burner and we can enjoy our bit whilst what happens... Happens

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4 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

Never heard of her 

Nice one 😊 at a $100,000 a year salary can't be doing bad. I don't mind saying a player is a good player when they clearly are. YouTube him and maybe RL missed a trick by not cross coding him or could easily be a way to expand the future US market of former American Footballers but get them into League. 

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1 minute ago, BridBeachRL said:

Agreed household names play full sized RU with Europe, international and B&I Lions at the top of the sport. However why can't RL 13 a side players be household names. The RFL or Super League need to look at marketing better. If people saw our sport, our players and how good the on field product was that might convince others to get onboard. 

that's a different question though. And it doesn't necessarily follow either. Think back to the 1980s (I was a child then) - there was much more RL on FTA TV then, we watched it, enjoyed it, and there were two players I could have named as an 8 year old - Martin Offiah and Ellery Hanley. I dimly recall you could even get a model of one of them with tokens from cereal boxes (I've still got Eric Bristow somewhere...). But it didn't open the floodgates for hordes of other RL household names. 

It's chicken and egg. no one cares about club RU beyond season ticket holders of those clubs - which is exactly the same as club RL. The difference isn't marketing, it's the 6 Nations being appointment viewing in pubs and on TVs; and a world cup that any of England, Wales, Ireland, France, RSA, Australia or NZ could win (and a couple of other teams could spring a surprise).

So, where I would go from here is nothing that hasn't been said a million times on here, we need: 

  • regular NH internationals with a fixed annual window. You don't know who England are playing, but there will be three England tests this month, sort of thing, which everyone, fans, players, administrators, broadcasters and sponsors can set their watch to out to about 5 years ahead.
  • another French side in SL as soon as feasible, even if it means taking two up (winners and Toulouse), then protecting Toulouse from relegation for a bit - and before the sharp intakes of breath, I would be planning overtly to build a suction effect where there is a general uplift of French RL such that eventually Catalans and Toulouse go home to play in a domestic league and don't play in SL. But until that point they're more than welcome here - basically the RFL need to have two strategic priorities, sorting English RL out and doing anything they can to help French RL - until the annual tests between the two are proper tests

 

We need many other things as well, but that's where I'd start - sort out international RL in the Northern Hemisphere, and the way to do that goes through France.

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6 minutes ago, iffleyox said:

that's a different question though. And it doesn't necessarily follow either. Think back to the 1980s (I was a child then) - there was much more RL on FTA TV then, we watched it, enjoyed it, and there were two players I could have named as an 8 year old - Martin Offiah and Ellery Hanley. I dimly recall you could even get a model of one of them with tokens from cereal boxes (I've still got Eric Bristow somewhere...). But it didn't open the floodgates for hordes of other RL household names. 

It's chicken and egg. no one cares about club RU beyond season ticket holders of those clubs - which is exactly the same as club RL. The difference isn't marketing, it's the 6 Nations being appointment viewing in pubs and on TVs; and a world cup that any of England, Wales, Ireland, France, RSA, Australia or NZ could win (and a couple of other teams could spring a surprise).

So, where I would go from here is nothing that hasn't been said a million times on here, we need: 

  • regular NH internationals with a fixed annual window. You don't know who England are playing, but there will be three England tests this month, sort of thing, which everyone, fans, players, administrators, broadcasters and sponsors can set their watch to out to about 5 years ahead.
  • another French side in SL as soon as feasible, even if it means taking two up (winners and Toulouse), then protecting Toulouse from relegation for a bit - and before the sharp intakes of breath, I would be planning overtly to build a suction effect where there is a general uplift of French RL such that eventually Catalans and Toulouse go home to play in a domestic league and don't play in SL. But until that point they're more than welcome here - basically the RFL need to have two strategic priorities, sorting English RL out and doing anything they can to help French RL - until the annual tests between the two are proper tests

 

We need many other things as well, but that's where I'd start - sort out international RL in the Northern Hemisphere, and the way to do that goes through France.

That's fair enough didn't help when RU turned pro and the whole 2003 winning world cup side. Agreed more involvement with France is needed the major problem with Super League is whether to have a closed shop or not. Clubs can't be stable such as Toulouse if they are looking over their shoulder of relegation all the time so do they get a couple of years with no threat of relegation? There 100% should be an annual England vs France game, its whether it's post season or mid season is the main question as mid season will the NRL allow players to be released to play in a 1 game they aren't bothered about or do we have a Union policy to play for England you need to play in England? 

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15 minutes ago, iffleyox said:

So, where I would go from here is nothing that hasn't been said a million times on here, we need: 

  • regular NH internationals with a fixed annual window. You don't know who England are playing, but there will be three England tests this month, sort of thing, which everyone, fans, players, administrators, broadcasters and sponsors can set their watch to out to about 5 years ahead.
  • another French side in SL as soon as feasible, even if it means taking two up (winners and Toulouse), then protecting Toulouse from relegation for a bit - and before the sharp intakes of breath, I would be planning overtly to build a suction effect where there is a general uplift of French RL such that eventually Catalans and Toulouse go home to play in a domestic league and don't play in SL. But until that point they're more than welcome here - basically the RFL need to have two strategic priorities, sorting English RL out and doing anything they can to help French RL - until the annual tests between the two are proper tests

 

We need many other things as well, but that's where I'd start - sort out international RL in the Northern Hemisphere, and the way to do that goes through France.

Bang. On. The. Nail.

 

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21 minutes ago, iffleyox said:

 

So, where I would go from here is nothing that hasn't been said a million times on here, we need: 

  • regular NH internationals with a fixed annual window. You don't know who England are playing, but there will be three England tests this month, sort of thing, which everyone, fans, players, administrators, broadcasters and sponsors can set their watch to out to about 5 years ahead.
  • another French side in SL as soon as feasible, even if it means taking two up (winners and Toulouse), then protecting Toulouse from relegation for a bit - and before the sharp intakes of breath, I would be planning overtly to build a suction effect where there is a general uplift of French RL such that eventually Catalans and Toulouse go home to play in a domestic league and don't play in SL. But until that point they're more than welcome here - basically the RFL need to have two strategic priorities, sorting English RL out and doing anything they can to help French RL - until the annual tests between the two are proper tests

 

We need many other things as well, but that's where I'd start - sort out international RL in the Northern Hemisphere, and the way to do that goes through France.

Give this man all the chocolate biscuits. Also the best part of a 4 nations style tournament for RL on FTA is that it is before the Christmas shopping period so would be more attractive to advertisers. Plus if Six nations goes behind paywall we´re the only FTA rugby people would get. 

Edited by ShropshireBull
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8 minutes ago, BridBeachRL said:

 do we have a Union policy to play for England you need to play in England? 

I think that needs to come in time but it would be suicidal to do it now. Focus on getting the standard of French RL up, make playing internationally for England something more than regularly hypothetical, *then* when we're not actually on our knees, yes, if you're playing in Australia you don't play for England.

But absolutely not any time soon - it will be a lever to pull down the line.

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