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jroyales

The Future of ORLFC

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Several weeks ago it was suggested that there could be a meeting of like minded people to have a meeting to look at the future of ORLFC. Sadly, like most things on the forum there were comments made but nothing materialised. I am opening up the discussion again because the topic is, I feel, is essential for our club's survival.

If enough people are interested then we could use one of our ARLFCs and invite like minded people from whatever source and thrash out the way forward rather than just talking about it. there are enough great minds on this forum capable of making it happen.

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Almost singlehandedly Chris is making sure it survives and it will be thus probably as long as he survives...Its what he does! (he "owns" the club after all).

We had a term that had to do with some popular fishing clubs...and attaining membership...to do with mortality and footwear.

great minds are important but great financial largesse with the status quo intact is preferred... theres a term for that too....

 

were "talking resources" here!

 

 

 

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I was all up for the supporters club which HOTB and others on the forum had talks with CH with Rugby Oldham. I think this is what most old and new supporters want and was very exciting.

When this died a death due to CH pigheadedness and ignorance then I knew nothing would change at the club whilst he's in charge, rendering any supporter meetings pointless until he is gone.

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right go to companies house beta.

type in Oldham rlfc 1997 ltd.

go to fillings history

tick the box accounts, all the accounts  submitted are there makes good reading and should enlighten you. will show the money owed to ch £261.765 and the depts. 

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This topic has as said,been spoken of before, and in my opinion nothing has transpired for the following reasons,

1. Chris Hamilton as the sole owner of the  club, would only listen to a genuine offer to buy him out.

2. He is running to all intents and purpose, a business which pays him a salary, and  therefore has no interest in fan sharing.

3. Even if 100 fans put up one thousand pounds each, that would not be nearly enough for him to relinquish the whole or even part of his ownership.

4. It would take a great deal of money to convert the club to A Members Club because of the accumulated debts incurred.

   As far as I am concerned, unless some very wealthy individual fan with perhaps a bigger heart than head  buys the club and then changes it to a Members Club,  we the fans carry on as we  are, wishing and hoping as the club limps along to whatever it’s destiny is. 

I am commenting because so many fans on this Forum, have the clubs interest at heart, but IMHO there is no way we can change the status quo. 

I will be buying a season ticket and hope to see some great rugby, and try not to get too depressed at the state of this great club

 

 

limps along

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19 hours ago, neversaydie said:

This topic has as said,been spoken of before, and in my opinion nothing has transpired for the following reasons,

1. Chris Hamilton as the sole owner of the  club, would only listen to a genuine offer to buy him out.

2. He is running to all intents and purpose, a business which pays him a salary, and  therefore has no interest in fan sharing.

3. Even if 100 fans put up one thousand pounds each, that would not be nearly enough for him to relinquish the whole or even part of his ownership.

4. It would take a great deal of money to convert the club to A Members Club because of the accumulated debts incurred.

   As far as I am concerned, unless some very wealthy individual fan with perhaps a bigger heart than head  buys the club and then changes it to a Members Club,  we the fans carry on as we  are, wishing and hoping as the club limps along to whatever it’s destiny is. 

I am commenting because so many fans on this Forum, have the clubs interest at heart, but IMHO there is no way we can change the status quo. 

I will be buying a season ticket and hope to see some great rugby, and try not to get too depressed at the state of this great club

 

 

limps along

He would listen to any offer that brought significant extra income.

I have laid out plans how it could be done in reasonable detail.

Don't assume the owner would dismiss an offer of 100k for half the club. 

There is currently ZERO PROSPECT of him ever getting any of the money he is owed beyond his salary.

If he were offered a wad of cash plus a transitional period where he continued to earn a salary and retained a seat on the board..... I'd be interested to hear his response.

But until you all form/join the Trust and put your money in (with relevant Ts & Cs of course) you'll never know.

Ironic that your name is neversaydie but you've given up and you're not even willing to try.

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hottb iam a bit puzzled what would happen to the £100.000 would it go into the clubs account to purchase a new  share issue, or direct to ch to release some of the 50.000 shares he holds. because if it goes direct to ch the club is still skint so the purchasers of the shares would have to put more monies into the club something like the nhs. neversaydie as got it right no way is ch ever going to give a very good salary up would you.

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50 minutes ago, tandle said:

hottb iam a bit puzzled what would happen to the £100.000 would it go into the clubs account to purchase a new  share issue, or direct to ch to release some of the 50.000 shares he holds. because if it goes direct to ch the club is still skint so the purchasers of the shares would have to put more monies into the club something like the nhs. neversaydie as got it right no way is ch ever going to give a very good salary up would you.

If you buy shares,  you are buying them from the owner of those shares not the club.  Now in the unlikely event that someone comes in with a sizeable investment then  ch may relinquish some shares , but not control. Then there are different types of share. Called alphabet shares whereby A shares,, for example, mean you have a Share in income and the B Shares carry all the voting rights. Can be complicated.

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hottb have you seen the last accounts to be submitted 31st oct. 2015.

creditors amounts falling due.within 1 year £422.687.

cash in hand at the bank £25.

ch as survived in champ. 1 for 18 years he is know back in his comfort zone promotion forget it here we stay .

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Contrary to what has been posted, I have not given up at all, but would rather face the facts. The club through C.H and according to Tandle, have debts in excess of £400.000. C.H would have to go bankrupt before any thing could possibly change.  

Only then could like minded supporters try to form a supporters club. Then of course would they be accepted by the powers that be.   As far as not willing to try, I have not yet read of any possible answer to the situation with the management of the club, and until I do:

Again I reiterate I will still be a supporter of the team and Never say die.

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If he has decided he genuinely doesn't want to sell at any price then there's nothing to be done.... but you won't know if that's the case until you ask. 

Yes I have seen the accounts.

They are just numbers on a page. Money owed mostly to him. Numbers he knows he has no chance of recouping. He can write some of it off and indicated to us that he may be willing to do so.

It's negative equity. The buyer doesn't pay it. The value of the club, which can be independently asessed as part of due diligence, is all that matters.

The powers that be would be much more likely to accept a transitional arrangement.

The Trust I propose would only buy into the club on the basis of shared ownership and shared decision making through a new joint board. You dont know if this is something he is open to until you ask.

Three years ago, before talks fell through, he said in principle he was open to any type of deal. Ask again. Can't hurt.

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Ok  HOTB, obviously you have the previous contacts with C.H. And what did or did not transpire.  From other comments on this forum,  there seems to be  enough people with enough passion and feeling forORLFC to possibly form a body of supporters willing to move this idea forward.  I would think that at a very early stage, input fromRugby Oldham would be a must.

With this in mind, and I mean. - the formation of a truly supporters owned and run club.— even if it means over a period of say, Five years or more,  how many would be willing to come forward and seriously commit themselves to supporting this proposal. Which would include a financial commitment and a lot of working meetings as things progress along with many other tasks.

For all on the forum...... if you feel you can commit, and any other supporter not on this forum,  by word of mouth, LETS HEAR FROM YOU...  let’s see how many replies we get, we must start somewhere. Why not here.

 

 

 

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My own personal understanding* *(purely speculative) of the apparent "Impasse" is that Chris can do without the talking shop and actually was hoping for something more like Cash investment from interested groups/fans.

The state of the financials suggests that.                  

 and regardless there is no way to assure that a committee would bring success as the club is crying out for investment and now piggybacking on the investment of a local amateur football team. (how that came about little short of astonishing to me as I read the MEN)

Hes ran things for a long time now, I can now understand better the ongoing situation...Hes a survivor, goodness knows what lengths he has gone to to carry/drag the club this far.

Nor how many have been affected one way or another by his ways of doing business.

I wouldnt want the job, my conscience and personal integrity are too valuable.

But if you do fancy it...put your money where your mouth is...for that is what it will take and only Rugby Oldham as far as I know has offered.... with no guarantees about anything, even a peep at the accounts...

No...and neither would I! (geddit?)

 

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until all debts are paid up and off the books only lunatics would put monies into the club.what is to stop ch taking the monies  himself then putting in a winding up order  for the alleged monies owed to him by the club ?

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5 hours ago, HomeOfTheTubularBandage said:

What do you mean he can do without the talking shop?

That's it, he wants a bag of cash without sharing ownership and without his own performance being scrutinised.

Doesn't happen. Wont happen. If you want cash then you have to give something of value in return.

I think he means, he will talk to people with cash on the table, but not to fans groups with only ideas (at that time).

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With the best, thats a good bit of PR, though I would say the Bedford team, theres, like, you know, 13 blokes who can get together at the weekend to have a game together, which doesnt point to expansion of the game. Point, yeah go on!

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I have come round to thinking that without knowing it he`s done us a favour...do any one of you want all the sheer stress of a role at ORLFC at a time when RL as a whole is metamorphosising into elite/others (rather like football). with so many clubs on the edge of the abyss, and less and less participation in the nation, and the RFL`s make it up as we go along for the lower leagues, (oxford etc...)  Chris would still be a part of it ...out of necessity as I don`t think any of us have the werewithal  (initially) on any framework of shared ownership/buyout/takeover.

As has been said on here before...Use it before you lose it...Im hauling down my protest flag...Two years now, After all R***dale M*****ld and S********th Ran***s just aint the same...I will go to Whitebank, its handy and I like the proximity. hopefully he will use my gate money to pay off a little of any liabilities.

I laughed aloud when one witty wag on here suggested that CH was , and I quote" back in his comfort zone" I knew what was meant...back to winning at Whitebank...all he has to sort really!

 

One day someone may have to "pick up the pieces" cos when this toy gets thrown it will be broken...

 

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In the previous thread a few weeks ago on this topic myself and others (R34 etc) asked for a link or an attachment to join Rugby Oldham.

However as I am aware that has yet to happen (apologies if it has), ironically it was requested after RO took offence at someone questioning what they did and their slow response to questions.

Can I therefore request the link again 

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There was a link to the form mate. I have it ready to go but ain't sent it off yet due to being away,probs pop mine in the post to RO tomorrow.Just tap the blue link and it downloads as a PDF.

On 13/10/2017 at 9:49 AM, geoffcooke said:

Rugby Oldham application form as requested.

Twitter feed is:-    @RugbyOldhamSupp               this is largely used to promote games at all levels in Oldham rather than for comment

Re further discussion prompted by HOTTB Rugby Oldham's first prerequisite to talks is access to financial information and no progress can be made without this. How many of you would buy a house without knowing the price?

Criticise RO all you like but we won't pour money down a black hole.

RO App form.pdf

 

Edited by roughyed34
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7 hours ago, tandle said:

what is to stop ch taking the monies  himself then putting in a winding up order  for the alleged monies owed to him by the club ?

Err not giving the club the money until a contract is signed and a new board formed? A board on which he is only one member. A club capital bank account requiring multiple board signatories? A constitution that states one board member can't wind up the club? An agreement whereby he writes off some of the debt and there is a re-payment agreement over many years flr the remainder (still much better than any chance he currently has of getting his money back)?

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