Kristian Woolf insists GB defeats not reflection on Super League

[The Future is League]

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/kristian-woolf-insists-great-britain-20917640

[Gooleboy]

I wonder if he would be saying the same if he wasn't coming over to coach St Helens?

[Rupert Prince]

1 hour ago, Gooleboy said:

I wonder if he would be saying the same if he wasn't coming over to coach St Helens?

He will be believing it is be ends up 10 points behind Wigan on 2nd place at the end of the season.

[The Future is League]

3 hours ago, Gooleboy said:

I wonder if he would be saying the same if he wasn't coming over to coach St Helens?

 

2 hours ago, Rupert Prince said:

He will be believing it is be ends up 10 points behind Wigan on 2nd place at the end of the season.

What he has done with Tonga suggests that Saints again will be the team next season

[Harry Stottle]

12 minutes ago, Celt said:

The guy has obviously done a great job with Tonga, so it is tough to criticise him.

However, to me, SuperLeague last season was the weakest it has ever been. The product on the pitch some weeks was appalling. Specifically - passing from dummy half was poor across the league, tackling (tackle tech, or simply a desire to defend) was shocking across several teams; and collective defence (line speed, organisation etc) was visibly well behind the NRL level.

Some teams last season were IMO well below the standards we should expect from any professional team. I say this as a Warrington fan... The fact that my team couldn't make the Grand Final is extremely poor i feel, as they and Saints looked miles ahead of everyone early in the season. Saints were IMO light years ahead of everybody across the whole season, and worthy winners.

I think if players are playing at that level each week against the likes of hudds, hull kr etc, then no wonder they get absolutely monstered whenever they face guys who are hardened up by NRL level intensity.

'Great Britain's performance against PNG (with their Champ/French/NSW cup players etc) was disgraceful, but the other results were no real surprise.

Woolf for me, is talking it up because he will be working in SuperLeague, but sadly the league is really miles off where it should be.

Totally agree, it has been ebbing away in quality for a few seasons now, and I believe you are spot on with your reference to there not being enough intensity.

[hunsletgreenandgold]

Personally I struggle to make any link between the woeful GB performances and the level SL may or may not be at. Especially when you consider literally half of the team played NRL last season......

In trying to make a defence for SL and it's players, there's no disputing it doesn't have the same intensity week in week out that NRL has, but then that's hardly surprising considering most teams will play around 10 games a season more in SL. The first step to closing the gap is decreasing number of games IMO.  

Edited November 20, 2019 by hunsletgreenandgold

[southwalesrabbitoh]

I agree with K Woolfe, there wasn't much riding on the tour, the players weren't putting their bodies on the line, lacked intensity, you play off the back of that then, as you know. 

[Southerner80]

1 hour ago, hunsletgreenandgold said:

Personally I struggle to make any link between the woeful GB performances and the level SL may or may not be at. Especially when you consider literally half of the team played NRL last season......

In trying to make a defence for SL and it's players, there's no disputing it doesn't have the same intensity week in week out that NRL has, but then that's hardly surprising considering most teams will around play10 games a season more in SL. The first step to closing the gap is decreasing number of games IMO.  

Its a real dilemma. The top NRL talent plays up to  25-28 games or so a club season including SOO .

The top SL talent would play up to 37 games assuming make the GF and the CCF. 

That's a big difference in games. 

It does take it out of the players as the game is tougher than ever. 

A SL of 27 regular rounds including Magic would be a good place to start. Ideally imo it would be 23 games but you know most clubs won't go for that as there's the general feeling that 13 home games is minimum they can work with. Nor would Sky be likely to be happy about less rounds. 

 

Edited November 20, 2019 by Southerner80

[hunsletgreenandgold]

7 minutes ago, Southerner80 said:

Its a real dilemma. The top NRL talent plays up to  25-28 games or so a club season including SOO .

The top SL talent would play up to 37 games assuming make the GF and the CCF. 

That's a big difference in games. 

It does take it out of the players as the game is tougher than ever. 

A SL of 27 regular rounds including Magic would be a good place to start. Ideally imo it would be 23 games but you know most clubs won't go for that as there's the general feeling that 13 home games is minimum they can work with. Nor would Sky be likely to be happy about less rounds. 

 

Agree with all of that and I think you're already eluding to what I believe to be the solution as well - 14 teams. 

[Southerner80]

4 minutes ago, hunsletgreenandgold said:

Agree with all of that and I think you're already eluding to what I believe to be the solution as well - 14 teams. 

Thanks, I feel 14 teams and guarantee TWP and Les Dracs and TO their places with 11 English teams. This may help increase the value of the rights ie that the Foreign networks get guaranteed involvement. 

The bottom English team can go down if the system wants P and R. As they can't place any higher than 11th anyway. 

[Les Tonks Sidestep]

2 minutes ago, Southerner80 said:

Thanks, I feel 14 teams and guarantee TWP and Les Dracs and TO their places with 11 English teams. This may help increase the value of the rights ie that the Foreign networks get guaranteed involvement. 

The bottom English team can go down if the system wants P and R. As they can't place any higher than 11th anyway. 

So going to 14 clubs will somehow magically produce another 100-200+ players of the standard required to ensure everyone is at the same level as the top 1-2 clubs from last season?

[Southerner80]

14 minutes ago, Les Tonks Sidestep said:

So going to 14 clubs will somehow magically produce another 100-200+ players of the standard required to ensure everyone is at the same level as the top 1-2 clubs from last season?

I don't feel it will, however I don't feel it will lower the standard particularly either.

It would also give the overseas clubs more of a chance to raise TV money if their participation was guaranteed, which in turn, could increase income into the SL. 

Edited November 20, 2019 by Southerner80

[BroncoFan]

5 of the 6 starting forward pack were NRL players and before Ryan Hall was injured more than half the 13 were NRL players. They were dominated by players who play at Fev Rovers, Barrow & Doncaster, Catalan & Leeds. So how does SL cop all the criticism especially at the GB coach was another NRL superman. In over 50 years I’ve never seen worse coaching decisions.

[westside]

4 minutes ago, Emosi Koloto said:

5 of the 6 starting forward pack were NRL players and before Ryan Hall was injured more than half the 13 were NRL players. They were dominated by players who play at Fev Rovers, Barrow & Doncaster, Catalan & Leeds. So how does SL cop all the criticism especially at the GB coach was another NRL superman. In over 50 years I’ve never seen worse coaching decisions.

Exactly. I made the same point a few days ago. It’s coaching/selections mainly. Guys out of position, out of form players etc. It’s pretty clear that Bennett doesn’t really follow SL.

[Eddie]

1 hour ago, Emosi Koloto said:

5 of the 6 starting forward pack were NRL players and before Ryan Hall was injured more than half the 13 were NRL players. They were dominated by players who play at Fev Rovers, Barrow & Doncaster, Catalan & Leeds. So how does SL cop all the criticism especially at the GB coach was another NRL superman. In over 50 years I’ve never seen worse coaching decisions.

Exactly, if anything Woolfe should have been talking about how GB’s abject performances show how poor the NRL is! 

[Rupert Prince]

19 hours ago, Celt said:

The guy has obviously done a great job with Tonga, so it is tough to criticise him.

However, to me, SuperLeague last season was the weakest it has ever been. The product on the pitch some weeks was appalling. Specifically - passing from dummy half was poor across the league, tackling (tackle tech, or simply a desire to defend) was shocking across several teams; and collective defence (line speed, organisation etc) was visibly well behind the NRL level.

Some teams last season were IMO well below the standards we should expect from any professional team. I say this as a Warrington fan... The fact that my team couldn't make the Grand Final is extremely poor i feel, as they and Saints looked miles ahead of everyone early in the season. Saints were IMO light years ahead of everybody across the whole season, and worthy winners.

I think if players are playing at that level each week against the likes of hudds, hull kr etc, then no wonder they get absolutely monstered whenever they face guys who are hardened up by NRL level intensity.

'Great Britain's performance against PNG (with their Champ/French/NSW cup players etc) was disgraceful, but the other results were no real surprise.

Woolf for me, is talking it up because he will be working in SuperLeague, but sadly the league is really miles off where it should be.

Frankly I agree.  And that's why it's ridiculous to criticise Bennett.   That's not to say that Bennett can be criticised as can any coach.   However I believe our players have underperformed, as has the League in general.  What I also question is how it is we get so many injuries. 

[MatthewWoody]

14 hours ago, westside said:

Exactly. I made the same point a few days ago. It’s coaching/selections mainly. Guys out of position, out of form players etc. It’s pretty clear that Bennett doesn’t really follow SL.

And still chose the Champions' fullback and the SL man of steel

[southwalesrabbitoh]

18 hours ago, Southerner80 said:

Its a real dilemma. The top NRL talent plays up to  25-28 games or so a club season including SOO .

The top SL talent would play up to 37 games assuming make the GF and the CCF. 

That's a big difference in games. 

It does take it out of the players as the game is tougher than ever. 

A SL of 27 regular rounds including Magic would be a good place to start. Ideally imo it would be 23 games but you know most clubs won't go for that as there's the general feeling that 13 home games is minimum they can work with. Nor would Sky be likely to be happy about less rounds. 

 

It was about their attitude, the players wanted the season over, as in the Aussie v Tonga match, it's highly unlikely Tonga would have beaten the 'Roos if it had been in an important WC match. 

[DoubleD]

2 minutes ago, MatthewWoody said:

And still chose the Champions' fullback and the SL man of steel

Because they used to play in NRL

[MatthewWoody]

Just now, DoubleD said:

Because they used to play in NRL

Or because they're very good players who have been performing very well in 2019.

[westside]

9 hours ago, MatthewWoody said:

And still chose the Champions' fullback and the SL man of steel

And still picked Ryan Hall over Regan Grace, six halfbacks and two wingers (who were both out of form), a second row at center, a stand off on the wing etc.

Sinfield shares some of the blame but ultimately it’s Bennett’s call and he didn’t make the right one.

[MatthewWoody]

20 minutes ago, westside said:

And still picked Ryan Hall over Regan Grace, six halfbacks and two wingers (who were both out of form), a second row at center, a stand off on the wing etc.

Sinfield shares some of the blame but ultimately it’s Bennett’s call and he didn’t make the right one.

Not saying WB was right, but I find it hard to believe an Int coach, who is actually doing his job, doesn't follow games.

Edited November 21, 2019 by MatthewWoody

[westside]

Working full time for a club on the other side of the world and picking lots of players from that competition I don’t find it hard to believe. For the SL guys he probably saw a little bit of it and relied on advice from selectors/assistants. Their next coach should be based there.