Wolves sign Josh McGuire

[StandOffHalf]

I don't think he used those words though. My guess would be a six letter word beginning with R or a seven letter word beginning with S.

[Dunbar]

I certainly expected to see a player who played on the edge and would run the risk of falling foul of the disciplinary panel. 

But I didn't expect to see potentially two long bans for unacceptable language.  Is that something he was pinged for in the Australian game does anyone know?

[David Shepherd]

10 minutes ago, StandOffHalf said:

I don't think he used those words though. My guess would be a six letter word beginning with R or a seven letter word beginning with S.

Are we really giving out lengthy bans for hurty words like this, said in the heat of battle?

Something very wrong when this kind of thing attracts a longer ban than physical violence. 

I think a substantial fine, coupled with some community service / education would be a more appropriate punishment.

 

 

[RP London]

6 minutes ago, David Shepherd said:

Are we really giving out lengthy bans for hurty words like this, said in the heat of battle?

Something very wrong when this kind of thing attracts a longer ban than physical violence. 

I think a substantial fine, coupled with some community service / education would be a more appropriate punishment.

 

 

I know this is a controversial stand point but he could just, you know, stop saying them.. thats the easiest way to stop the bans. 

Hefty bans are there to just stop behaviour that is easy to stop, same with racist stuff..

Physical violence should be treated more harshly I agree but that doesnt mean these bans are wrong..

Look at all the LDRL rugby that was going on over the weekend on the pitch, look at the fun and enjoyment they are having playing the game on the main pitch and watching it inbetween... why should they be made to feel less welcome just become some utter gob**** thinks its ok to use their disability as an insult to someone else?

[StandOffHalf]

18 minutes ago, David Shepherd said:

Are we really giving out lengthy bans for hurty words like this, said in the heat of battle?

Something very wrong when this kind of thing attracts a longer ban than physical violence. 

I think a substantial fine, coupled with some community service / education would be a more appropriate punishment.

 

 

I agree, David.

[David Shepherd]

4 minutes ago, RP London said:

I know this is a controversial stand point but he could just, you know, stop saying them.. thats the easiest way to stop the bans. 

Hefty bans are there to just stop behaviour that is easy to stop, same with racist stuff..

Physical violence should be treated more harshly I agree but that doesnt mean these bans are wrong..

Look at all the LDRL rugby that was going on over the weekend on the pitch, look at the fun and enjoyment they are having playing the game on the main pitch and watching it inbetween... why should they be made to feel less welcome just become some utter gob**** thinks its ok to use their disability as an insult to someone else?

I get that RP and agree to an extent. The thing is though, the R word and the S word are in common use out in society and their usual use is not directing hate towards a particular section of society.  They're throwaway playground insults and have been for as long as I remember.

Does that make it acceptable language? - no, that's why I say a fine and service in the community or some form of education is more appropriate as a punishment.

[Dave T]

2 hours ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

I agree, a bit more worrying is player's running after officials saying players have said inappropriate words to them. It's different if officials hear those comments but regardless if McGuire is a liability (and not much of a loss on the field) if this becomes the normal way for player's to react teams will need bigger squads and the amateur game will cease to exist.

Using some words has always been punished heavily for a while now. I don't believe it has led to bigger squads. 

The solution is not bigger squads, it is players behaving. 

[Dave T]

8 minutes ago, David Shepherd said:

I get that RP and agree to an extent. The thing is though, the R word and the S word are in common use out in society and their usual use is not directing hate towards a particular section of society.  They're throwaway playground insults and have been for as long as I remember.

Does that make it acceptable language? - no, that's why I say a fine and service in the community or some form of education is more appropriate as a punishment.

You've acknowledged it isn't acceptable, despite downplaying it as playground insults. 

The game has decided it isn't acceptable, and despite 6+ match bans, some players still can't help themselves. Thankfully the vast vast majority seem able to not use these offensive terms. 

[ELBOWSEYE]

2 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Using some words has always been punished heavily for a while now. I don't believe it has led to bigger squads. 

The solution is not bigger squads, it is players behaving. 

Dave what about player's running to officials to complain, that's a worrying trend.

[Dave T]

21 minutes ago, RP London said:

I know this is a controversial stand point but he could just, you know, stop saying them.. thats the easiest way to stop the bans. 

Hefty bans are there to just stop behaviour that is easy to stop, same with racist stuff..

Physical violence should be treated more harshly I agree but that doesnt mean these bans are wrong..

Look at all the LDRL rugby that was going on over the weekend on the pitch, look at the fun and enjoyment they are having playing the game on the main pitch and watching it inbetween... why should they be made to feel less welcome just become some utter gob**** thinks its ok to use their disability as an insult to someone else?

Wire as a club have been at the forefront of PDRL and LDRL, yet in recent years our head coach has used the phrase "m*** strength", and a star signing has been banned for calling a player a "s******", and he now faces another ban. That jars with me a lot. 

I have no idea what Mcguire is meant to have said this time, iirc it is against Charnley, who gets a lot of unnacceptable stick, so this may be a race thing. 

[Dave T]

1 minute ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

Dave what about player's running to officials to complain, that's a worrying trend.

I think the problem is the offenders rather than those reporting offences. 

We've seen players making allegations around things for years. 

[Dunbar]

12 hours ago, Ragingbull said:

I did warn you all last July exactly what would happen with Josh McGuire. Was always going to happen. 

Has been an absolute liability for years now

You certainly get points for your prediction that McGuire was going to be a disciplinary liability. 

Of course you lose those points by self quoting and congratulating yourself.

But you come out even overall. 

[RP London]

7 minutes ago, David Shepherd said:

I get that RP and agree to an extent. The thing is though, the R word and the S word are in common use out in society and their usual use is not directing hate towards a particular section of society.  They're throwaway playground insults and have been for as long as I remember.

Does that make it acceptable language? - no, that's why I say a fine and service in the community or some form of education is more appropriate as a punishment.

That is the same "excuse" as was used for other language that is now unacceptable, and rightly so. If they are so throwaway then just stop using them, if they are so throwaway then just stop using them.. 

I know what you are saying because in the past and in the playground I have used them.. however, I am an adult now and times have moved on and I understand that, therefore I am able to just not use them. I have played and been in the "heat of battle" and given my fair share of abuse and received it.. I have managed to do it without being racist or use this sort of language and in all my time (through the late 90s and 2000s up to about 2013 at senior rugby) i remember maybe 1 or two instances where i have ever heard it used on the pitch... if amateurs can manage it then why can pros not just stop using it, the fact these bans stick out like a sore thumb means that most can BTW it just the odd knucklehead

a massive ban is a lesson to just stop using it.. all the other stuff you mention he should also have to do but the ban is fine.. it is rarely needed but, and this is very important, it shows we are serious and shows to that section of the community that is vulnerable that "we have your back" and I think that is a massivly important message. 

[RP London]

4 minutes ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

Dave what about player's running to officials to complain, that's a worrying trend.

I'm not the biggest fan of this type of thing but equally if its been said and the ref doesnt hear it then I dont have a massive issue with it being brought up as its still unacceptable language, same when you have players reporting bites. Its hard for the ref to go back and deal with it but I dont see a major issue, in the past the player would have simply taken the action himself and dealt with it but with all the cameras your getting a red card for that and a hefty ban yourself and I dont think thats right either. 

[StandOffHalf]

1 hour ago, Dunbar said:

I certainly expected to see a player who played on the edge and would run the risk of falling foul of the disciplinary panel. 

But I didn't expect to see potentially two long bans for unacceptable language.  Is that something he was pinged for in the Australian game does anyone know?

He could probably get away with it in the NRL. There is more of a culture of keeping stuff on the field between players.

[ELBOWSEYE]

1 minute ago, Dave T said:

I think the problem is the offenders rather than those reporting offences. 

We've seen players making allegations around things for years. 

Sorry Dave I remember Charnley laughing at wire fans singing he was "gypsy" when he played for Wigan but now he runs to referees to complain, there seems to be an agenda at Leigh with McGuire.

[RP London]

7 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Wire as a club have been at the forefront of PDRL and LDRL, yet in recent years our head coach has used the phrase "m*** strength", and a star signing has been banned for calling a player a "s******", and he now faces another ban. That jars with me a lot. 

I have no idea what Mcguire is meant to have said this time, iirc it is against Charnley, who gets a lot of unnacceptable stick, so this may be a race thing. 

while I accept there may be a cultural thing in this, its not like having aussies over is a new phenomenon and we've not really seen or heard of this being common language used by the others that have come over. I think it may be a mix of cultural hitting arrogance/stupidity that it isn't acceptable here so you change your behaviour/language. 

[Dave T]

6 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

You certainly get points for your prediction that McGuire was going to be a disciplinary liability. 

Of course you lose those points by self quoting and congratulating yourself.

But you come out even overall. 

I'd have been impressed with RaginBull's predictions if they'd have predicted these type of offences, but suggesting that the most banned player in NRL history would have disciplinary issues isn't overly impressive! 

However in reality, I'm not sure he has done much of note in terms of actual Rugby on the field, good or bad. 

[Dave T]

2 minutes ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

Sorry Dave I remember Charnley laughing at wire fans singing he was "gypsy" when he played for Wigan but now he runs to referees to complain, there seems to be an agenda at Leigh with McGuire.

I have no sympathy, nor offer any defence for Mcguire's alleged actions. Probably not too much more to it than that. 

[RP London]

1 minute ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

Sorry Dave I remember Charnley laughing at wire fans singing he was "gypsy" when he played for Wigan but now he runs to referees to complain, there seems to be an agenda at Leigh with McGuire.

smoke and fire though... what surprised me when it came out was that McGuire just didnt have a game of playing bloody hard but keeping his nose very clean after the last time... knowing that they may try to wind you up you have to be more clever than that surely..

[Dave T]

2 minutes ago, RP London said:

while I accept there may be a cultural thing in this, its not like having aussies over is a new phenomenon and we've not really seen or heard of this being common language used by the others that have come over. I think it may be a mix of cultural hitting arrogance/stupidity that it isn't acceptable here so you change your behaviour/language. 

The fact this is so rare shows where the issue is. 

[Spidey]

5 hours ago, StandOffHalf said:

Am I the only one who finds the length of bans for able-ist language a bit much? Heat of the moment stuff, with terms that have entered common parlance.

McGuire has admitted that the first one was nasty and that it was an exchange of words. That's the sort of thing that I would prefer to see left on the field. Shake hands (or not), move on.

No. If players are this stupid they deserve everything they get. 

[Spidey]

5 minutes ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

Sorry Dave I remember Charnley laughing at wire fans singing he was "gypsy" when he played for Wigan but now he runs to referees to complain, there seems to be an agenda at Leigh with McGuire.

The slur was apparently about his son - maybe that’s why he reacted differently 

[Saint Toppy]

1 hour ago, StandOffHalf said:

Ableism is discrimination and social prejudice against people with disabilities. Ableist language refers to individual words and phrases (like “dumb” or “crazy”) as well as metaphors or expressions (such as “emotionally crippled”) that perpetuate negative stereotypes about people with disabilities.

 

I think that term describes McGuire perfectly - Is there a dumber player in SL  

[StandOffHalf]

5 minutes ago, Saint Toppy said:

I think that term describes McGuire perfectly - Is there a dumber player in SL  

7-day ban for you Toppy, haahaa...